To all legit players

"

flab wrote:

For me, the biggest reason for having this "/player X" feature, especially in beta, would be in finding and correcting imbalances.

But do you not see how /player would completely destroy the game? What would ever be the point in doing anything other than progressing from farm to farm, steam-rolling the content in between. No matter how you try to dress up the /players idea, this is what will happen.

"

Mr_Bill wrote:

Sticking your head in the sand.

Please don't paint me in this light. If you don't understand why I requested what I did, ask me to explain it further in PM. If you want to talk about quantity in party, you're welcome to make a thread about it.

"

Moosifer wrote:

I dunno man, you guys are coming up with pretty insane math equations to figure this shit out. I think the easiest solution is put a lvl cap of 15-25 lvls, if someone above or below that enters the instance it doesn't adjust to a party situation.

It still allows people to rush early levels, face merveil at lvl 8-9 if you can/want to. But in the middle difficulties it means the low lvls can't leech off higher lvl and on maps high lvl characters can't use lvl 1s as a exp bonus.

The thing is it only applies to party situations as if a lvl 30 was doing act 1 merci (48-52 right?) if they can handle the content, kill and whatever they will still get exp but if they get help from a lvl 70 they can't leech, only get rushed through the content. Even if a lvl 70 rushed a low lvl character through, that low lvl character would still have to grind out the lvls by himself or with someone of relatively the same lvl.

This also keeps high lvl groups intact so a lvl 60 and 80 can do a map together without being screwed on experience.

This would still be a problem as it doesnt stop the issue, only makes it slightly (very slightly) harder to do it.

But like last race, we had 4 other "racers" that said "hey this is the best I'm doing, do you want to use this toon to boost your other guy?"

See how its still a problem? Not even to talk about, if you get a few people to play other accounts, racing slowly yet still boosting the main guy. If you are not doing this in a race, you will end up losing. This shouldnt be the normal thing to do in races.



To the people talking about /player x option. This option is not good also because then you back to square 1 with the issue of "Why party?"

Next if you make /player x worse than party options. Then again you back to square 1 of "Why not use boosters instead of /player x?"


Duo,
Yes this is correct about the instance full sharing. Which is also why I said the extra exp the higher level gets relative to the lower levels should fall off, or vanish.

So 1 person in the party would never get more than their % share of the exp. Example.
6 man party, each person would get.
16.66% of the exp if they are the same level.
If you have a level 70, and 5x level 1s.
The level 70 would get 16.66% of the exp, and the level 1s would get .4% of the exp. The other 81.34% is just lost.
I dont see how this isnt fair if someone can think of an example of where this wouldnt be fair to all people, please explain it to me.

"

duolc wrote:

"

flab wrote:

For me, the biggest reason for having this "/player X" feature, especially in beta, would be in finding and correcting imbalances.

But do you not see how /player would completely destroy the game? What would ever be the point in doing anything other than progressing from farm to farm, steam-rolling the content in between. No matter how you try to dress up the /players idea, this is what will happen.

I am incredibly confused by this post. I face steam-roll things now. Pretty sure most others do. In races or not.

"

SL4Y3R wrote:

I am incredibly confused by this post. I face steam-roll things now. Pretty sure most others do. In races or not.

Of course if you are steam-rolling content then you are quite over levelled. /players just makes it ridiculously more beneficial to play the game in this unchallenging farm hopping fashion.

But it does increase monster health. And dmg? Which makes it take more than several minutes to a map, but that's a different issue.

I did like the, Duo suggestion though. All I'm trying to get across is something has to change.

from the mechanics thread on Party effects: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/11707

there is no dmg scaling currently.
There is a flat 30% boost to XP for being in aparty (I assume this will stay because it is an incentive to party over playing by yourself).
HP and XP from monsters increases by 50% per extra party member.

