Looting -- The official thread for discussing the loot system. Updated 18th March, 2013.

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SMRD wrote:

My opinion is formed from playing months of solo, public games and finally private group games with a large friends list. Sharing loot is an essential part of “being” in the game with someone, it creates trust relationships with other players and results in a deeper experience then having half the game “personalized” like in MMO’s or other games where it does not matter at all who you are with.

I see over and over again people coming to PoE from diablo 3 and find so much better of a game – but they say “except for the loot system”. Not realized it’s this very system that is at the core of so many decisions that are responsible for the “better” game.

Amen.

When the loot isn't shared, players are not sharing a major element of the gameplay experience, resulting in much shallower interpersonal relationships overall. It's a risk/reward thing, where the risk is possibly playing with a selfish player and the reward is potentially a trusting relationship and friend to count on. Removing FFA removes that risk, sure, but it also removes a significant reward that many of us value highly.

Don't confuse our passion for what makes these games special to us for elitism. Many of you are crying about potentially losing an item; we're crying about potentially losing a significant human element of the gameplay. For many of us arguing for FFA loot, items - ironically - have nothing to do with it.

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SL4Y3R wrote:

I do

And how do you know the majority of players don't like it?

You really do? Ok, it sounds more you want to stand your foot other than anything, because i cant believe you think a tweak in the loot system would ruined the entire game.

But, if you really believe in that, i respect your opinion.

I just want to clarify one thing here. I don´t like the loot system as it is.

The major problem i see in the system is the imbalance/unfair with player from overseas. Because wen you play with higher ping the 2 second timer can be allready expired in the "real" time wen you reach the item. That is my main concern about it.

You can say: "hey, so you not gonna PVP because you gonna be dead meat in the pvp enviroment, so you not gonna enjoy all the awesome pvp stuff gonna roll, just go back do d3 you noob".

I don´t care about the PVP. Don´t get me wrong, i like it. I even try the cut throat event and had a blast with it, but i saw the ping is gonna be an isue, a big one. But no problem for me, im ok with that.

And you can say too: "You never gonna be on top of the ladder, because you are a noob and have a bad latency with the PoE servers".

That´s fine for me too, because i don´t care about it, i respect people who go for the top of the ladder - i don´t respect the multi boxers and cheaters of course, but i play, and gonna play because i like the game. Simple as that.

I don´t judge you if you expend all your money in microtrans, or if you expend like 24/7 playing the game, if you dont get laid or any crap like that. If you like the game in a fair way (dont cheat or multi box) it´s ok for me.

And you guys never read here - from me i mean - "if they don´t change the loot system this game gonna suck and gonna be a trash, im gonna quit this crap if they don´t change it and bla bla bla and q q q q q". No, never.

I may don´t like the loot system, but i like the game and have high hopes for it. I want it to go big, that´s why i even support the game.

And that´s why i believe if they tweak a little bit the loot system the game not gonna suck or something like that.

From what I have seen the pro-FFA posters don’t play public games. Pro-FFA talk about how they built a friends list and play predominately in private groups… Your stated reasons for is because it allows you to play with trusted people.
The fact that you suffer thru a portion of the game to build a ‘guild’ is a bad sign.

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Aixius wrote:

Amen.

When the loot isn't shared, players are not sharing a major element of the gameplay experience, resulting in much shallower interpersonal relationships overall. It's a risk/reward thing, where the risk is possibly playing with a selfish player and the reward is potentially a trusting relationship and friend to count on. Removing FFA removes that risk, sure, but it also removes a significant reward that many of us value highly.

Don't confuse our passion for what makes these games special to us for elitism. Many of you are crying about potentially losing an item; we're crying about potentially losing a significant human element of the gameplay. For many of us arguing for FFA loot, items - ironically - have nothing to do with it.

I think no one is crying for an item. What you guys don´t see is this game have the potential to be big, at least i want it to go big, and a lot of the players not gonna have the time to try and go find good and polite players who respect the loot. I don´t have this time right now, and the pool of the players is really small. Put in there 4m players (go PoE!)and you gonna have a void in public games. You can coun´t on that.

And is nice to read you guys talk about the human element. That´s is really cool. I can respect that. But GGG never say something like that, they want the loot system as it is because they say they want to people to compete against each other, because all the exiles are criminals and stuff.

I rather see the loot system by your eyes than the GGG way.

Still, i think the system needs work.

