Stringing on the Kickstarter customer, or Why this game needs to die

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Boem wrote:
Gonna write down some assumptions that relate to this thread.

What if GGG set out to make a niche game for a niche crowd, it worked and was thriving.

With the failure we know call D3 however, they saw an opportunity and like any smart business man would do, they embraced this and used it to there advantage.

Multiple assumptions can be made why such a route is plausible, likely.

1) overall funds in a long term strategy
2) pressure of the CEO to provide payment and sustain a dozen if not more family's, not ignoring the permanent cost's associated with development and maintenance
3) company exposure or RP route

All of these would justify moving away from the original design goal in favor of providing that original goal at a later date but with a healthier company to back it up.

I don't find it unreasonable to consider GGG might in a few years time return to there original niche design and make a new game based around that concept, while keeping PoE running to facilitate both projects.

This would remove part of the pressure of relying on a niche crowd fund plan alone, which is in my opinion an unstable form of funds.(from a CEO's perspective that is after all still running a business and has to sustain family's and take responsibility for his actions)

They could have also potentially taken the route they are walking now in favor of more funds, but not because they are greedy but because of necessity. We know for a fact that they are still looking for people to work at GGG, it might have been the case that the payment they where offering simply did not convince people in the position they are looking for to come over to the NZ to work at GGG's office.

Say what you want, but a better pay-check is often a solid motivator to make people move or consider a position.

Honestly i can think of a dozen reasons why the current model and route is more beneficial for GGG in the long run and that's why i can't really hold it against them. Even if i personally enjoy the core "hardcore" experience more and am more of an "original target audience" of them. I still enjoy myself and i hope if they continue to make smart choices we will eventually see something worth-while and maybe even a development of a niche game some of the people in this thread desire.
(backed up by an established company that is)

Spoiler
/apply's rose tinted glasses to face <.<


All assumptions, but i don't consider them unreasonable.

Peace,

-Boem-


My problem with this is that there's not much real consensus about what specifically the vision was that GGG left behind. About the only thing I see CB people agreeing on is that uniques presently don't fit the original design intent of uniques, and typically this is really all about Shavs (though other build-enablers like Mjolner qualify as well).

I just don't get it. PoE is every bit of the hardcore ARPG that D3 was not. IMO it's actually a better game in many respects than Diablo 2, though certainly not in all respects.
The 352nd character to hit Level 100 in Standard
The 82nd character to hit Delve 1000 in Standard
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tackle70 wrote:
About the only thing I see CB people agreeing on is that uniques presently don't fit the original design intent of uniques, and typically this is really all about Shavs (though other build-enablers like Mjolner qualify as well).
I think there is a general consensus among us older types that ES in general has been mismanaged as a game mechanic, made to feel like "blue Life" rather than a distinct defense. Shavronne's gets a lot of attention because it represents the intersection of ES complaints (valid ones, by my reckoning) and unique item complaints. There is some truth to your statement: you might find a CBer who is okay with how ES has changed, or how uniques have changed, but seldom both.

Heck, even Slurms, formerly famed CB GGG fanman, has a passionate hatred for Ghost Reaver, last I checked.
When Stephen Colbert was killed by HYDRA's Project Insight in 2014, the comedy world lost a hero. Since his life model decoy isn't up to the task, please do not mistake my performance as political discussion. I'm just doing what Steve would have wanted.
Last edited by ScrotieMcB#2697 on Feb 14, 2015, 11:56:44 PM
no actually, most of us love the game and think the uniques, mechanics like energy shield etc are fine, you know, those of us who actually play the game and arnt just here because we have nothing better to do. Stop speaking like you talk for any meaningful sized group of players, you dont.

The game is amazing, if you dont like it go play hearthstone or whatever it is you do like playing, this obviously isnt the game for you.
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Snorkle_uk wrote:
Stop speaking like you talk for any meaningful sized group of players, you dont.
I do not claim to be speaking for anyone except myself. I asked other people to do me a favor, and explained why. Nowhere do I speculate on popular opinion, nor do I care. This "group of players" I am addressing (not speaking for, but speaking to) doesn't need me, and you can see some of them speaking for themselves in this thread.

