Resistance needs to be converted to resistance rating

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Vejita00 wrote:

I am fine with the way it is done now but why not just have a resistance penalty on higher difficulties? That was how it worked in Diablo 2. Once you hit higher ones, you had like a cumulative -25% to resistances so you had to really work on getting your gear up to speed or you'd get eaten alive on higher difficulties by elemental damage.

It was -50% per difficulty.

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BrecMadak wrote:

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Vejita00 wrote:

I am fine with the way it is done now but why not just have a resistance penalty on higher difficulties? That was how it worked in Diablo 2. Once you hit higher ones, you had like a cumulative -25% to resistances so you had to really work on getting your gear up to speed or you'd get eaten alive on higher difficulties by elemental damage.

It was -50% per difficulty.

I thought -25% felt low. It has been awhile since I played D2. I feel a system like that would work well enough but you'd need to make sure better gear was available. I always felt that was part of the point, you couldn't just ride the same gear through an entire difficulty setting once you swap to the next one.
You'd get eaten alive. Of course D2 had exceptional and elite versions of gear I believe.

Flat negative resists in higher difficulties may be better than the system in place, but all it does is making the transition from one difficulty to the next rather punishing for the first few lvls, up until you got your next tier of resist gear. With the rating system you don't have that sudden jump, but a smoothe transition.
Constant vs linear (or whatever scaling chosen).

If you played diablo 3 by now (or are still playing) you will have experienced that the game keeps managing to get harder and harder, and the sole reason for this is that diablo 3 uses rating systems for all their defensive stats basically.

Even spells and auras are using ratings.
In Path of exile, if you have 6 endurance charges in act 1 normal difficulty, you have 35% to all resistances and 35% to physical reduction.

From the very beginning of PoE, you already are at half the maximum limit (without doing much).
This makes it impossible (yes i said impossible) to have several difficulties that keep increasing in difficulty, without making the first or second difficulty a joke.

Having played Diablo 3 now and having experienced first hand how ratings makes it so much easier for developers to balance the game, i will stop posting in this thread since i know that i am correct.
Its not a theory, its a fact you can prove on paper and witness in Diablo 3.

Whoever doesnt see that a rating system is superior to a % based system, regarding the balance of the game, is just stupid, plain stupid.

If GGG doesnt realize this, or dont have the courage to change the system this "late" then i dont see POE doing shit to D3.

I dont see myself switching to path of exile at all if they dont manage to balance the game properly (and right now the balance after normal difficulty is shit again, with one of the main reasons being that you are easily maxed on resistances after normal difficulty, the game is way too easy even against merveil in act 1 normal).

If they do stupid workaround tactics like in D2, where you lose a fixed amount of resistances when you enter the next difficulty level, then i will have lost all hope for them as developers.

For now ill stick with D3, since it just is the harder game.
Good luck making PoE hard with a % based system.

It sure is too bad we aren't allowed to like D3 AND PoE. Huh? Well, stick to D3 then. I'm pretty sure no one here cares.

Also, you haven't actually proven your case about PoE failing to "get harder and harder" like D3 does. Have you even got past act 1?

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notevenhere wrote:

It sure is too bad we aren't allowed to like D3 AND PoE. Huh? Well, stick to D3 then. I'm pretty sure no one here cares.

Also, you haven't actually proven your case about PoE failing to "get harder and harder" like D3 does. Have you even got past act 1?

Im pretty sure GGG cares about the 50 dollars i was gonna spend on PoE if D3 had turned out worse than PoE regarding difficulty.
Considering how PoE isnt using a rating system, its actually quite easy for Diablo 3 to surpass it in that regard.

If you dont keep your equipment up to date in D3, you will get slaugthered with each new level (starting from nightmare difficulty).
I cleared the whole normal difficulty naked in PoE (except weapons) because someone bet me to it.
Considering how the game gets easier from there, i dont see the point in going on.

Its amusing how you think GGG wouldnt care about money.
Just demonstrates further that you are a kiddo.

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gh0un wrote:

Considering how the game gets easier from there, i dont see the point in going on.

Its amusing how you think GGG wouldnt care about money.
Just demonstrates further that you are a kiddo.

1. You think it gets easier in harder difficulties.
2. It's a free to play game.

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notevenhere wrote:

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gh0un wrote:

Considering how the game gets easier from there, i dont see the point in going on.

Its amusing how you think GGG wouldnt care about money.
Just demonstrates further that you are a kiddo.

1. You think it gets easier in harder difficulties.
2. It's a free to play game.

EVERYONE agrees that PoE gets EASIER the higher you level.

That is a failing of linearly scaling (read additive %) effects.

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Torin wrote:

I would like to tune into this discussion with two things.

1. I propose a 3rd system: Fixed damage reduction. If I find a ring that says +30 fire resistance it actually reduces fire damage by 30. So if I have a total of 200 fire resistance it reduces each fire attack by 200 damage. Of course you can as now leave that attacks always do at least 1/4 of its damage (75% max resists like now).

A discrete damage reduction system would scale much in the same way a rating-based one does, but it has several problems that can't be helped due to its very nature.

1) It becomes a substraction system, as opposed to a division system. That means it is WILDLY affected by %-based bonus. If you have 70 resist and the enemy has 100 dmg, and the enemy gains a 20% bonus to damage, it means the damage you take jumped 66%... That's pretty insane and would most likely mean we have to rework every %-based aura and bonus in the game from the ground up.

2) It also makes resists absolutely necessary at higher levels, because it accumulates over your career. A lvl 10 character might face elemental nukes in the 100 dmg range and be expected to have about 50 reduction. But a lvl 60 character would then face 3000 dmg nukes and be expected to have around 2800 reduction. Which means any nuke on a naked character would instantly kill him.

3) It makes variety in elemental enemies impossible. Because the damage you take is not a % of the damage done, you can't have multi-projectile mobs that do 10 times 50 dmg and nuke mobs that do 500 dmg once. The multi-projectile ones would simply be useless, because each instance of damage they do would be reduced to nil.

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DoubleSmiggins wrote:

Fixed damage reduction could also work, and I feel that it'd be pretty easy to balance and understand.

I think that damage varies too wildly for it to work in its simplest form. You have mobs hitting for 200 damage, and mobs hitting for 1000 damage but several times slower. You'd either have to balance around armor that makes you invulnerable to 200 damage, or armor that hardly affects 1000 damage.

Then again, you could have fixed damage reduction with diminishing returns after 50%. So 300 damage reduction would only take partial effect and reduce 200 damage to something like 50, while taking full effect on 1000 damage and reducing it to 700.


But personally, I fail to see the problem with Diablo 2 style resistance penalties. Why not move the armor system to % physical resistance, and balance it with per-difficulty penalties?