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cyryc wrote:

I think no one is crying for an item. What you guys don´t see is this game have the potential to be big, at least i want it to go big, and a lot of the players not gonna have the time to try and go find good and polite players who respect the loot. I don´t have this time right now, and the pool of the players is really small. Put in there 4m players (go PoE!)and you gonna have a void in public games. You can coun´t on that.

I didn't become a Gold Supporter of GGG because I thought the game would be a small-time success.

I too believe the game will be big, and the players that make this game big are going to be the players that actually do have time to play. There seems to be a notion in this thread that there are not enough items to go around; that players will be doomed to wander Wraeclast for months before finding a good item and that it could potentially get taken by someone else at that moment.

Have any of you played multiplayer at all? Items. Everywhere. You will find stuff, whether it be single or multiplayer.

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cyryc wrote:

And is nice to read you guys talk about the human element. That´s is really cool. I can respect that. But GGG never say something like that, they want the loot system as it is because they say they want to people to compete against each other, because all the exiles are criminals and stuff.

I rather see the loot system by your eyes than the GGG way.

Still, i think the system needs work.

That's the thing: GGG wants the possibility of players competing with each other, but ultimately the question of how to behave is up to the players themselves to answer. Letting the players dictate (through behavior, not checkboxes) what is acceptable is very much a part of that "human element" many of us cherish. In my experience, like-minded players will find each other.

But both shared and individual loot systems require trust from the other party members. Let's say you have a ranger and witch, and a nice rare bow drops and the witch picks it up. In the shared loot with a cooldown timer, the witch has the option of picking it up and giving it to the ranger but the ranger knows. In an individual loot system you have the option to pick it up and give it to the ranger, or horde it for yourself because you may need it for some other build. Either way there's still some diplomatic cost and benefit to it. When, the other players can't see your loot you have to be trickier because you might want something that they got but you don't know for sure. If you're playing with friends in either mode you're still going to end up with what you want. This is the only real reason I prefer to solo and not party up with random people.

I'm personally a fan of individual drops for rares, uniques, and currency items. It reduces a lot of hassle in the game especially when it comes to deciding if something is worth picking up or not, since reading and deciding essentially removes you from the action. Just pick it up and decide later whether you want it.

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Aixius wrote:

I didn't become a Gold Supporter of GGG because I thought the game would be a small-time success.

I too believe the game will be big, and the players that make this game big are going to be the players that actually do have time to play. There seems to be a notion in this thread that there are not enough items to go around; that players will be doomed to wander Wraeclast for months before finding a good item and that it could potentially get taken by someone else at that moment.

Have any of you played multiplayer at all? Items. Everywhere. You will find stuff, whether it be single or multiplayer.

You sir are wrong in so many ways. And this is not an opinion. It´s a fact. A game it´s not made by players who play it more hours and stuff. If you dont realise how wrong you are, im sad for you. And i mean it.

WoW is made by the high end guilds? No. League of Legends is made by the high ELO player? No. Starcraft 2 is made by The Grandmaster players? No.

Your argument is only valid in Diablo 3 world, where bot´s dominate the game. LoL.

No, i don´t play multiplayer games at all. I just made all the stuff about the loot system to watch the world burn and see people saying things they don´t know what makes a game go big or not.

If you want to bring the pichtfork and start to offend people and look like a complete douche, suite yourself, but first get your facts straight, then we talk. Ok?

Waiting eagerly to see page 500 of this.

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Zakaluka wrote:

Waiting eagerly to see page 500 of this.

Only 299 to go! :)

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Aixius wrote:

When the loot isn't shared, players are not sharing a major element of the gameplay experience, resulting in much shallower interpersonal relationships overall. It's a risk/reward thing, where the risk is possibly playing with a selfish player and the reward is potentially a trusting relationship and friend to count on.

This is a point that I would like to discuss that is shared by a lot of the Pro FFAers in here. The assumption in here is that in order for the game to be the most enjoyable is to have players decide who is a good person and who is a bad person based on if they ninja loot/take loot not allocated to them. Its assuming that EVERYONE will have a better time with the game if they use FFA to try to find the best most trustworthy friends. This isn't true for me at all and I'm guessing its not true for a lot of the players who don't like FFA. To me this is a video game and my enjoyment does not come from how "ethical" the people I play with are. I'm not putting down people who like to do that but for me it just isn't true. I would much rather just have the looting system that I enjoy and play with anyone I come into contact with. Some players I might like more than others because they talk more, trade more, and are more laid back players. But I will never be irritated by the loot system.

This is the inherent difference. My opinion is that if enough of the player base is more like me then the game would benefit from having something for us to enjoy like a league or the option for an extended timer.