Is this a trading game or an arpg?

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differentone#3989 wrote:

I played for 150 hours and got to level 82. I spent most of this time on the trade system, because I couldn't drop or craft a single item to equip (I'm talking about an item of quality that can play endgame content).

For example, a body armor with a Spirit add-on or a helmet that grants a minion level has never dropped for my character. (I even wanted to push my luck and got equipped with 150%+ IR items)

If I had used the drops and didn't trade at all, I wouldn't even be able to complete a level 1 map within the Atlas system. The game forces me to trade and I spend hours and hours, even reaching out to someone to buy is a pain because most of them don't respond and it can take hours to find someone who does. Those who do not respond to an item for sale and those who waste time should definitely be banned in the trade system.

I wonder if I'm really unlucky and shouldn't keep playing the game, or instead play a racing game or something? How is this situation with you? Maybe I'm doing something wrong and you might have some suggestions.

Thank you and regards.

Assuming from given facts and some brief context, you are playing a summoner build struggling with relatively lesser damaging ability against the contents you are facing currently.

As far as I played supposedly an ordinary Infernalist summoner up to lv.80 (then spent few levels just for trying out as many combination of skills as the game could reasonably provide for me), I understand the situation you experienced in terms of endgame progression but not really about the arguments over the fundamentals of current game system.

Btw, I switched my build completely at lv.80 where I was struggling with every massive spawns such like Breach or Ritual in T10 or higher maps.

Would you mind share more details about your build and game play ?

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Absxky#9945 wrote:

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AliquamGames#5952 wrote:

I was running till T6 maps completely fine without a single bought gear piece and I don't even play meta builds. If you claim that T1 is impossible without trading then, well, skill issue.

Another +1 to this.

I don't usually like to say skill issue, but it's likely the case here.

+1

PoE 1 and 2 are both balanced having trading in mind. But it is completely fine to be played solo self found, without any trading.

The thing most players don't understand is that this is a farming/grinding game. At some point you may simply have to stop the progression in difficulty, stay on one difficulty and farm here for item progression. Depending on luck this can take an hour or multiple days.

The other thing is crafting. Many people have decent bases dropped but refuse trying to improve them. There is always a decision to make. Do I save currency and try to buy an upgrade, or do I use some of the currency to try to improve decent items that dropped.

As an example. If you need a +2 minion helmet, I would suggest that you highlight basically every normal and magic helmet base that you are willing/able to equip in your lootfilter. Then use Orbs of Transmutation and Augmentation and check if you got the +2 minion affix. If so you can slam it with Regal and Exalted Orbs. On the helmet +2 minion will have a higher priority, on other items life and resistances will have priority.

It's a trading game with some arpg features. The company is called "Grinding Currency Games" for a reason.

Trading game or ARPG.

If we had to pick only one of those labels, it would be a trading game hands down.
But it can be both you know.

They just really ought to add trading functionality that doesn't require seller and buyer to meet in person...

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The_Song#4903 wrote:

Trading game or ARPG.

If we had to pick only one of those labels, it would be a trading game hands down.
But it can be both you know.

They just really ought to add trading functionality that doesn't require seller and buyer to meet in person...

I understand QoL things but if you consider "crafting material" as market currency, market price controls the cost of crafting thus the price of items. If you want to make those balanced, there has to be any sort of enforcement to craft to support the supply, where the market drives the cost of crafting.
It's positive feedback loop so basically there is no "passive limiter" unless any enforcements. (it's pseudo chicken race. who's gonna be crying first ?)

You don't have to care about those things and you don't have to hesitate to play a farming build either.

Edit
My suggestion is to find a way to make the build transition.

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anicho#3148 wrote:

I genuinely think better guides on how to craft, and farm good base items is crucial here.

yeah for sure, and honestly i think the crafting system they have envisioned is just wrong.

a player like this cannot hope to understand the base item, mods and thent rans/aug/regal/exalt system of crafting enough to get good results. they just cant its too much to ask of them.

during campaign i think they need to just give players more alchs. a player can understand they need a hat or a crossbow and throw an alch on a white base. its a 1 extra step smart loot, you know the sort of item you need and you generate rares of that type yourself. thats easy to explain with a tutorial and people can do it.

