Looting -- The official thread for discussing the loot system. Updated 18th March, 2013.

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DoomCloud wrote:

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iamstryker wrote:

Edit" wow doom you payed $250 for a video game? You must take this stuff way more serious than me.

Sure, I donated $250 to GGG because I believe in what they're doing, how they're doing it, and the game they're developing. Was totally worth it to me, I like the game the way it is. And you might be right about taking it more serious than you, but at the end of the day I still don't have any anxiety or worry about losing drops.

I agree that I would love to be in a group that shares items and are good buddies but I recognize that is not always the case and I give a crap about the people who do not want to deal with it but would actually rather focus on the actual game play and not the mini game called "Keep a close eye on the items dropping or else someone will take the one with YOUR name on it and not give it to you".

This is a loot game, I make no apologies for caring about getting my share of the drops.

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Kirisute_Gomen wrote:

You should read back through the forum to see the majority opinion. Quite a few do not play public games simply because of GGG's "competitive" looting. Still waiting on that amazing reason why FFA is so great besides "Individual drops aren't realistic and don't make sense to me".

Everyone here has given their opinion and we are all entitled to it. I was simply pointing out that your reasoning is hardly good enough to attempt to influence the direction of the game for the better. Nobody has yet, that I have seen.

I can give you one though. If you can see someone got a nice item, you can immediately beg them for it. Here's another, you can take someone's nice stuff before them and piss them off. Two very good reasons for FFA right?

One of the most interesting things about Diablo 2 to me was that it could, in it's own way, teach a variety of life lessons and skills to its players.

For most, luck is a fickle thing. Sometimes you're in the right place at the right time and other times you are not. Them's the breaks.

There are benefits to playing in a group, be it higher damage, more drops, etc., but you must remember that we're all exiles: sharing or stealing are choices that we must make. Not everyone is going to be a jerk, and not everyone is going to be nice, but you'll certainly find some of both just like in real life. It often starts with you: when players see that you are fair and play with honor, they often return it in kind. Sometimes these players make it onto your friends list, and as you fill your list with more "good" players, the game can become even more rewarding.

Someone begs you for an item? Tell them no. Or give it to them. Or trade it to them. The options are all yours.

The FFA loot system plays a big part in establishing the mood and setting of the game. A lot of players want gear to be divided up and handed out to them so that everything is equal and fair...but that doesn't fit the game thematically. This sunny era of hand-holding and participation trophies doesn't exactly fit the mold of Wraeclast. Life's not fair sometimes, otherwise you likely wouldn't have washed up on that beach in the first place.

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Aixius wrote:

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Kirisute_Gomen wrote:

You should read back through the forum to see the majority opinion. Quite a few do not play public games simply because of GGG's "competitive" looting. Still waiting on that amazing reason why FFA is so great besides "Individual drops aren't realistic and don't make sense to me".

Everyone here has given their opinion and we are all entitled to it. I was simply pointing out that your reasoning is hardly good enough to attempt to influence the direction of the game for the better. Nobody has yet, that I have seen.

I can give you one though. If you can see someone got a nice item, you can immediately beg them for it. Here's another, you can take someone's nice stuff before them and piss them off. Two very good reasons for FFA right?

One of the most interesting things about Diablo 2 to me was that it could, in it's own way, teach a variety of life lessons and skills to its players.

For most, luck is a fickle thing. Sometimes you're in the right place at the right time and other times you are not. Them's the breaks.

There are benefits to playing in a group, be it higher damage, more drops, etc., but you must remember that we're all exiles: sharing or stealing are choices that we must make. Not everyone is going to be a jerk, and not everyone is going to be nice, but you'll certainly find some of both just like in real life. It often starts with you: when players see that you are fair and play with honor, they often return it in kind. Sometimes these players make it onto your friends list, and as you fill your list with more "good" players, the game can become even more rewarding.

Someone begs you for an item? Tell them no. Or give it to them. Or trade it to them. The options are all yours.

The FFA loot system plays a big part in establishing the mood and setting of the game. A lot of players want gear to be divided up and handed out to them so that everything is equal and fair...but that doesn't fit the game thematically. This sunny era of hand-holding and participation trophies doesn't exactly fit the mold of Wraeclast. Life's not fair sometimes, otherwise you likely wouldn't have washed up on that beach in the first place.

Mmmmm...I see your point. However hell was destroying the world while angels twiddled their thumbs, and D3 hero's still got a fair loot system :p I get it though, you want to have some mood inspiring work of art blah blah blah. I personally don't think it should hold a higher priority than making group play more playable.

I really think looting rules should be set by league. FFA loot is a form of PvP. Players who didn't elect to be in a PvP league should not be pushed into any sort of FFA loot scheme, timed or otherwise. If players want to join a FFA loot league, give them the option. Similarly, give players like me who really dislike PvP the option of dedicated loot.

The timer system is not a solution. It just means you have to focus on running over to try picking up anything good before it expires rather than playing the game. That gets tedious really fast with the amount of loot that drops in PoE. As a result, I simply won't join public games.

Is that truly the intent of the devs? To push non-PvP people like me away from public games?

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MorriganGrey wrote:

I really think looting rules should be set by league. FFA loot is a form of PvP. Players who didn't elect to be in a PvP league should not be pushed into any sort of FFA loot scheme, timed or otherwise. If players want to join a FFA loot league, give them the option. Similarly, give players like me who really dislike PvP the option of dedicated loot.

