Mechanics thread

"

Mark_GGG wrote:

If you would convert more than 100% of a damage type to other damages, you only convert 100%. All conversion that doesn't come from skills is scaled until only 100% is being converted. So Lightning Strike or other such skill will convert it's full 50%, and all the other conversion will scale down to fit in the other 50%

does game have preference on how it shrinks the non skill converting?

"

soul4hdwn wrote:

"

Mark_GGG wrote:

If you would convert more than 100% of a damage type to other damages, you only convert 100%. All conversion that doesn't come from skills is scaled until only 100% is being converted. So Lightning Strike or other such skill will convert it's full 50%, and all the other conversion will scale down to fit in the other 50%

does game have preference on how it shrinks the non skill converting?

Mark can correct me if I am wrong.

Let's say you have 50% fire damage conversion from a skill.
25% physical to frost from gloves
25% physical to chaos from bow
50% physical to fire from quiver.

First, you have the skill that removes 50% from that and leaves you with 50% conversion for the rest.

The rest total up for 100% but you only have 50% remaining, this should mean that all the values are halved to fit the 100% conversion cap.

Meaning

75% converted to fire damage (50% from skill and 25% from quiver)
12,5% converted to frost damage (gloves)
12,5% converted to chaos damage (bow)

Regarding the de-randomization of evasion, I find myself repeatedly wondering exactly how it works. Mark told us that above 50% evasion, if a monster hits us, that same monster's next attack is guaranteed to miss.

I find myself wondering if the 50% is just an arbitrary breakpoint that forces the next swing to be a miss? Or if there is more to this mechanic?

If it's an arbitrary breakpoint, then hitting that magic 50% adds a tremendous amount of defense, out of thin air. I'm wondering if someone could tell us more?

Scenario: I have exactly 50% evade.
edit: my math was based on bad assumptions. trying again:
P1: Hit/Miss - 0.5*1.0 - 50% probability, 50% avoidance (50% damage remains).
P2: Miss/Hit/Miss - 0.5*0.5*1.0 - 25% probability, 66.7% avoidance (33.3% damage remains).
P3: Miss/Miss/Hit/Miss - 0.5^3 - 12.5% probability, 75% avoidance (25% damage remains).
P4: Missx3/Hit/Miss - 0.5^4 - 6.25% probability, 80% avoidance (20% damage remains).
P5: Call the last 6.25% 83.3% avoidance (remaining: 16.6%), recursive process has to end somewhere.

I think this can just be figured as a weighted average of probabilities, though something is tugging at my mind saying that's wrong. Anyway, doing a weighted average would suggest 50% evasion provides around 60% avoidance. If it's nothing but a breakpoint, 49.9% evasion still only provides 49.9% avoidance. Big jump.

Can Acrobatic+4 dodge Resolute Technique ?

"

Zakaluka wrote:

Regarding the de-randomization of evasion, I find myself repeatedly wondering exactly how it works. Mark told us that above 50% evasion, if a monster hits us, that same monster's next attack is guaranteed to miss.

I find myself wondering if the 50% is just an arbitrary breakpoint that forces the next swing to be a miss? Or if there is more to this mechanic?

If it's an arbitrary breakpoint, then hitting that magic 50% adds a tremendous amount of defense, out of thin air. I'm wondering if someone could tell us more?

Scenario: I have exactly 50% evade.
edit: my math was based on bad assumptions. trying again:
P1: Hit/Miss - 0.5*1.0 - 50% probability, 50% avoidance (50% damage remains).
P2: Miss/Hit/Miss - 0.5*0.5*1.0 - 25% probability, 66.7% avoidance (33.3% damage remains).
P3: Miss/Miss/Hit/Miss - 0.5^3 - 12.5% probability, 75% avoidance (25% damage remains).
P4: Missx3/Hit/Miss - 0.5^4 - 6.25% probability, 80% avoidance (20% damage remains).
P5: Call the last 6.25% 83.3% avoidance (remaining: 16.6%), recursive process has to end somewhere.

I think this can just be figured as a weighted average of probabilities, though something is tugging at my mind saying that's wrong. Anyway, doing a weighted average would suggest 50% evasion provides around 60% avoidance. If it's nothing but a breakpoint, 49.9% evasion still only provides 49.9% avoidance. Big jump.

(disclaimer, I may be a off in the specifics, but should still be able to explain the non-randomness of the system well enough)
Lets say for example you have 30% evasion. This means you have a 70% chance to get hit. With normal evasion plan, a 1-100 is rolled for every attack, and every roll above 30 hits you. On average, you should still only get hit 70% of the time, but RNG will mean spikes of low rolls or high rolls.
On the modified evasion plan, only the first attack gets rolled 1-100, let's say for example a 20 is rolled, and the attack misses. For the next attack, rather than doing another completely random roll, your 30% chance to evade gets added to that 20, for a new "roll" of 50, meaning hit. The next attack gets 30 added again for a new "roll" of 80, also a hit. The next attack has 30 added for 110, which then goes back around to being just 10, which below your 30 threshold and therefore another miss and a miss, the next attack 40=hit. Shown in an easier way:
1st attack 20=miss
2nd attack 50=hit
3rd attack 80=hit
4th attack 10=miss
5th attack 40=hit
6th attack 70=hit
7th attack 100=hit
8th attack 30=miss
9th attack 60=hit
10th attack 90=hit

So from this system, you're still getting you're average 3 out of 10 attacks missed, but they're spread out evenly over time. The reason why 50% evasion means every other attack misses is because
20=miss
70=hit
20=miss
70=hit
etc.

If for example you had 70% evasion, you'd get at least 2 sometimes 3 misses in a row between each hit
20=miss
90=hit
60=miss
30=miss
100=hit
70=miss
40=miss
10=miss
80=hit

So back to the main premise, that evasion is now only somewhat random, the first hit will be random then the following hits *should* follow a predictable pattern of missing/hitting based on your evasion chance. NOT TRUE> Keep in mind that this is calculated individually for each monster with a large group of monsters, they can all hit if you get unlucky, but no single monster will get a long string of all hits.<NOT TRUE (thanks to Mark for correcting me)

"

Revire wrote:

Can Acrobatic+4 dodge Resolute Technique ?

Yes, resolute technique only removes hit/evasion from the equation, Dodge from acrobatics is calculated separately from that, like how block is separate.

"

Mark_GGG wrote:

"

Aplier wrote:

Keep in mind that this is calculated individually for each monster with a large group of monsters, they can all hit if you get unlucky, but no single monster will get a long string of all hits.

No, it's not, and I have no idea where people are getting this idea from? it's entirely in your character, reagardless of where the hits are coming from. The same mosnter can hit you multiple consecutive times if the others "use up" the misses.

A GGG member actually said it, I forgot who and in which thread though.

"

Mark_GGG wrote:

"

Aplier wrote:

Keep in mind that this is calculated individually for each monster with a large group of monsters, they can all hit if you get unlucky, but no single monster will get a long string of all hits.

No, it's not, and I have no idea where people are getting this idea from? it's entirely in your character, reagardless of where the hits are coming from. The same mosnter can hit you multiple consecutive times if the others "use up" the misses.

My mistake, thank you for the clarification. I seemed to remember reading somewhere that it was individual to monster, I'll see if I can dredge up the post about it. I'm assuming the rest of it close enough to the actual mechanic for the purpose of my explanation? =)