Looting -- The official thread for discussing the loot system. Updated 18th March, 2013.

ffa loot will just result in diablo 2 all over again; that is, a bunch of people soloing.

personally, if ffa loot is standard, i'll only be playing solo or with my guild.

sad but true.

The current system is not ffa: items are allocated to you for a short period of time.

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resira wrote:

The current system is not ffa: items are allocated to you for a short period of time.

Which still creates a slightly smaller version of the same problem.

FFA loot even with a delay timer rewards the selfish who concentrate on loot dropping and not fighting monsters at the expense of any one else in the party who does not do the same.

If FFA v.s. allocated loot were a party formation option there is not a snowball in hell's chance I would join a FFA party.

It’s very true that FFA loot essentially supports selfish behavior and promotes it.

But that’s kind of what GGG wants to support. It’s not ideal. But it’s their design goal. They want the player to be rabidly clicking items just as rabidly as they are fighting enemies.

It isn’t normally easy to multi-task like that, but I guess that’s the point. It’s supposed to be hard and “cut-throat.”

So at least in the case of FFA loot, the cut-throat feeling is essentially playing alongside people where selfish behavior is promoted.

Is that necessarily fun? I guess it depends on who you talk to.

I don’t believe it’s fun, but then again, I try not to be selfish either.

If FFA is the only loot option I'll either only be playing with friends, or not playing online at all. Not going to put up with the griefing.

FFA turns into this.

"Oooh the monster is almost dead, I'll just stop attacking and let that guy finish it off, then I'll already be set to pick up the drops."

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Silver wrote:

They want the player to be rabidly clicking items just as rabidly as they are fighting enemies.

If they really feel that is a desirable goal then it would be better to allocate drops and make them poof after a time out. That way you are pitted against a timer not your (supposedly) cooperative team mates. Still leaves the problem of loot imbalance between tanks and ranged/fragile builds.

Problem with allocate-and-then-poof idea is that partying with someone on a spotty connection (read: occasional disconnects or lag spikes) results in less loot overall, and players having more time to see items they won't get.

And I might point out that the allocation timer's dependency on distance is specifically to correct said ranged/melee loot imbalance.

As for "I'll just stop attacking and let them finish it off" - if recovering from a kill takes long enough that the allocation wears off (assuming an item even drops), it may be time to reconsider your choice of genre - since there'll be other monsters to deal with in the meantime.

"Rabidly clicking" I suppose may be one way of looking at it - although from what I understand of the drop rate this won't be so much of an issue unless you're overleveled enough to be killing enemies faster than in the videos - but I see it more as an encouragement for players to pick up items first and ask if they're useful later.

(Summary: a few rebuttals in favor of either the status quo or temporary allocation on white items as well)

I don't see how the "poof" idea is any better than the vanilla FFA idea. It still encourages griefing, and selfish attitudes.

Also, as many have mentioned, this system will irritate those with sub-par connections.

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Skivverus wrote:

And I might point out that the allocation timer's dependency on distance is specifically to correct said ranged/melee loot imbalance.

And will ranged character damage output be adjusted to compensate for the additional amount of time they spend running to and back from loot drops? Will they get a defence boost or something while loot is timing out to allow them to run into melee range to pick up their loot before a tank in the party steals it?

Anyhow allocated loot with a time out to poof or someone else stealing it is such a thoroughly duff idea I can't be bothered with discussing ways of trying to fix the side issues it creates.

I feel the biggest consideration is with ranged as opposed to latency, as I'm sure has come out in discussion.

Ranged players that must deal with additional mobs surrounding an item would be at a FAR more improbable advantage of picking up an item than a tank for many reasons.

Aggro issues and players leaving combat to grab items complaints.. the social dynamic can turn ugly here.

Additional problems that might be encountered are those of relative earning. In a random proximity allocation system you have issues with people not doing much but getting first dibs.

I know for a fact that FFA methods fail with ranged combat. I also know for a fact that individualized loot takes away a huge aspect of game immersion, and makes it difficult for players to allow others to take stuff they don't want.

The proposed algorithm sounds good to me, however I would complicate the algorithm more by not distributing loot rights entirely randomly. I would factor in proximity (biased towards tanks,) damage (if you don't record per creature damage you could record killshot info... this value should be biased towards non-tanks,) possibly another factor that biases based on a trait that everyone has in common.

So then you have Tank + Non-Tank + Common contributions to the loot priority. Priorities could even overlap, so it's not 1 person then everyone... it could also go more like "supermarket sweep" style where you can see it as soon as your personal timer is up, again based on various factors and proximity.

You might want to consider giving ranged a form of telekinesis to take items from a distance... it could cost some mana or whatever and require quick thinking and use, but it would put them closer to the same page as tanks and reduce their need to run back and forth.

Good luck, this is a tough one to not totally screw ranged or create problems with ranged players constantly running back and forth ;)