Developer Q&A - Part I

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Revarine wrote:

Spoiler

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Kulze wrote:

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Revarine wrote:

When has ARPGs not been "pew-pew one shot zoom-zoom arcade shooter"s? D2 is the archetype, and clear-speed was as relevant then as it is now.

First of all, D2 was released back in 2000, that's a fairly early one, it was the pioneer of the genre at that time basically, shaping how the majority afterwards was released.

Yes, you could become fast, though on the other hand as you progressed you had to put more and more effort into your build, this felt 'ok-ish' to a degree.

Now let's take a step forward to 'modern' ARPGs which are well known:
Grim Dawn: Fights matter, no zoom-zoom boom-boom in general, each encounter feels somewhat meaningful with bosses, even some random mobs are fairly dangerous.
Torchlight franchise: Fairly casual, though nonetheless there were a few rather hard encounters on the higher difficulty levels, nonetheless those took a while to complete and the normal play-routine wasn't zoom-zoom...

Even Sacred 2 (with all its flaws) had better fights then PoE has now to a large degree.

Yeah, but that's a game design choice. It basically comes down to the opinions of the game designers and Chris Wilson. Like, I've always had in the back of my head an idea for an absolutely brutal, Dark Souls-ish ARPG, where random trash could absolutely murder you if you were caught off guard. Boss fights would take dozens of tries for ordinary mortals.

Would this be fun? Not for the majority of human beings. PoE is not this imaginary game, nor will it ever try to be this game.

I like how a good hit can clear the entire screen in PoE. More importantly, it's a intentional design choice. One of the biggest things that makes video games terrible is when it doesn't know what the hell it is.

Well, some of us remember PoE in a time when Piety was the "end game" boss, way before Dominus got added and r@ped his fair share of "hardcore" players...

Newsflash, PoE actually started as the "ONE AND ONLY HARDCORE ARPG" on the market. It then got flooded with casuals and "meta slaves" that want to enjoy the "pew-pew one shot zoom-zoom current arcade shooter @#%&fest". And that is fine. Let me repeat it, THAT IS FINE.

What is hurtful and totally demeaning is the fact that TencentGGG's "1K pretzel eating dev & balance meme teams" don't get that by doing that concession, they need to adapt and improve the game a lot more, on a lot more points than they managed currently...

And they don't get to call PoE an ARPG, not until loot actually drops and can be useful in a "timely" manner for a player without sinking his entire lifespan in an effort to actually grab a f@cking rare from the ground and use it with success in the goddamn end game... They really need to bring back some "real weight" to rare drops in contrast to them being "gud & up to snuff" via mainly "crafting" (and I mean "crafting" as in deterministic spamming for a specific outcome)...

As much as you can tout ARPGs were always fast, take a long look at those first ARPGs, and I do mean Diablo and it's more successful sequel that was followed by various ARPGs titles mentioned above (Titan Quest was and still is an epic one to be mentioned, Sacred series were also noteworthy, heck, even the first Dungeon Siege was a nice take on the genre, besides those newer additions like Grim Dawn, Torchlight series, Van Helsing series or Deathspank).

Those all had in common the fact that loot was meaningful, or at least more meaningful than the hideous "schmuck proof HIDE IT ALL" loot filter abominations which HIDE, and I emphasize HIDING GODDAMN LOOT in an ARPG, but without those PoE would simply be UNPLAYABLE in it's state...

Even Borderlands series managed loot on simply another level compared to PoE, and I mean it is mind boggling to see that RNG loot in contrast to the one in PoE...

So please, don't even start to try to provide excuses for TencentGGG. They simply need to "git gud & up to snuff" like yesterday...

this is awesome!

> We generally try to create content that doesn't require insane clear-speed.

Then you probably should not put every damn thing on timer. Abyss? Timers. Incursions? Timers. Delve? Crawler forcing to move forward is a timer. Betrayal? Lab missions have timer. Synthesis? Decay is a timer. Clearspeed capability is a strict requirement for a capable build. Slow character won't simply do stuff slower, it simply won't be able to do stuff.

> We are not adding a Trade Market to the PC version of Path of Exile.

Read: we can't make any decent loot system and have to make trade cumbersome to avert players from using it.

> Because people tend not to play content that doesn't have map drops, we picked the option where league content drops maps.

It does? Except for very rare encounters like specific chests in delve cities, having a map from non-map content is a very rare occasion.

> If we require players to be at their console for others to see their items then people will just find a way to get around it

Maybe just add afk trade then? Because afk players are making already awful trade system totally insufferable.

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spunm0nkey wrote:

this is awesome!

I hope you mean the post above you and not the Q&A

Since the post above you actually is, the Q&A was business talk which said basically nothing at all.

"We are not adding a Trade Market to the PC version of Path of Exile."

Perfect <3

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As a player who wants to delve and only Delve, is there any way to reduce the reliance on mapping to access Delve content?

The honest answer here is that we believe that game systems like Delve will become boring if you have unlimited access to them, and so it's important to limit their access by requiring regular Path of Exile play between sessions of special content.

