Snapshotting
" When you swap out from your bow, and move to a melee wep after gaining those frenzy charges, you're not still gaining the crit chance/damage/other stats on the bow... That's the difference. IGN = Dellusions_Duelist
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Mark, would still like some clarification if Remote Mine + Trap combo no longer works for direct damage spells. I understand that their not allowed to double dip from passives anymore, but do you also lose the support damage from Remote Mines more multiplier?
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" No, the ones that won't gain the benefit of mine/trap are the ones that create new objects. So: 1) Trap+Mine no longer stack. 2) Trap and Mine no longer increase the damage of Totems (totem is a new object and uses it's own skills) 3) Trap and Mine no longer increase damage of any Minions. EDIT:4) Skills that are traps or mines already (Fire Trap/Freeze Mine) don't benefit from trap/mine support gems. Last edited by winniethewhor#7631 on Jun 19, 2014, 8:52:08 PM
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So if trap and mine DMG no longer apply simultaneously why are they grouped together on the skills tree. Its almost like this exploit was meant to be exploited. You can't tell me there was a lack of foresight to see this.This should have been addressed before these passives came into existence.
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" From my understanding of it, you can raise any kind of spectres you want, but you only have a certain amount of supports to work with. So, if you raise a 4L Tentacle Miscreation with Physical Projectile Attack Damage, Culling Strike and Minion Damage and then switch those supports out for GMP, Faster Projectiles and Faster Casting for a Flame Sentinel spectres, the Tentacle Miscreation will now have the second set of supports instead of the first. (I know I explained what you already knew there for the most part) |
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" We shouldn't have to respec because you fixed a bug, so RF hopefully will be getting buffed as a result, even if it's 100% increased damage it's good enough as the atziri scepter will be another goal to reach, even with no damage buff at all it 100% NEEDS the base AoE radius to be increased enough to counter the loss of carcass jack, honestly I found it difficult and annoying to play RF with such a small AoE radius, the carcass jack felt like a requirement. Last edited by oBLACKIECHANo#6895 on Jun 19, 2014, 10:02:26 PM
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" I imagine the original intention was simply thematic and utilitarian. Mines and traps traps are fundamentally similar (given that a mine literally a kind of trap) and there's not that much space they can put new stuff on the skill tree without really remapping an area. Remember, the skill tree still needs to be legible, even though it's complex. EDIT: " Or you could just wear carcass jack. Last edited by winniethewhor#7631 on Jun 19, 2014, 10:28:11 PM
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" irony - noun - ^ that. " this makes absolutely no sense and isn't even remotely comparable. the specter skill RAISES and retains 1-5 spectres (depending on gear/passives. wait, maybe 1-6...). if i run 5 spectres, each spectre is only 20% of the skill. the dual strike is an attack. it... attacks. it's not a minion. your example is just plain absurd. and it also doesn't even address the point - 4 (or 5, or 6) supported spectres is 4 supported spectres. they EACH get the same amount of links. they don't multiply. their links don't stack. there's no circumventing in this. if we can't use DIFFERENT supports for spectres, all it means is that we have no incentive, whatsoever, to diversify spectres. we'd have every incentive to run the type of spectre that's being most supported... 4/5/6 times. it's LESS diverse (and less fun) and more tedious - the OPPOSITE of the stated claim for this change. you say it's not fair that a summoner gets supported spectres because of dual strike. this makes no sense and is 100% irrelevant. the active spectres are going to be fully supported, one way or another. scenario : spectres in a 4L with minion life, minion damage, and raise spectre... a 4L ranged spectre with gmp isn't any more powerful than a 4L evangelist with inc dur or a 4L necromancer with aoe or a 4L bear with faster attacks. using one of each is STILL only 4 4L spectres. they don't multiply. they don't combine their skills. there's no "9L" spectre or "11L chest" in this like someone fallaciously claimed. there are no synergies, and they're not voltron. they don't combine into megaspectre with extra supports. if we can't use different supports, everyone's going to use one type. that's it. it's simple. and it has nothing to do with dual strike... ever. get ready to see any remaining summoner running nothing but evangelists... or whatever the token spectre of the patch is. diversity's dead. stick a fork in it. using your logic, dual strike has an unfair advantage because it can be supported with a gazillion different gems, unlike portal. or auras. ...or RF. so unfair! [Removed by Support] "Your forum signature was removed as it was considered to be inappropriate and a breach of our Code of Conduct." ...it was quotes. from the forum. lolz! Last edited by robmafia#7456 on Jun 19, 2014, 10:40:42 PM
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" I generally don't like doing this, because it is quite obvious that you are inclined not to admit that what you are proposing is indeed snapshotting, but a lot of what you are saying here is just reaching. First and foremost, the skill only raises 1 spectre on it's own, you have to augment it through the passive tree and gear for more, so saying each spec is only 20% of the skill is a ludicrous reasoning when comparing it to an attack skill. That would be like saying one attack is only X% of the skill with faster attacks added on. So, keeping that in mind, the question becomes: Why should summoners be allowed to have one single skill that creates 2-4 different spectres with different supports that can all be "used" at the same time, but no other build has a skill with such a capability? " Again, I feel a reach. Your minion is just a minion... it still has to do something! Either attack or cast a spell. As Mark has already pointed out, even a zombie's attack is a skill they have to use. " Each may have the same amount of links, but if the links have different supports in them, supports that are no longer in the item after being switched out, it is still snapshotting! The biggest reason to stop snapshotting is to stop snapshotting, not just to create more diversity and fun (and who knows what ideas they have that can now be implemented with the removal of this). Spectre diversity will likely be null and void because of this, but if it is a means to an end to stop snapshotting then I will gladly accept that. Believe me when I say I know this will somehow be refuted by you, but at the end of the day, it really does not matter. This is still going to happen when the patch goes through. A dev, of all people you have argued with on this, has stated as much. Last edited by GoatEatingToilet#3170 on Jun 19, 2014, 11:10:12 PM
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Latter half of this thread tl;dr
robmafia is really mad and refuses accept change. |
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