Looting -- The official thread for discussing the loot system. Updated 18th March, 2013.
" Here, Let me seperate them for you and maybe it will be more clear... My first argument -Looting Options has little impact especially since it wouldn't effect single player at all. -Single player is also what this game was apparently built for. My second argument -Full respecs is far more impactful since it has a big impact on BOTH single player and multiplayer people (including pvp). Edit: Maybe we should define the word "cater". I don't see Pro instanced people asking to make the enemies do less damage, give free full respecs, remove stats, make the passive tree smaller, remove all death penalties etc etc... Standard Forever Last edited by iamstryker#5952 on Jan 10, 2013, 1:34:28 AM
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Again, everyone ignores the huge problem being bots.
Why are you not playing D2 right now? You can get the game and expansion for $5 and the servers are still up. The game still plays great and has aged pretty well. Its simply because every single public game is populated with bots or people using bots to assist in looting. That is simply because of the loot system being FFA. GGG only has 5 programmers and 1 system admin and you really think they are going to be able to stop pick-it bots? Its going to end up the same thing for every public game, either you use a script/bot to parse and grab loot or you massively lose out to people that do. |
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" I'm ignoring it because, as a retired programmer/analyst who is very familiar with the problem domain, I'm fervently praying that both you and I are wrong. If you and I are correct in our judgements, FFA loot will be the least of the problems (though a very big problem in its own right as you correctly point out). Here's to hoping the GGG devs pull an equivalent of a John Carmack & co, revolutionizing multiplayer game anti-hacking and counter automation techniques equivalent to what that Carmack's crew did in the graphics field. Cheers! |
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" Except you missed the part where separate paid leagues are only to make the game harder and not easier. I have played games with instanced and FFA loot, and I much prefer the FFA loot. With instanced you kill less stuff if you are slow because people can't see your items and in FFA someone else takes it. Instanced loot would make it easier, and be bad for the game. Too many games these days are going down the slippery slope of instanced loot. About the timer though, the problem isn't that it needs to be longer, but that if you click on an item 1-2 seconds before the timer ends, you can pick it up before the timer ends. Fix this issue and it will act as though the timer is 1-2 seconds longer. Oh And I usually play ranged and still am able to grab most of my loot in public games. and for my pieces I miss, I can get some other people's stuff to compensate. Julius's path of exile wine bundle for mac here: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/48708/page/1
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" Why bother playing with others (as a bot). Merely have 6 bots playing together..... None of this has anything to do with loot. As far as pickit bots or scripts are concerned. Boot em (from your party). |
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" Out of all of the Pro FFA arguments this one annoys me the most. I don't remember one Anti-FFA player in this entire thread that wants a change in order to make the game easier. We argue to make the game less terrible for us, less frustrating, less UNfun. It has nothing at all to do with game difficulty. If this is the issue then I will PM Chris right now and ask him to let us make a MUCH more difficult league with long timers or instanced loot. Maybe this league will have twice as many necromancers, or double the health of all necromancers. I dunno stuff like that. Standard Forever Last edited by iamstryker#5952 on Jan 10, 2013, 2:20:01 AM
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" lolz GGG - Why you no?
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" " The lead-developer of this game contradicts you, so go tell that to him (first post on page 235). It appears that this game was designed as a solo playing game with the option of party playing. " Easy, not instanced where each player can only see his allocated loot, but with the current system slightly changed: make the timer infinite, then get rid of it and replace it with the name of the player that the RNG decides the item is allocated to. This way all players see all loot. And don't fool yourself thinking that the current system gives you "cut-throat" feel because with the current loot system the RNG decides randomly which item theoretically belongs to which player by specifying his name on the item. I repeat myself, this is not cut-throat, where you can't randomly attack/kill players just for the pleasure of it and taking their items in the process. Cut-throat is where loot is pure-FFA (no timers, no naming specified, no nothing) and everyone can take everything AND everyone can kill anyone they want, for the pleasure of it or for the loot. That would be real cut-throat, even the name cut-throat means that i can cut your throat whenever i please and i want. Not this fake, artificially pompous named "cut-throat" that you flap arround in here. " The system i explained above doesn't change the core game. Plus, you can have all kinds of leagues with all kind of rules. We already have softcore, hardcore, that cut-throat etc. No biggie. " Guess what, especially the end game is bosses and maps, with the current state that this game is in right now. Loot options would not affect this in any way, as you wrongfully imply. " Well, all of you ffaers would still be able to play ffa, so why would you leave? Because there are loot-options? Out of spite? Why? " Guess what, the "gamers of the ARPG genre" are a lot, including casuals (consumers), pro-sumers and pros. We all know that you really wanted to say pros/hardcore/elite but you realized it's a nonsense and you change it in "gamers of the ARPG genre". Funny indeed. The question is: Are pros/hardcore/elitist enough to keep this game alive? Do the game needs also the pro-sumers and the consumers? Or maybe the devs have a money printing machine in which case yeah, I guess you can make a very small niche game and self sustain it. " OK. With the current system a party of 6 gets, lets say, 100 items form 1 cleared instance. With a full instanced system that party of 6 would still get in the end the same 100 items after 1 cleared instance, but it would be divided (equally or not, those are details) between the 6 players. No inflation, no bulshit, no nothing. " I agree with this. " Heh, it's been already announce a multitude of leagues. That's spliting the population. Already. Keep up. " True, but until death the leagues are split. Plus most of the hardcorers will start a new hardcore character instead of playing default. Or they play default for a few days then (re)start hardcore again. Split is split, not together. Don't twist the words to reach to a wrong conclusion. " So true, it'll be carnage. " They are connected already, we're talking about loot options here. Inside default you'd have party loot option: full-ffa or the system explained above. Easy peasy. Oh, and please stop relating the succes of d2 or the insucces of d3 to the loot system used (ffa in the first case and instanced in the second case). It has absolutely nothing to do with it. " Exactly, because you have a team that focuses on being the best, toping the ladder, showing off with uber-6linked-gear and stuff like that. You already play the game, probably 95% of the time with your team, acting like one, focused on your purpose. You play pub-games just for a laugh. So you're not exactly in the position of giving advices about this. You do that because you want to top the ladder, be competitive and all that bulshit. It's easy for you to talk so relaxed about loot because inside your focused team you have rigorous rules about the loot that drops. In there nobody steals your loot etc. And this is exactly why you want and stick to the ffa system: because it gives you (and your team) an advantage. Whatever. On the contrary, the casuals and some of the prosumers dont give a shit about ladders and competitive playing. They want fan and relaxation. They have enough competition in real life. They don't want loot competitivity. They dont have nor want nor need a team that is focused on laurels and glory. Sticky this to your trollish head. |
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" No it isn't. It's primarily a single player game, remember? Grouping is a gimmick. Nothing about it is a HUGE part of the game. |
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Real Casuals, as you guys use the word, are not interested in Path of Exile and are still over in Diablo 3 trying to pretend that it has any depth to it whatsoever.
I for only see myself as casual in the sense that I can't play this game for 8 hours a day or more. That is the one and only reason that I would ever give myself the label of "casual". Other than that I am every bit as hardcore as any other player in here. I theory craft as much as you and I love the core game as much as you. Not enjoying FFA is simply a difference of opinion and playstyle. I do not want the game to be easier. I want it to be difficult without fighting over loot with my teammates. I want to not hate the system in which I get my favorite part of the game (The Loot). Calling people casuals who are asking for the game itself to be harder is silly. Your just using the word to make yourself feel superior. Standard Forever
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