The timer system is not a solution. It just means you have to focus on running over to try picking up anything good before it expires rather than playing the game. That gets tedious really fast with the amount of loot that drops in PoE. As a result, I simply won't join public games.

Is that truly the intent of the devs? To push non-PvP people like me away from public games?

That seems to be their intent for the "default" league. Perhaps there will be a non-standard league where players can leave valuables laying on the ground forever without worrying over brain-cramping issues like having available inventory space before leaving town.

One thing I like about FFA loot is that everyone in the game sees what drops and, even if they aren't the ones that got to pick up and ID the item, there is often some excitement between the other players over what the item turned out to be. "Wow! Really nice, man!" "Damn! So close!" etc.

You lose that element of the treasure hunt in an assigned-loot system. It's about highs and lows: you should feel excited when a rare item drops and you should feel excited when you're the one who snags it. Likewise, you should be disappointed if you aren't the one who grabs the item, but you should still be excited that it dropped in the first place. Maybe next time it'll be you who grabs it!

But some of you don't want any lows, you want all highs all the time...and pretty soon the highs become normal, and normal isn't exciting. Removing FFA loot removes the concept of opportunity from the game as players are instead "fed" rewards by the game just for participating. And it's tedious making a dash for the good loot? Hacking up monsters and picking up loot IS the game; who convinced you that picking up loot wasn't part of an ARPG?

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MorriganGrey wrote:

I really think looting rules should be set by league. FFA loot is a form of PvP. Players who didn't elect to be in a PvP league should not be pushed into any sort of FFA loot scheme, timed or otherwise. If players want to join a FFA loot league, give them the option. Similarly, give players like me who really dislike PvP the option of dedicated loot.

The timer system is not a solution. It just means you have to focus on running over to try picking up anything good before it expires rather than playing the game. That gets tedious really fast with the amount of loot that drops in PoE. As a result, I simply won't join public games.

Is that truly the intent of the devs? To push non-PvP people like me away from public games?

PvP players should want a FFA system even less. When I invested heavily into HC d2 dueling, the last thing I wanted to do was spend 2-3 days searching for a particular item for my dueler only to have it snatched up by some other yahoo in a group game. There's not one single reason that FFA loot actually makes others want to group together. I can agree with it made drops more exciting due to the adrenaline rush of trying to be the first one to get it, but after a while, it gets old as well and you begin to just MF by yourself because you realize the precious free time you do have is better spent getting all of the gear the fastest to reach the most fun part of the game. Dueling...or Pvm for some people. Also....hacks tend to ruin FFA loot scrambles. Pickit/drophack anyone? So all in all, I agree with morrigan, make it based on league or by group.

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Aixius wrote:

But some of you don't want any lows, you want all highs all the time...and pretty soon the highs become normal, and normal isn't exciting. Removing FFA loot removes the concept of opportunity from the game as players are instead "fed" rewards by the game just for participating. And it's tedious making a dash for the good loot? Hacking up monsters and picking up loot IS the game; who convinced you that picking up loot wasn't part of an ARPG?

I have so many issues with what you said here that I don't even know where to begin so I guess I will just take it sentence by sentence. Your first sentence there is just plain inaccurate. My support of having a completely seperate loot system has absolutely nothing to do with not wanting to see the good loot the other players are getting. I'm fine with seeing good items that I cannot have if they were earned by another player. The problem is when an item I earn is stolen by another player. Remember in the current system we can see other players items, its just on a timer thats too short to make a big enough difference. You somehow appear to be insinuating that having seperate loot means that the loot you get is always good and never bad. Theres still plenty of lows where you don't get good items for long stretches of time, so the highs will always be highs and never "normal". You say that players are "fed" rewards from the game just for participating??? Thats ridiculous!! everyone earns loot the same way by defeating powerful monsters! We EARN the loot and it is not FED to us. Belittle it all you want but alot of us feel that it IS TEDIOUS to have to take your attention away from the monsters to make a mad dash for any good loot THAT HAS OUR NAME ON IT! I'm not just trying to be a jerk or anythign but IMHO the last sentence your wrote just makes you look plain dumb. Having to pick up the loot has absolutely nothing to do with this discussion. Its having to COMPETE for the loot. Its having to take your focus off of the acutal game to compete for the good items that you have waited for so long to finally find (Uniques). Picking up loot is awesome, competeing for it is NOT.

Group together = kill faster + more drops = more loot as compared to solo play, this applies when its FFA and this makes me join parties

plus its "funner" playing with other people..

Maybe it's just me but FFA loot never stopped me from partying up with randoms, if anything it makes me want to get ahead of them faster so I can get the drops first which then clears an area quicker so in the end everyone gets more drops because more monsters have been killed

The idea of this FFA loot scramble is so not fun to me.

Well, I can always play solo for as long as it remains fun.

What a waste of a game that would otherwise be fun to spontaneously group up in.

Sad face.

Yeah I would think a 30sec to 1 min timer before loot went FFA would make it more fun to party with randoms. As it is I only party with my friends, which isn't very often. Otherwise I run solo. I played D2 a ton but rarely partied up for just that reason.

Not that I am upset about it. But I think timed personal loot is the way to go. If you miss/don't want something it can still be up for grabs, but you are not playing the "I need to grab the good stuff" game, instead of "yay hack, yay slash!"