VictorDoom's 2h Marauder, 7.7k life(no kaoms) huge dps[Uber Killed, with video] [2.0]

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Vincendra wrote:

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VictorDoom wrote:

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korzasa wrote:

Ok so what we know now, attack speed is not useless^^. But does it make a difference in terms of damage if you cast "pointblank" or click far away? Or is the only real difference the mana/life drain and the problem that you can´t change directions quickly?

It makes a difference in damage anywhere you click, you always get more actual casts per second then without attack speed whether you click close to your char on far away you always get more hits.

With attack speed you can change directions a lot quicker than without attack speed, the whole clear speed is improved.

Recasting Cyclone depends on your Movementspeed, not attackspeed. Even if you put your cursor onto your character you move a minimal distance. You can only recast Cyclone after you moved taht few steps. Increasing movementspeed decreses the time you need to do this distance and therefore increase your casts/second.

Yup youre right,just tried with a 1.1 aps weap and 1.7 one, it looks like after the last patch where they removed the targeting cyclone stops wherever you stop, not when the animaiton finishes so thats pretty cool

Does that mean we can pick a slow weapon if we spam cyclone, we will get the same regen from LGoH? :-)

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Zagumar wrote:

Does that mean we can pick a slow weapon if we spam cyclone, we will get the same regen from LGoH? :-)

No, the post above is about when cyclone stops its travel , not the spin speed of it, youll always get more attacks per second, more dps and more LGOH with a fast weapon.

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Zagumar wrote:

Does that mean we can pick a slow weapon if we spam cyclone, we will get the same regen from LGoH? :-)

Let me go deeper into that. If you take a slow Weapon like a Karui Choper (1.0) AS, and you recast yur Cyclone more often to comodate for the low attackspeed, you spent more life if you go with BM. There are possibilities to cast Cyclone on mana that way, but thats another chapter.

Anyways, your Lifecost will be most of the time more then LGOH will net you back, esp on small packs and bossfights.

If you go the Slow weapon/high cast rate way, you need Liferegen, and much of it, to accomodate for the casting costs.

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VictorDoom wrote:

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Zagumar wrote:

Does that mean we can pick a slow weapon if we spam cyclone, we will get the same regen from LGoH? :-)

No, the post above is about when cyclone stops its travel , not the spin speed of it, youll always get more attacks per second, more dps and more LGOH with a fast weapon.

I get 8 Attacks per second (approximated, tested with VP and spinned until I went out of life and divided my life/cost and then divided the result by the time it took me to 100-0 myself with 105% movement speed (50 base, 55 quicksilver).

You wont get that with attackspeed.

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Vincendra wrote:

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VictorDoom wrote:

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Zagumar wrote:

Does that mean we can pick a slow weapon if we spam cyclone, we will get the same regen from LGoH? :-)

No, the post above is about when cyclone stops its travel , not the spin speed of it, youll always get more attacks per second, more dps and more LGOH with a fast weapon.

I get 8 Attacks per second (approximated, tested with VP and spinned until I went out of life and divided my life/cost and then divided the result by the time it took me to 100-0 myself with 105% movement speed (50 base, 55 quicksilver).

You wont get that with attackspeed.

i got 3.8 base APS and 59% base movement speed/128% with flask(i have more than your movement speed and attack speed as well) i get much more than 8 APS with attack speed because i also spin faster(more attacks in spins). cyclone moves at your movement speed(obviosuly) and spins at your attack speed(http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Cyclone). No matter how close you cyclone you always get more hits in with more attack speed. You can just look at the animation or hear the hits to see the differnce between having APS and not having any APS.

you should try going for high APS and high MS too, its much better than going just for MS.

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VictorDoom wrote:

i got 3.8 base APS and 59% base movement speed/128% with flask(i have more than your movement speed and attack speed as well) i get much more than 8 APS with attack speed because i also spin faster(more attacks in spins). cyclone moves at your movement speed(obviosuly) and spins at your attack speed(http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Cyclone). No matter how close you cyclone you always get more hits in with more attack speed. You can just look at the animation or hear the hits to see the differnce between having APS and not having any APS.

you should try going for high APS and high MS too, its much better than going just for MS.

If my APS is 4, then I Hit every 0.25 seconds.First initial hit (0.00), 2nd hit at 0.25, 3rd at 0.5, 4th at 0.75, 5th at 1.00.