Assuming the 30% party bonus or other bonus is to stay to encourage partying, then the only way I can see to stop exploits is the (probably) difficult way mentioned previously in the thread:

Only get the party and other XP bonuses for characters within 2 screens. I have a feeling that this would be very intensive CPU wise :(

Actually, I just thought of an IDEAE :P :)

If you only got the Party XP boost from monsters that were hit by multiple members of the party? OK, maybe you wouldn't end up with 30% from ALL kills, BUT, from what I've seen in party play, there is a lot of AoE spam, so a lot of the monsters (especially the bigger ones) take hits from multiple party membes. This is computationally more efficient (1 bit flag), and you check the flag before calculating the XP.

Now, boosters HAVE to cheat, because they will need to use scripts to make their fillers attack stuff. Which would be bannable offense.

what are your thoughts???

^not bad

"

StillSingle wrote:

from the mechanics thread on Party effects: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/11707

there is no dmg scaling currently.
There is a flat 30% boost to XP for being in aparty (I assume this will stay because it is an incentive to party over playing by yourself).
HP and XP from monsters increases by 50% per extra party member.

Assuming the 30% party bonus or other bonus is to stay to encourage partying, then the only way I can see to stop exploits is the (probably) difficult way mentioned previously in the thread:

Only get the party and other XP bonuses for characters within 2 screens. I have a feeling that this would be very intensive CPU wise :(

Actually, I just thought of an IDEAE :P :)

If you only got the Party XP boost from monsters that were hit by multiple members of the party? OK, maybe you wouldn't end up with 30% from ALL kills, BUT, from what I've seen in party play, there is a lot of AoE spam, so a lot of the monsters (especially the bigger ones) take hits from multiple party membes. This is computationally more efficient (1 bit flag), and you check the flag before calculating the XP.

Now, boosters HAVE to cheat, because they will need to use scripts to make their fillers attack stuff. Which would be bannable offense.

what are your thoughts???

This just forces people to party play like you want to play.

Next to each other, and spamming AOE's.

What about the people that are more about being a tank for harder monsters? or the ones that res mobs so necros cant kill them?

If you have been in a party you can clearly see how ineffective it is to be hitting the same mobs as someone else also.

Not sure where you get +30% exp, but this is the quote

"

Effect on experience
For a description on how experience is shared between players, see the level scaling section above. Only party members actually in the instance count toward getting XP. If one member is in town he gets no XP.
Experience is only shared with other players who are near you (roughly two screens). Monsters are still made harder by players elsewhere on the level.
Being in an are with a party member grants you a 30% experience bonus.
Monsters give +50% base XP for every party member after the first.

The way I read it.

If you are in a zone while in a party you get +30% exp.
Each mob gives 50% more exp per party member.

So if you are in a 2 person party, killing solo, in the same zone (not in range of each other)
You would get 100% mob exp +50% mob exp per party member after the first (total of 150% mob exp) plus 30% for being in a zone with a party.
ie.
Mob normally gives 1000 exp. It would now give 1500 exp. The player would get 1500exp * 1.30 (+30% for being in a party) which is really 1950 exp per monster.

If you are near your party member you would get the exp based on your level, so say you were equal level you would get 1/2 the exp of 1950 exp.

If you were in a 6 man party, killing solo you would get.
1000exp * 5x1.50% = 7500exp * 1.30 = 9750 per monster killed solo.

If you were next to your party of 6 and all equal level. You would get 1/6th the exp AKA 16.67%. So 9750x.1667 = 1625 exp.


Having said this, with the testing of exp (using gems). I dont believe this is how it works.
I believe its +65% per person exp.

So using the same numbers above
2 man party, solo killing.
1000x1.65 = 1650 exp per monster
2man party, killing with your party equal level.
1650/2 = 825exp per monster killed.

6 man party, solo killing.
1000x4.25 (.65x5 +1) = 4250 exp
6 man party, killing with your party equal levels.
4250exp/6 = 708exp.

I would request, due to the charged nature of this topic, that people at least do a quick read of all 8 pages to see what options have already been discussed. We're echoing here, just a little bit. I made a compilation on page 5, and since then nothing really new has been added to the table.

Every solution presented so far has one or more flaws, which we've also dissected in pretty gory detail.