I hope poe 2 wont be a one core skill spamming game

hope its slow game not super sonic with REAL craft system (no more rng trash)

We had a (mostly) deterministic crafting system. Once, during Harvest league. Everyone absolutely loved it. Grinding Gear has seen fit to make it weaker, narrower, and less deterministic with every league that's launched since.

Your hope for non-RNG crafting will very likely go unheeded. A core principle of Path of Exile, espoused by Chris himself, is that you should never have 'perfect' items. The design vision for the game is that there's always improvements to chase, ways you could have swaggier shit. RNG-based crafting that massively restricts top-end gear to the extremely rare Lucky Roll outcome is the way they give people the ability to monkey with their stuff without letting anyone save the ultra-rich actually meaningfully craft items.

Will we get better crafting? I hope so. But I guarantee it'll still be RNG.

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1453R wrote:

Will we get better crafting? I hope so. But I guarantee it'll still be RNG.

"Everyone"? Really?

Anyhow, crafting in loot based games is hard. Very hard. Sure, Harvest was fun, mainly in Ritual league (I hated the RTS garden building in Harvest league). But what it did to the game, undermining EVERYTHING else, was not that fun. The more deterministic crafting gets, the more limitation in terms of potential power there must be. And by all means, I'm ALL for a deterministic crafting option that can't brick your item, as long as you can't craft "the best" items with it.

Nah, this game needs to "fix" drops first, then worry about crafting afterwards.

But hey, it's all opinions.

I mean, the problem with 'crafting in a loot-based game is hard' is that everything you find in the ground is automatically dogshit. Even the best wild-dropped items are just Mid-Tier Acceptable at best compared to high-end crafting, and so far as I know high-end crafters brick a hundred bases for every success. Even if they don't, it costs thousands of divines to attempt high-level crafting, and that crafting is the only way to obtain 'The Best' items.

They've already dispensed with PoE being a "loot-based game" for anybody but the poors at the bottom. Why not let the poors in on at least enough of the crafting to actually be able to engage with Path of Exile outside of the trade interface?

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1453R wrote:

They've already dispensed with PoE being a "loot-based game" for anybody but the poors at the bottom. Why not let the poors in on at least enough of the crafting to actually be able to engage with Path of Exile outside of the trade interface?

Yeah, as I said; I'm all for a crafting system for "the poors", and make it as deterministic as possible, just cap the potential a little bit.

To be fair, I like the 'altering' part of crafting more than "craft on a white base". It just works much better with looting. I will ALWAYS be in favor of dropped loot having a better potential when it comes to affixes than crafting. I don't like the "start crafting on a white base" system. I LOVE the Incursion specific mods, or the Delve specific mods, where you have to hunt down an item with that mod - and then start crafting/altering it.

So, in short; make and improve the systems that combine looting, trading and crafting in interesting ways, instead of just adding a crafting system to rule everything, like Harvest was.

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1453R wrote:

We had a (mostly) deterministic crafting system. Once, during Harvest league. Everyone absolutely loved it.

You wouldn't guess it given the very average player retention of the league.

Anyway Last Epoch's base system is an actual healthy version of Harvest where mostly deterministically finishing items at the crafting bench is a thing, but grinding for rare drops also matters b/c you can't just start with a white base and turn it into the BiS item for yourself like you could in Harvest.

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Phrazz wrote:

The more deterministic crafting gets, the more limitation in terms of potential power there must be.

I mean no, it doesn't mean that. They can just accept that the game as whole is easier, kinda like they did when they introduced Delirium never gutted it and left it floating over the game ever since :p

If their objective is to have tight control of player power to ensure they can tune content correctly they are miles away currently as gets bandied about pretty regularly.

Personally I loved last Epochs system for crafting, it was dead easy to understand and intuitive but still required looting in the wild and farming to have enough odds to turn into something great. Harvest was very similar but had a much higher knowledge requirement and didn't really require repeat farming (only repeat harvests really).

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Draegnarrr wrote:

I mean no, it doesn't mean that. They can just accept that the game as whole is easier, kinda like they did when they introduced Delirium never gutted it and left it floating over the game ever since :p

If their objective is to have tight control of player power to ensure they can tune content correctly they are miles away currently as gets bandied about pretty regularly.

Personally I loved last Epochs system for crafting, it was dead easy to understand and intuitive but still required looting in the wild and farming to have enough odds to turn into something great. Harvest was very similar but had a much higher knowledge requirement and didn't really require repeat farming (only repeat harvests really).

I don't know LE's system, but if you "dead easily" and "intuitively" can craft better items than anything that will ever drop and better than 99% of unique/legendary items, I'm sure I wouldn't like it.

Look, you are of course right, "it doesn't mean that". But it sort of does, if you want a game where item drops matter. Finding certain items in the temple or in delve are the last bastions in PoE where I'm actually sort of excited to check out the affixes on an item. Why? Mostly because the mods can't be crafted. These are the systems I want them to expand on, to make LOOT more interesting (and semi deterministic) - and then a crafting system to alter that loot in certain ways.

IMO, every system that lets you craft EXACTLY what you want, as powerful as you want from a plain, white item is a bad system for an ARPG. And while all of my opinions here are probably just pipe dreams because I love loot, so is a 100% deterministic crafting option in PoE.

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Phrazz wrote:

I don't know LE's system, but if you "dead easily" and "intuitively" can craft better items than anything that will ever drop and better than 99% of unique/legendary items, I'm sure I wouldn't like it.

Nah this needs some caveats, you can't craft items better than what drop because it requires a drop in the first place (you need a good start to make a good item, a great start to make a great item etc)

Uniques still have shedloads of mods that can't be accessed elsewhere so are still just that, unique and that should be their primarily role. Can I craft a better bow than death's opus? Sure, can I craft a better chest for its role than lightning coil? Nope (using PoE examples here)

You can eventually add your own stats to a unique too which lets you make relatively bespoke uniques - Some of these can be pretty busted but obviously you could just curtail it by limiting the tiers or quantity that can be applied.

It has rng like any crafting system, you could get a great item and brick it in 2 crafts or you could get a garbage one and add 15 tiers to it (not that you would try with a garbage item).

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kalashnjkov wrote:

Let skills like cobra lash have charge and cooldown will solve the issue.

I change my mind when i start using vaal skills, these skills require soul to use which is better way to deal with dps spammable skill than using cooldown.

That's nonsense.
Myself and the majority of the friends I play with also like using 1-2 skills at most.

If you want to play with multiple skills go play a MMO, like WoW ?FF Online etc.
Not a ARPG. (Poe is a action RPG / hack n slash.)



On another note, everyone keeps mentioning Diablo 4..
You do realize that Diablo 4 died a while ago and has been struggling.
It is NOT popular.

When I played D4 at launch I had 50+ IRL friends playing with me. (Yes even I was astounded with how many people were playing..)
If I login now, just to see how things are going, there are ZERO.