"

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anicho#3148 wrote:

Regardless trade system does need an eventual upgrade, it feels too much like a facebook group marketplace or something lol and isnt the best experience. Huge imbalance right now on cost for items too.

mmm, i dunno tho m8, mixed feelings.


put it this way, trade is 500x more effective for getting the item you want than playing the game and looting/crafting items.

do we really want them to make it 5000x more effective?


at some point if trade is too easy and too powerful then they have to start limiting item drops to balance that out. people say poe1 is balanced around trade, its really not, it works perfectly fine in ssf. tons of items drop, youre drowning in too many items and currency even self found. they want poe2 to work self found too, they dont want to feel they need to hold back loot drops because its too easy to get gear in trade which trivialises the game.




part of the thing is that poe has good items. thats because theres massive variance between bad, ok, good and amazing items. in other games like D3 theres very little difference between items, thats why no items feel special in that game. part of the thing with having such high item variance is that theres a massive power difference between having ok gear and great gear. this makes trade so much more powerful, so theres massive tradeoffs here i dont think most people appreciate.


do we want a game where items are more shit like d3? not really right? do we want a game where we atually HAVE to trade because the drops are nuked to accomidaste a super easy trade AH? also no? do we want a game where people are pushed into this single player ssf mode to get good drops without trading, resulting in the game being like grim dawn, last epoch etc that are dead games becasuse single player mode games like that have no longevity and just die? again id argue no we dont want poe2 to die in 6 months we want it to last for 12 years like poe1.


so the price for all that currently is that trade is not easy to use. i know it can be frustrating but i think its at its worst right now with so many new players who have not yet learned trading etiquette. that will improve over time.

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Avaricta#4758 wrote:

PoE 1 and 2 are both balanced having trading in mind. But it is completely fine to be played solo self found, without any trading.

The thing most players don't understand is that this is a farming/grinding game. At some point you may simply have to stop the progression in difficulty, stay on one difficulty and farm here for item progression. Depending on luck this can take an hour or multiple days.

The other thing is crafting. Many people have decent bases dropped but refuse trying to improve them. There is always a decision to make. Do I save currency and try to buy an upgrade, or do I use some of the currency to try to improve decent items that dropped.

As an example. If you need a +2 minion helmet, I would suggest that you highlight basically every normal and magic helmet base that you are willing/able to equip in your lootfilter. Then use Orbs of Transmutation and Augmentation and check if you got the +2 minion affix. If so you can slam it with Regal and Exalted Orbs. On the helmet +2 minion will have a higher priority, on other items life and resistances will have priority.

this plus try and gambling for the item you want from alva at the refuge in act 3 cruel, alot of my items are from gambling.

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Is this a trading game or an arpg?

yes.

"

differentone#3989 wrote:

I played for 150 hours and got to level 82. I spent most of this time on the trade system, because I couldn't drop or craft a single item to equip (I'm talking about an item of quality that can play endgame content).

For example, a body armor with a Spirit add-on or a helmet that grants a minion level has never dropped for my character. (I even wanted to push my luck and got equipped with 150%+ IR items)

If I had used the drops and didn't trade at all, I wouldn't even be able to complete a level 1 map within the Atlas system. The game forces me to trade and I spend hours and hours, even reaching out to someone to buy is a pain because most of them don't respond and it can take hours to find someone who does. Those who do not respond to an item for sale and those who waste time should definitely be banned in the trade system.

I wonder if I'm really unlucky and shouldn't keep playing the game, or instead play a racing game or something? How is this situation with you? Maybe I'm doing something wrong and you might have some suggestions.

Thank you and regards.

"The game" knows what character you are playing....so it will never drop the "right" loot for you active character....to push the stupid trade system...ask yourself why are this other players sell very good ENDGAME items for your char? Because they don't need it for they char....
When you play magic it will drop very good loot for melee focused characters and when you play melee characters ig will drop great magic loot...so you need at last second (melee focused) endgame char to get good loot for your magic focused char....
Only time you get from time to time useful loot for your char is before endgame (in the campaign play). When you reach endgame it drops only garbage for you active char and good loot for char you don't play...