Looting -- The official thread for discussing the loot system. Updated 18th March, 2013.
" Il give it a shot. I've been called stupid enough in this thread be you and a few others to know exaclty what he means. Basically he thinks your a moron. :D " ^ Someone googled analphabets didn't they? Last edited by Vooodu#7002 on Jun 18, 2013, 4:51:04 PM
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" I'll or I will not Il you're or you are not your exactly not exaclty Just saying, if we are talking analphabets you might want to try a bit harder sir. Last edited by thepmrc#0256 on Jun 18, 2013, 4:55:40 PM
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" :) |
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Let me take a moment to try to clarify the debate. I'm not trying to put anyone down here; I'm trying as best I can to really capture the essence of both sides of this argument.
Supporters of the current PA and loot options Core Principle: Party play in PoE should be the same game as solo, but with bigger numbers. Thus the key to balancing party play is finding the appropriate multipliers in an attempt to balance solo and party play. Supporting Beliefs:
Supporters of the SA and the removal of loot options Core Principle: Party play in PoE should be a different game than solo, but obviously a very similar one. Thus the key to balancing party play is finding the appropriate additional game features in an attempt to make solo and party play feel fundamentally different. Supporting Beliefs:
If anyone disagrees with any of the above, let me know. I'm trying to be fair here and I'll edit it if a revision is proposed and seconded (within reason). Now, back to the argument. As evidence for the SA side, watch this if you haven't: Extra Credits, S06E03: Differences in Scale vs Differences in Kind. PA lovers, answer me the questions posed in that video, and I'll be impressed. When Stephen Colbert was killed by HYDRA's Project Insight in 2014, the comedy world lost a hero. Since his life model decoy isn't up to the task, please do not mistake my performance as political discussion. I'm just doing what Steve would have wanted. Last edited by ScrotieMcB#2697 on Jun 18, 2013, 6:39:00 PM
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I don't think the allocated loot supporters feel the game should be easier in multiplayer play. It should be of a very similar difficulty level with very similar rewards. Multiplayer should be either more difficult and more rewarding or equally difficult and equally rewarding. I think everyone can agree on that.
Overall I think you are over-analyzing it. We have loot options, stick to the option that you prefer and enjoy the game. Thankfully now everyone has the option that suits their own personal play style best and they can enjoy the game in a multiplayer setting. Last edited by thepmrc#0256 on Jun 18, 2013, 6:45:29 PM
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"Rewards are part of difficulty and must be integrated into it. This actually isn't difficult, it's pretty much just simple division. Would you support (monster life bonus per player)/(IIQ bonus per player)>1, if those were the only difficulty-increasing and reward-increasing multipliers? "This is tantamount to saying that me, Ten, and others are delusional. Am I putting words in your mouth, or is that your claim? When Stephen Colbert was killed by HYDRA's Project Insight in 2014, the comedy world lost a hero. Since his life model decoy isn't up to the task, please do not mistake my performance as political discussion. I'm just doing what Steve would have wanted. Last edited by ScrotieMcB#2697 on Jun 18, 2013, 6:55:50 PM
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" If you truthfully believe that other players being able to play with the loot style they prefer is damaging your game experience, then yes, I would say that you are delusional. The fact that player X can play allocated loot in a party of friends in no way impacts your ability to play FFA or Short Timers in your own party. Play what you enjoy playing and leave others to do the same. It is pretty simple. I have no problems at all with people's opinions on looting. If you prefer FFA, awesome. If you prefer short timers, awesome. If you want purely allocated, awesome. I like options because I like both FFA and allocated for different reasons, I feel they both have merit, I am not a fan of the timer system at all. That being said, I do not think it should be removed as other people have shown that they enjoy it. People playing short timer allocation parties in no way effects my enjoyment of the game, just as people playing FFA or Allocated in parties does not effect your enjoyment of the game. Its about compromise here, and I am glad that the devs saw some sense. Last edited by thepmrc#0256 on Jun 18, 2013, 7:06:52 PM
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" I'm honest to my own detriment, yes, its also clear that I am not alone in my opinions though. this topic deals with human psychology, and it is not a straight forward issue because of it. what this is really about is a "minor forced pvp environment" a looting meta-game that was built into PoE's design. before the options were added you had only a few choices: 1-get good at looting 2-make loyal friends 3-solo (always last resort) 4-solo most of the time and do bosses with groups 5-play public games anyway and get by on crappy loot many players adapted to this environment and got good at looting and made many friends to share with. but now you can just turn off this part of the game, just like in how d3's looting system works. many of us are saying, if you can turn off loot tension entirely, you are really not even playing the same game. its far easier to concentrate simply on targeting monsters and safe positioning during battle when you filter out having to watch what loot falls - these "meta games" are different: one requires split second decisions and the other is non existent. there is nothing in place to reconcile that difference. if you really care about your characters survival like HC players you will soon realize that its much easier to stay safe when you don't have to constantly scan the ground and position yourself in dangerous places. you will ask why am I fighting for loot and putting myself in danger when I can have it wait for me 5 min? this effect directly incentivizes this permanent allocation. is all that easy to understand? I'm guessing its not, because so many of you stare at it like a box of rocks and say things like "but now there is choices everyone should be happy". |
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" That is pretty bad evidence for the SA side considering the fact that with loot options you still have SA in the game. There is no reason to force multiplayer and single player to be different in that way. If the game lacks differences in kind, that have to be solved in ways that improve the single player experience aswell. Forced FFA loot just messes up the game for all the people who want the single play experience with friends etc. Here is better list: Supporters of the current PA and loot options Core Principle: Party play in PoE should be the same game as solo, but with bigger numbers. Thus the key to balancing party play is finding the appropriate multipliers in an attempt to balance solo and party play. Supporting Beliefs:
Supporters of the SA and the removal of loot options Core Principle: Party play in PoE should be a different game than solo, but obviously a very similar one. Thus the key to balancing party play is finding the appropriate additional game features in an attempt to make solo and party play feel fundamentally different. Supporting Beliefs:
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" See what I mean? Of course you can. You just don't want to. Of course people can type, of course they can play SA, of course they can intereact with other players, of course they can pay attention to a silly computer game - they just don't want to if you give them the option of just sitting there and watching the inventory fill up. And that's the entire problem. Last edited by exit_zero#4816 on Jun 18, 2013, 10:52:54 PM
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