The only person here claiming to represent "most" players here is you. You should follow your own advice.
When Stephen Colbert was killed by HYDRA's Project Insight in 2014, the comedy world lost a hero. Since his life model decoy isn't up to the task, please do not mistake my performance as political discussion. I'm just doing what Steve would have wanted.
Last edited by ScrotieMcB#2697 on Feb 15, 2015, 1:09:44 AM
"I think there is a general consensus among us older types that ES in general has been mismanaged as a game mechanic"
Last edited by Snorkle_uk#0761 on Feb 15, 2015, 1:30:54 AM
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ScrotieMcB wrote:
I think there is a general consensus among us older types that ES in general has been mismanaged as a game mechanic, made to feel like "blue Life" rather than a distinct defense. Shavronne's gets a lot of attention because it represents the intersection of ES complaints (valid ones, by my reckoning) and unique item complaints. There is some truth to your statement: you might find a CBer who is okay with how ES has changed, or how uniques have changed, but seldom both.

Heck, even Slurms, formerly famed CB GGG fanman, has a passionate hatred for Ghost Reaver, last I checked.


Totally agree with ES changes. I will always prefer the CI of old and chaos being special rather than an elemental missing pen and curse gems.

The uniques I disagree with though. I find nothing wrong with having very powerful uniques that are BIS for the build they allow. LL builds basically didn't exist before shavs. Mjolnir builds only exist because of the item, it's not like it's a normal build that mjolnir is suddenly BIS for. Also because these items are so rare (to the fact I've played a ton since all of them have been introduced and have never found one) means they are the carrot at the end of the rope. I fail to see how these items ruin the game. I'd argue a game without these type of items will get stale. It's another layer of complexity and another goal.

As for Slurms, I talk with him often and while he doesn't like GR, he also made a LL Mjolnir build in rampage (the last season) after finding mjolnir and shavs (among other GG items, fucking dude is unbelievably lucky). He is also just burnt, shit I'm pretty burnt too after rampage. Both of us still love this game and are waiting patiently for act 4 to play the shit out of it when it gets here. He was just asking me the other day if there was any news of act 4.

So don't confuse dislike of current things with hatred of how everything has turned out. I'm sure you could point out many things that I dislike that have changed from CB, remember you and I were both very critical of things back in OB but both loved playing (I did at least).

So I honestly don't know how people like you, witt and whoever else has come forward can really trash the entire game as it's stands for a few changes you don't like. As from the sounds of it it's a bunch of small things coming together to feed your displeasure rather than large things.
Finished 17th in Rampage - Peaked at 11th
Finished 18th in Torment/Bloodline 1mo Race - peaked at 9th
Null's Inclination Build 2.1.0 - https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1559063
Summon Skeleton 1.3 - https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1219856
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Snorkle_uk wrote:
"I think there is a general consensus among us older types that ES in general has been mismanaged as a game mechanic"


It has.

E: yup, burnt on PvE. Playing pvp games til I get my hands on A4.
Last edited by SL4Y3R#7487 on Feb 15, 2015, 1:35:31 AM
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Snorkle_uk wrote:
"I think there is a general consensus among us older types that ES in general has been mismanaged as a game mechanic"


To anyone who played CI in CB, and remembers it's unique and OP playstyle, I can't believe they're happy with it's virtually useless and redundant feel now-a-days.

So while he probably didn't poll the users and is going from the people he talked with I tend to think he's probably not far off in say such.

I mean shit, go check the class forums and look for CI builds. I think there are more hybrid life/es builds than CI now-a-days. Clearly people don't favor it much anymore and in CB it was essentially the "shav" type build of it's day, being the one that everyone saved up to do, the late late game build.
Finished 17th in Rampage - Peaked at 11th
Finished 18th in Torment/Bloodline 1mo Race - peaked at 9th
Null's Inclination Build 2.1.0 - https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1559063
Summon Skeleton 1.3 - https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1219856
"
SL4Y3R wrote:
"
Snorkle_uk wrote:
"I think there is a general consensus among us older types that ES in general has been mismanaged as a game mechanic"


It has.

E: yup, burnt on PvE. Playing pvp games til I get my hands on A4.



why? its distinctly different from life, both work, hybrid life + es is a thing, ci is a thing, theres no best option, theyre all different and have strengths + weaknesses. Theres no consensus, I dont even see a problem.

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