T17s are just bad, they need more rebalancing/changes or just delete them

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Lyutsifer665 wrote:

erm your sarcasm is def not obvious...there was a thread in general discu also where people missed your "sarcasm"

It is very obvious considering we only have two, maybe three, individuals on these forums trying to sell their opinions regarding T17 maps as "facts". Since you vividly participate in these discussions, past and present, you should know.

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BadAssTom wrote:

Again, this depends on what you call game.

Obviously all the content the game has to offer.

Early endgame (t16 maps and pinnacle fights) gets trivialized by random ground day 2 ground loot and endless stacking of power creep over the past years.
mid end game juiced t16, juiced invitations and +17 are trivialized not even a few days later by semi balanced gear.
Last station for content are juiced t17, and those are also trivialized about week 2 with a mostly well min-maxed and optimized build.

I don't count uber fights into the list as those fights are just a skill check rather than a gear check.
One player may be able to run those on bare bone gear while others still get their ass clapped on a min-maxed character.

So yes the content difficulty is subpar with todays standards of existing player power and became just pretty easy over the time.
But everyone who's around for a longer time knows that the endless stacking had a lot of impact over the years especially since we never really had any content balance adjustments to get the content on par with player power.
Sorry if you're new to the game, you'll get there someday.

There should be even harder content past t17 to offer something challenging to players with well min-maxed builds. At the very least content to actually encourage players to go all over with their build. double nerfed t17 maps simply don't cut it if they are trivialized by some mediocre min-maxed gear.

Honestly there should even be some content exclusive for players with mirror tier gear as those players don't even really have a playground.
Mirror tier used to be good during the mf days because you could stack up mf like crazy and still maintain player power.
The recent change made mirror tier gear mostly overrated.

It's a nice thing people can aim for if they want to but there's certainly no real use to fully utilize the gear in a useful way.
Unless you use it as a first aid bandage to fix lacking skill just to annihilate content with way less required player power.

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Pashid wrote:

Early endgame (t16 maps and pinnacle fights) gets trivialized by random ground day 2 ground loot and endless stacking of power creep over the past years.
mid end game juiced t16, juiced invitations and +17 are trivialized not even a few days later by semi balanced gear.
Last station for content are juiced t17, and those are also trivialized about week 2 with a mostly well min-maxed and optimized build.

Are these your personal experiences? Or what is this based on?

And ok, so you run through trivial early endgame in two days, than few days later you complete trivial mid end game with semi balanced gear. Up to this point it might not be that off. And you arrive to t17s which after 2 weeks are trivial for you, right? I doubt that. I posted you link to video with challenging strategy. Just set it up and record showcase, there is nothing difficult on it. How you tirivialize it. Otherwise this is just empty blabbering of someone who has no clue how challenging can endgame setups be.

I don't doubt that power levels are higher now I think content is harder as well - it is provided by different scarabs and atlas options than in past along with inclusion of T17s. And certain combinations makes game very difficult.

Despite being new to game I can, very likely unlike you, really run all content game has to offer. There is not a strat which I know of which I could not complete and some of those are definitely not easy. And from own experience I can tell you that mirror tier gear does not make hardest content feel easy either. It just gets easier than it was, but definitely not trivial. At least not with my build which is actually considered pretty strong this league and I have invested in it about 5 mirrors. I also having doubts that you have ever came even close to power levels I have reached this league and again i don't consider pinnacle content easy.

Again, record showcase of running hard juiced T17 - ideally exactly that strat i posted you link to. Should take you just few minutes, right? Otherwise this is just some imaginary nonsense.

EDIT: Or actually, if you don't want to record video for whatever reason you can just say hi in game @unstoppablebruteforce and we can run one of my maps together. I would really like to see if you can do it easily. My usual setup is easier than fubgun unique farm, but still pretty challenging imo. If you surprise me I will than post here something like... Yeah, ok, this guy knows what he is talking about and has some valid points.

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BadAssTom wrote:

Are these your personal experiences? Or what is this based on?

Just check all the multiple hundred characters that do that each league since years and many leagues in various modes. It's nothing new by now that content is under tuned and subpar with the current existing player power.

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Pashid wrote:

Just check all the multiple hundred characters that do that each league since years and many leagues in various modes. It's nothing new by now that content is under tuned and subpar with the current existing player power.

What do you mean by that? How can I check what content are they running? How they are juicing? This is what matters, right? Not that someone is running T17s, but how is he running them. I don't know how to check this or if it is possible unless someone uploads video.

I like how the video linked doesnt have actual gameplay or anything just him talking about his strategy.

Theres no raw video of him running these maps with whatever build he is even using as well. So its not like hes showing how fast/slow/dangerous any of this is.

Bout the only thing on his channel is him insta deleting fortress boss.

Linked video doesnt really mean or show anything. Dont doubt he ran it looking at the insane gear put together but ... thats really all you can take away from it.

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Mashgesture wrote:

I like how the video linked doesnt have actual gameplay or anything just him talking about his strategy.

Theres no raw video of him running these maps with whatever build he is even using as well. So its not like hes showing how fast/slow/dangerous any of this is.

Bout the only thing on his channel is him insta deleting fortress boss.

Linked video doesnt really mean or show anything. Dont doubt he ran it looking at the insane gear put together but ... thats really all you can take away from it.

Are you talking about that fubgun unique farm linked video I posted? I ran it on bunch of maps and I think it is one of most challenging strategies out there if not the most challenging this league. I tried it first time on 8 fortresses while having about mirror and half worth toon and got deleted 4 times pretty early in map and 4 times I somehow cleared the map but was not able to kill fortress boss. Now I can do it pretty reliably, but it is still really challenging.

And in that video there is a link to google spreadsheet with builds he built probably this league only so you can check it there.

If you wanna find out how strong is your build than set it up exactly as shown in that video. Higher packsize you roll harder it gets. But minimum should be 70% and then you apply packsize chisels.

He is one of most high end players/streamers and lots of people are taking inspiration in what he is doing imo.

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Toforto wrote:

Yep, its exactly why I'm just gonna sell all of mine from now on. Always people paying lots of divines for these maps in bulk, that + Faustus selling my scarabs will be lots of free currency

See, you quickly found a solution to your issue. So it’s okay now to just close the thread.

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wkernel wrote:

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Toforto wrote:

Yep, its exactly why I'm just gonna sell all of mine from now on. Always people paying lots of divines for these maps in bulk, that + Faustus selling my scarabs will be lots of free currency

See, you quickly found a solution to your issue. So it’s okay now to just close the thread.

I mean, that's not really a solution more just the only thing I can do with these maps atm. Doesn't mean all the problems with them have gone away. All I'm saying is I'm gonna completely ignore this content and bulk sell them until they're fixed. Whenever that happens.

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Toforto wrote:

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wkernel wrote:

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Toforto wrote:

Yep, its exactly why I'm just gonna sell all of mine from now on. Always people paying lots of divines for these maps in bulk, that + Faustus selling my scarabs will be lots of free currency

See, you quickly found a solution to your issue. So it’s okay now to just close the thread.

I mean, that's not really a solution more just the only thing I can do with these maps atm.

It is what a reasonable adult would consider a solution. Don't like this piece of optional content? Don't engage with it. Simple.