Death Penalties

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themaker94 wrote:

Why dont they just make it the usuall diablo style lose all your items!!!!
Naa just kiding well atleast lose some exp and get a debuff that like lowers your max health and damage and attack speed for 10 min

I think it is a great idea the once who dont like it tell me why ^^

I think debuffing as a death penalty is in generally a flawed concept. You have to think about it: why do you die in a game like this? Probably cause a certain part of the game was really difficult for you to complete.

If you debuff someone just before they do the same area, they are very likely to die again. Why? Because if they couldn't do it the first time they would certainly fail if their stats are worse than before.


An exp drop and maybe some damaged equipment (lost gold?) would be more appropriate.

Guys,please read the first 2-3 pages before suggesting anything.

One solution that promptly pops into mind is the concept of random outcome. While most games that utilise this concept try to hide it and keep its use from the player I have yet to see a game that is bold enough to be more forward and overt about it. So my take on it is as follows:

Make the recently deceased awake in the first circle of hell. Here they encounter the Wheel Of Resurrection operated by a demon. It features a wide variety of outcomes. The trick is if you "draw a blank" you are sent down into the next circle of hell where you encounter another, different Wheel with slightly worse options.

And so as you descend deeper and deeper into hell (there are 9 circles of hell if I recall correctly) you encounter darker versions of the Wheel offering less and less favourable outcomes.

Of course the bad outcomes (ranging from
*respawming in town instead of where you died (slightly bad)
*small/medium/huge XP loss
*small/medium/huge credit loss
*temporary impaired movement
*temporary locked skill
*changing appearance into something ridiculous
*complete skill loss (gem destroyed?) (more severe)
*invert controls temporarily
*temporary stat loss (STR/DEX/INT)
*a 1 minute screen where demons point/laugh at you
*temporary skill jam: skill might fire or not
*"Kiss Of Death"(5min): chance of HP dropping 50% for 1 min
*temporary HP/MP loss (50%)
*loss of all potions OR locked potions for 5 mins
*an evil twin appears in the wider area of death
*monster amount *2 for 5 min
*...
*loss of one complete level (very, very bad)
*a combination of some of the above (srsly BAD)
*a combination of all (worst and veeery rare case)
)

have to be balanced by some good outcomes (
*temporary stat boost
*earn some credits
*earn some XP
*movement boost
*temporary MP cost drop of one skill
*improved appearance
*temporary access to one random skill
*a (skipable) 1 min screen where people celebrate you
*temporary double: skill fires twice for the cost of one
"Kiss Of Fairies" (5 min): chance of HP max improving 50% (1 min)
*temporary HP/MP max improvemnt (50%)
*a friendly twin appears and fights by your side
*monster dmg /2 for 5 min
*...
* no combinations allowed
* ultimate jackpot: earn one random item (of all possible items)
)

The most neutral outcome would be respawning at the place of death with everything else as it where when you died. ("As it never happened.") Well except for the monsters that saw you reappear for they might be a bit pissed they have to slay you again. =)

Recap: 9 Wheels, every one either resurrects you (boni/mali attached) or sends you down to the next, slighty darker version of a Wheel.
Players always have the chance to try and secretly give the Wheel a pull/push to manipulate the outcome. If the operator catches you it gets mad at you and (respins the Wheel/chooses a bad outcome on the current Wheel for you/sends you down to the next Wheel directly).
(Chance of skipping the process:) Players also always have the option of bribing the Operator (typing in an amount of credits or offering an item). In case it accepts the neutral resurrection takes place. If it doesnt players are sent down one Wheel.

You know,I was just thinking about something like that,and then saw your post.I was like "holy shit".I like your idea of a wheel tho,I was just thinking about a random penalty each death.You didn't make it clear (or I just can't read) if the buff\debuff from,let's say,wheel 1 carry over to the end?

Hehe, do we have some telepathy going on here?

You dont have to spin all 9 wheels every time you die. Every wheel consists of "Resurrection (+ bonus)", "Resurrection", "Resurrection (+ penalty)" and "Descend deeper into Hell" fields.

The last wheel of course doesnt have the latter.

So eventually you have to land on a "Resurrection" field. Once you do you get resurrected. The only question is does it have a bonus or a penalty attached. The deeper you descend into hell (and the darker the version of the Wheel becomes) the higher the chances for a penalty (and the degree of the penalty) get.

"-Each time u die, the Monster in a certain area around the death spot recieve a "moral" boost for x amount of time, which stacks the more u die.
Making them harder to kill for the duration of the buff."
-Narfi
i like this idea the best.

Death is more or less inevitable in a game like this; whether through bad luck, foolhardiness (or a system crash or lag), it is to be expected.

Yes, there needs to be a penalty, but, in the spirit of the game, how about making it more organic to the setting? Wraeclast is a dangerous wilderness haunted by supernatural horrors. Most folks who die and come back are rightly shunned as monsters.

I propose a two-fold system. For the players themselves, let there be a publicly-viewable "death mark" on each character, which indicates how many times, as well as how recently, a character has died. Over time (as experience accumulates), it fades to indicate that it's been a while since the character last got killed, with deaths in higher difficulties being more indelible without larger relative accumulations of exp/levels.

For the (friendly) NPCs, let there be some sort of social penalty, representing the palpable supernatural aura around a freshly-resurrected character. Again, over time, it will fade, but meanwhile, interactions such as purchases might be at marginally higher prices, while quest and gossip messages might have a more negative edge for a recent revenant.

Remember: The harshest penalties are often social penalties. People care what other folks think of them. Many players might not care if Nessa seems distant or Tarkleigh untrusting (though some might), but if folks can have some idea of how often or recently you've failed to win a fight, it could become a new dimension in measuring a character's success, even in the Default league. =^[.]^=

I suggest adding in a field of vision loss when you die.

Basically when you revive for however many minutes you set probably for 1-2 minutes, your field of vision is smaller.

Dungeon - Your light source is smaller so you can see less entities/mobs/etc around you.

Outside - Maybe add a blur or blind effect except for a small-medium radius around your character?


So pretty much like a "Blind" spell when you die and revive, and you can also maybe add an item or npc to remove the status.

the most common is 10% repair/xp loss in games.

however i would like to suggest:

1. after you respawn you have a debuff that lasts for say 5 or 10 minutes where you gain NO xp or loot. Once the timer runs out the debuff disappears and things go back to normal.

2. Xp loss but also have a 1 or 2% chance to de-level (lose 1 character level).

I think it should just be kept simple, and to me the best system would be xp loss or something like a reduced magic find chance applied to the character for a certain amount of time or both.