If I recast my cyclone before 0.25, attackspeed is wasted Because I do my 0.00 sec recast tick again. I cast cyclone aprox every 0.12 sec with my MS. No need to go attackspeed at all.

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Vincendra wrote:

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VictorDoom wrote:

i got 3.8 base APS and 59% base movement speed/128% with flask(i have more than your movement speed and attack speed as well) i get much more than 8 APS with attack speed because i also spin faster(more attacks in spins). cyclone moves at your movement speed(obviosuly) and spins at your attack speed(http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Cyclone). No matter how close you cyclone you always get more hits in with more attack speed. You can just look at the animation or hear the hits to see the differnce between having APS and not having any APS.

you should try going for high APS and high MS too, its much better than going just for MS.

If my APS is 4, then I Hit every 0.25 seconds.First initial hit (0.00), 2nd hit at 0.25, 3rd at 0.5, 4th at 0.75, 5th at 1.00.

If I recast my cyclone before 0.25, attackspeed is wasted Because I do my 0.00 sec recast tick again. I cast cyclone aprox every 0.12 sec with my MS. No need to go attackspeed at all.

Just because the first hit is instant doesnt mean that attack speed is not necesarry, you get more hits in your cyclone with more attack speed and more movement speed.

Again, try it, get high APS and high MS, you will notice a pretty huge difference than with just having MS. Honestly, its just a fact, and im not the only one doing this, all of the high level cycloners like tommie, sith, mulla(the best 2h pvp players) etc all use both attack speed and movement speed because its just better.

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VictorDoom wrote:

Just because the first hit is instant doesnt mean that attack speed is not necesarry, you get more hits in your cyclone with more attack speed and more movement speed.

Again, try it, get high APS and high MS, you will notice a pretty huge difference than with just having MS. Honestly, its just a fact, and im not the only one doing this, all of the high level cycloners like tommie, sith, mulla(the best 2h pvp players) etc all use both attack speed and movement speed because its just better.

I agree with you. There are times where it is hard to lead your mouse near your character and you may slip. But I learned to lead my mouse close to my character so that I recast my cyclone after I did the minimal steps I need to do.

I don't need attackspeed at all. im doing 8355 - 13618 damage (11k on average)PER HIT with only promise active. If I lead my mouspointer as close to my character as possible, I am casting cyclone ~ 5-6 X per second with 50% MS and up to 8 times with quicksilver.(50-80 K DPS)

On my last Atziri kill I was lucky enough to get a stormcall, which didnt target on her or me while I hit her and I trucked her form 100% to 20~ before she went into first split. I only see this from mirrored Crit builds.

Now imagine I get 1 Mings and a Taste of hate, which gives me another 50% extra (read MORE) damage. (17K Avarage Hit damage)

Screen with Cyclone-AOE-CONC-Melee-BM-WED


Screen with Cyclone-AOE-Conc-melee-BM-MeleeFullLife, Also showing how close I lead my mouse at all times:


13K Avarage Hits.
Melee Full and BM does not work and I am aware of that, but I might have found a way to get that setup to run on mana with casting it 6-8 times /sec.



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While I agree that attackspeed might help you out to maintain a steady outpit, it is in no way nessecarry.

E: Fixed Spoiler.

You could always try it with a faster axe, just to check how it is with high APS, its just so much damage when you stack both.

Attack speed will simply help you ditch out more dps and will make you tankier, if you use LGOH of course, not using any APS increase is simply not improving anything.

Even if you just go by the tooltip, you have an axe with slightly better pdps than my sword, i have 30k cyclone on the tooltip without any atziri promise or melee damage on full life, just the normal tank setup(cyclone-FA-MPD-CE-LGOH-BM) while still rocking 7.7k life on all rare gear.

With the rare sword showed in the gear section, which has slightly less pdps than your axe:

i get 40k tooltip on flask:http://i.imgur.com/HvO69xn.jpg

And 50k tooltip dps with added fire+flask which is a real usable setup: http://i.imgur.com/Zk8qefq.jpg


Also, mings heart is not that good, it gives me only 2k more dps than a IAS+Flat phys ring, which also has life and resits, also i lose 700 life if i replace a 70 life ring with mings, id take the rare ring over mings to be honest, unless you really need the chaos resist, 2k dps is not worth 700 life.


And if you dont go by the tooltip, you still get more dps from IAS, just because you attack more times in your cyclone spam