The other factor that is Delve-specific is that rewards from Delve are strong, so it'd be an economic problem if people had more access.

Having said that, Scarabs and other game mechanics can help you trade for more Delve time.

Thanks for the honesty - it's always ballsy to tell people you know what they want better than they do. ;)

I know I could sometimes stand to do a lot more delving, with maps as a change of pace.

You always bring up rewards with delve.
Please clarify, are we talking about this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7K7fDSUFN6A

If so, it is important to realize that this is probably not what most people have in mind when they say they want to delve more.

Please nerf this to yield only 200C an hour if it means twice as much delving for players that for once enjoy a mechanic you created, not its rewards!

I really feel that Betrayal/Syndicate progression being character bound is not not healthy for the game, particularly taking into account the importance/value of Betrayal rewards. It comes down to a lot more than simply "Mastermind runs" and is not something that can be fixed by buffing the xp/progression gain from encounters. Betrayal is rather complicated and requires much interaction on a frequent basis for the player to manipulate and interact with it as they would like. Grinding for the Syndicate outcomes you wanted was hard enough in the Betrayal league itself. Now that it is locked behind a 20% encounter rate, and taking randomness/RNG into account it really feels like playing multiple characters is locking you out of this content and its corresponding rewards. I believe that Syndicate progression needs to be tied to the account like Delve progression currently is. The other option would be for the frequency of Betrayal/Syndicate encounters to be improved by a large margin, but this raises further concerns of other players, such as experiencing lag during Syndicate encounters or wishing to not interact with the content.

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Xeledon2132 wrote:

Please nerf this to yield only 200C an hour if it means twice as much delving for players that for once enjoy a mechanic you created, not its rewards!

Already done, you won't drop anything meaningful fossil-wise before... I think it was depth 59 or so? Well, at least after it begins to scale.

On the other hand obtaining sulphite reliably was removed since we can't target-farm Syndicate anymore. Which in itself is an issue with interceptions, as well as being another thing which needs around 100 maps to start paying off a single time, most likely not in form of a sulphite scarab then though.

So, we don't have ANY game-mechanics allowing us to reliably farm sulphite, all options are 'random hope', a master seeks help niko prophecy which triggers once in a lifetime commonly, not about actually getting one, and scarabs which we have to trade.

Which brings us back to trade meant to be tedious, hence obtaining Sulphite is supposed to be tedious and not fun, otherwise we would progress too fast while already having to pay for it anyway? I don't get the logic at all.

Overall

More than anything, I appreciate the blunt honesty.

I have been a gamer since before some of the dev team were (likely) born. Beyond that, before I retired, I employed dozens of developers. Also, I ran an animation company for several years. Though not a gaming expert, I truly believe I can confidently state that honesty is the most important thing that hard-core gamers are drawn too. For that thank you!

Specific

Still have absolute hatred for the "trading system", but that is a small price to pay for such a different, innovative game.

The reason trading is of importance to me is that aspect has been what has been the most pleasurable to me in most games in the past because it was something I could so on my own time-table. That isn't possible in PoE as a trader because I would have to be on non-stop to take advantage of trades. In my thinking, the current system promotes paid traders to make the majority of trades (people in nations that employ gamers to take shift-work on a trader). In fact, this is my experience. For the most part, I have much better luck when I see my whisper copied into non-English … I'm thinking, "awesome, someone will actually be on and respond so I can make a trade." And I have seen the same player be on at all times of the day/night (if non-English, but on an English server). As a buyer, I just want my map, armor, whatever, but as a trader, this is an issue since I know players that aren't there for entertainment are making those sales I could be making, but am living my life outside the game. The frustrating part of purchasing is that we are at the mercy of other player's attention. As a player, it is so very frustrating to be mid-map and have to use a portal to make a trade and then have to do so again just after re-entering the map.

I still believe there is a compromise that would serve the GGG's and player's desires here. I do have ideas of how we could at least bring all of the interface into the game, but that is only part of the issue. I do understand the price-fixing issues, etc. but even if it was required for the seller to be in-game and accept/reject a proposed sale (in some sort of auction house interface) would make it more convenient and reduce the issue with sellers not being willing to leave their map, delve, etc. when they are on. This would enable those players that are here for entertainment to do both - enjoy the content and make sales. It would also make it much easier to make a purchase on the buying side if sellers had an easier time of things. Better yet, make the public tab auto-sell if the seller is a) in-game and b) priced an item as non-negotiable. I accept that I don't know all of the factors, but don't understand why sellers must be forced to interrupt their content enjoyment to make a sale for some low-priced item.

Suggestions

1. It would be grand if we had the option to UPGRADE a normal, premium stash tab to a premium quad stash tab to reduce the number of tabs vs just purchasing a quad tab.

2. And we desperately need a fossil stash tab, but I'm sure you already know that and it's in the works.

Summary

I've had two careers … an ol'broken down Marine turned Creative Director … both professions that are typically professional "bitchers" so, it's all said in love for the game. I would not bother critiquing anything that wasn't worth my time :).

Thanks for all the hard work. It's an awesome time-sink!

S/F