I still think map drops are fine - boost drops and good players can do 79++ all day long
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You guys are still ignoring what I consider the fundamental problems with your arguments.
1) Defend why the sustain point should be 78-79 rather than 75-76. As far as I can tell it's because you think you deserve to progress into the 90s rather than be stuck around 88. If it really makes that much of a difference for your build, then shouldn't you be willing to pay for extra passives just as you would for better gear? 2) Higher maps aren't necessarily more difficult than lower maps. Especially since it's correct to roll higher content more vs. just vaal lower maps. A single damage mod does more than increasing monster level from 77 to 82. " You can progress in maps. Every monster in a 80 map can drop a 80 map, whereas only the boss of a 78 can drop a 80. Thus running a higher map gives you much better probability of increasing your pool level compared to running a lower map. It's just not guaranteed, and the maps are consumed. That's how maps retain value in standard even though uniques drop in value over time. It's the best way this game has for dealing with inflation, and why standard isn't completely stale. All my builds /view-thread/1430399
T14 'real' clearspeed challenge /1642265 |
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" How are you rolling your 77/78 pool? Also, how many 77/78 in 2.0 do you estimate you've run? |
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" The reason for this is quite simple. GGG defined new Tier-levels in maps. 78 is a mid-tier map. There is really no reason to not be able to sustain them. They aren't the really heavy stuff, which starts with 79. Being able to at least sustain the maps that provide entry to the highest tier of maps would be quite reasonable. And the thing is... I don't want harder maps to level faster. I want harder maps to challange me. And a higher level is currently the greatest increase in difficulty. The question why did they decide to decrease the sustainability that much? It was reasonable to sustain 76 before the patch, which is the equal to 78 now. With my summoner I decided to not take "shortcuts" on maps now and just see how fast I can climb up without buying a single map. And I likely end up with lvl20 gems before even reaching map-level 76. Another question in this case is, if they don't want us to get to the high maps (and most players will never see core, colloseum or abyss... why make them? |
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To me, you sound a lot like the guys in the United States House of Representatives Committee on Science, Space and Technology (see video here). You are in what I can only assume to be willingly and deliberately ignoring what I and others write.
Yet you are accusing me/us of ignoring fundamental problems with our arguments? " Defense: We want to play the content in this game and content should not be gated behind RNG (and never has been in any game I have played). I am already 91, I do not urge to level any further, as I have stated over and over and over again. Will this reach your brain if I write it in capital or bold? If yes, I can do that. Making 78-79 sustainable while still keeping 80+ unsustainable will make it possible to play all the content in the game eventually, with just running lower-level maps. 79s can drop 81s, which could drop 82s. Unlikely, but might happen. 75s can drop 77s which can drop 79s which can drop 81s which can drop 82s. The likelihood of ever getting there is just extremely low. Design the system right and players are not running 82s any more (if for whatever absurd reason you really really REALLY don't want your players to play the content you designed for them - seems a bit schizophrenic to me), but at least everyone could run that content every once in a while. " Content. We want to play the content that was designed for us. " The result if spending 2 exalt for a lvl 80 map is most likely that after running it I am back at a maximum of a 77 or less map. How is that progress? There is not even a single 81+ map I could buy right now (buyout + online search on poe.trade). Progress = at the end you have more than what you are started with. Impossible in higher-level maps, especially when not being able to afford Zana mods because playing single player. Remove Horticrafting station storage limit.
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" For the same reason they make a "Shavronne's Wrappings" and make it drop %0.000000000001 of the time. So you have the HOPE of one day attaining it and in the mean time continue to get you to buy stash tabs and weapon effects. |
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" Because economy. You WANT to do those high level maps. You TRY to do those high level maps. The goal is to keep you TRYING for as long as possible. The longer you are playing the game, the more likely you are to spend money. The argument is if high level maps were easy to get to, you would "burn out" on the game quicker. Thus, you would not play as long. If you aren't playing the game, you have no reason to spend money. <3 Free Tibet <3
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" The flaw in that argument is, unfortunately for GGG, if you burn out on facerolling content that is much lower than your ability then the same thing happens. Last edited by Shinare#4581 on Aug 7, 2015, 6:04:43 PM
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char1983 wrote
" 1) content is always gated by RNG, if not directly then indirectly. In PoE a shortcut exist's to that RNG(trading) which allows you to bypass content at lightning speeds. I am talking about gear acquisition here, not buying maps. Go and do a char self-found and then chain the maps and see how long you are forced to run low level maps just because of "the danger be realzz realzz". Further more you are allowed to tackle the content, just at a price. GGG is not saying "you can do 80+ maps and this dude right here --> can not" They are making sure that people put in the effort before getting there. One way or another. We are all treated equally in PoE, remember that. Some persist and reach their desired goals, others do not. It is that simple. Also it appears people really have no clue of the experience penalty when it comes to 78+ maps and how huge this is compared to the old system. 2) That's a self defeating statement. The content is there, available to all players who put in the effort. Clearly, it was not designed for you since you are not getting there. Maybe if you persist and endure or tackle the issue of mapping differently, things might change. Like i said before, content is gated for all players equally, yet some people are getting there. 3) so you don't want to risk it? Then progression will stall. Also nobody can claim there is no "progression". You might lose the map and get no maps in return, however there is always progression. Your xp bar get's filled and you get high item level loot. You cannot run any maps "without progression" since all maps grant experience to a character. Not building up your map pool =/= non-progression Anyway have fun with it all. GGG achieved what they set out to do and things are highly unlikely to change any time soon. Peace, -Boem- Freedom is not worth having if it does not include the freedom to make mistakes
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" Flaw is a strong word. Argument implies that there is another side to the situation. You certainly are seeing both sides of the argument. Which side will make players stay longer? Depends on each individual I would assume. <3 Free Tibet <3
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The problem is: It is not working.
For Shavronne's Wrappings, if you desire them, or any other item in the game, you make progress. Every day when you log out, you have a bit more currency than before. Even if nothing useful drops, you are stacking lower orbs like Alterations and such. Eventually, you can buy what you desired. If I wanted to make a character that requires a Shavs, and the only way to get it would be that it drops to me, I would probably not play. But the map system is even worse than hoping for a Shavs to drop. While if you wait for the Shavs to drop, you are at least not making steps backwards, that is exactly what happens with the map system. You log in with 10 77 maps and log out with 5. That sucks, it is frustrating and makes you not even try any more. At least, I no longer try. I wait for a bit and see if they fix the map system in some way, and if not, do something else - either within PoE, or outside of it. Remove Horticrafting station storage limit. Last edited by Char1983#2680 on Aug 7, 2015, 6:24:29 PM
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