Resistance Penalties (and a league to test them!)

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MorriganGrey wrote:

I was wondering if you're looking at resist flask duration, as they will become important and the current duration is woefully short. Also more passive tree resist nodes would be welcome as options if the cap will be -75%. Witches don't really get much as far as resist other than the 12% walker nodes and we have to spend a point on unwanted damage types to get to them.

Very good idea. I have never equipped a resistance flask because the duration is so poor, and the opportunity cost of losing that flask slot is way too big when there are better flasks out there.

I would like to see more resistance passives on the tree too, in clusters like most other nodes. Why not also combine them with notables? Eg elemental damage with a token resist buff for that element.

With the passive tree I'd like to see more of one type of resistance in the corresponding part of the tree.

For example: Lightning resist near Ranger, Fire near Marauder and Cold near Witch.

Edit: I'd also like to see a bit more emphasis on negative resist properties from the environment, other players and map mods, rather than the difficulty. We already have some things like Elemental Weakness and Elemental Equilibrium which are great but...

For example: Instead of just a straight diff change adding to resist penalty, just make is so that a particular area or mobs has/have a bigger penalty in higher diff. Maybe the martyrs in merci have a much more extreme fire resist penalty but not other fire damage mobs in different areas, like terraces, pyramid or caverns.

I'm sure my suggestion direction was already brought up and shot down ^_^

If anything these resist changes will do wonders for micro play, people surely will need to focus more on dodging elemental projectiles etc. It's amazing how easy places like sins become once you time your kite right.

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KatGunz wrote:

If resistances were to take such a big hit, I feel like it would restrict the amount choices being made with gear, because resistance would be an absolute necessity.

Certainly devalues the unique items, most which are sans any type of resists.

I like this.
Very reminiscent of Diablo 2.

Also PoE needs to be harder.

Don't forget that in D2 we had "Torches" "Annies" and other charms as well to make up for shortfalls in resistances.

Also If I recall the Anya quest gave 10 or was it 20 to all resistances. That was a damn site more than we'll be able to get from Kraytin while also loosing the opportunity to get the life from Oak.

BUT THIS is PoE and not D2 - I welcome the change - Let's Play!

This is great!
Been waiting for this to happen for awhile now.
Looking forward to testing this out, well played GGG :)

Eh I'm not a big fan of the stepped resistance reduction thing personally.

What makes more sense is to have a elemental resistance rating which provides a percentage resistance based off the monster level attacking you.

For instance, you could have 50 resistance rating early on in the game and get 75% resists from it, but later on that 50 resistance would be worth far less resistance — maybe only 10% at level 60 or so.

Changing resistance percentage to resistance rating also fixes the fact that resistance gains were non-linear.
If you had 0% resist but gain 10% resist you've gained about 10% damage reduction (11%), but if you had 70% resist and gain 10% resist you gain three times as much (33%) damage reduction. By changing to an elemental resistance system you can linearize the non-linear effect of gaining resistance.


Adding abrupt resistance changes does two things:
1. It doesn't make gradual changes, which can be annoying or frustrating for players. It makes the beginnin of that difficulty much-harder/harder and the end of that difficulty normal/easy.

2. Doesn't deal with the non-linearity problem with resistances. In fact, it makes the nonlinear problem even worse! If a person had -100% resistances and gains 10%, they're now only mitigating 5% damage compared to before, instead of 10% or more that it would normally be.


As game developers I assume you guys would be aware of this, but with that in consideration I don't see why you would still choose to use this —in my opinion— outdated/annoying scheme. Filling me in on your thought process would be helpful.

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Chris wrote:

We're going to introduce additive elemental resistance penalties of:

• Normal: 0%
• Cruel: -25%
• Ruthless: -50%
• Merciless: -75%

Dear Chris,

+1 for the idea of elemental resistance penalties.

-1 for the insane 25%/50%/75%. You are going to break the game! I will be wary and careful of such a big nerf.

So what happen if i build a char with all 75% resist? Isnt that going to be too much of a nerf?

I think the real issue is the high resist nodes in your passive skill tree. Those should be nerf!

I think it should be more of these:-

• Normal: 0%
• Cruel: -10%
• Ruthless: -20%
• Merciless: -30%

Also you need to boost the Krait's reward to +14% all resist.


OR

Simply what Xapti have said, adding Resist Rating mod to the current Resist % mod.

I'm glad to see that change coming. It will help to balance the difficulties better and bring more importance to the resistance modifiers on items. That -25% per difficulty isn't really that much considering some items provide tons of resistances (eg. some rings with implicit res + random res + all res are sometimes almost enough to cover 75% for one of the resistances). Astral Plates will be surely more valuable now. :)

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Vaphobos wrote:

I already ignore 98% of items (even with 118/376 MF)

Playing in merciless is already hard enough if equipped with MF gear.

There should be always a trade - MF for safety. The more MF you have the harder it should be to the point when stacking tons MF, like in your example, should prevent from making any major progress.

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Chris wrote:

And yes, I don't think players die enough ;)

That's what I think as well and I only play HC ;)

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Chris wrote:

I do expect we'll be reducing monster elemental damage overall somewhat. I think that having 75% of the new resist will be worth more than 75% of the current resist.

If maxing the resistances won't be as hard as some people think you may unintentionally make the game even easier that it is now. Instead nerfing elemental damage monsters perhaps make the res flasks more useful by extending their effect duration?

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Xapti wrote:

What makes more sense is to have a elemental resistance rating which provides a percentage resistance based off the monster level attacking you.

You are right that the rating-based resistance would be better to control actual damage and balance stuff. I even suggested the same in some other thread. But now when I look at it from more distance I see some benefits of the current system:
1. It's easy to understand even for new players end more intuitive.
2. We already have relative evasion and armor systems so why not keep the res system different just to make things more interesting.
3. Most trivial reason is that people got used to that cap system. Years of playing that other game make it almost impossible to change the habit now ;)

so physical builds for pvp will become more underpowered compered for they're elemental build counterparts :/