POE is not a FREE TO PLAY

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Shagsbeard wrote:

You can create other characters to hold stuff.
You can create other accounts to create more characters.
I don't know about the mechanisms for creating a guild/guild stash because I've never looked into it, but if that's free you can do that too.

You choose not to because it's inconvenient.

Last Epoc isn't even in Beta yet.

Why are you saving all those essences that you'll never use? You can also cut back on the stones and scraps. 4 stacks of stuff you could find in an hour or two doesn't make sense. Keep one stack... if that.

Ugh...I get so tired of hearing the same lame excuse, "you can just create more ____. Don't be lazy!"

I really doubt any company or player actually thinks its a valid practice to create additional accounts or characters just to hold items. It's just a dumb copout some people use to validate bad design; like how saying "git gud" is just a meme now with little to no correlation to what it's in response to.

No, characters are there to be played, not to hold onto your items.
And no, you shouldn't be juggling multiple accounts to do the same thing. I'm pretty sure there are grounds for you to get banned for doing stuff like that in 99% of company's eyes.

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morbo wrote:

There's an asian guy playing RF builds in every SSF HC league and getting to lvl 100 sometimes. He plays with the dafault 4 tabs and one extra tab prob. bought with the starter pack. SSF is far tougher on stash space than trade leagues, mind you. So, no excuses, please.

That's because managing loot is the only difficult thing left in the game.

PoE is still free to play yet restrictive to some extent.

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JoeShmo wrote:

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Shagsbeard wrote:

You can create other characters to hold stuff.
You can create other accounts to create more characters.
I don't know about the mechanisms for creating a guild/guild stash because I've never looked into it, but if that's free you can do that too.

You choose not to because it's inconvenient.

Last Epoc isn't even in Beta yet.

Why are you saving all those essences that you'll never use? You can also cut back on the stones and scraps. 4 stacks of stuff you could find in an hour or two doesn't make sense. Keep one stack... if that.

Ugh...I get so tired of hearing the same lame excuse, "you can just create more ____. Don't be lazy!"

I really doubt any company or player actually thinks its a valid practice to create additional accounts or characters just to hold items. It's just a dumb copout some people use to validate bad design; like how saying "git gud" is just a meme now with little to no correlation to what it's in response to.

No, characters are there to be played, not to hold onto your items.
And no, you shouldn't be juggling multiple accounts to do the same thing. I'm pretty sure there are grounds for you to get banned for doing stuff like that in 99% of company's eyes.

I strongly disagree. Muling has been a part of almost every game in the genre that I can remember and I don't recall any game having rules against muling. Inventory tension isn't "bad design". It's an inherent part of this class of games. You may not like how low the starting inventory is but it's not necessarily a bad design decision to limit inventory space. We can argue all day about whether 4 tabs or 6 tabs or 10 tabs is the right limit but there should be a limit IMO.

My proposed solution to alleviate some of this stash envy was to give starting players a lower capacity currency stash tab for free. I made that suggestion the day they announced the currency tab. Nobody liked it as far as I know. My thinking was that it would generate some good will and certainly eliminate the frustrating currency tetris one has to play with regular tabs. Maybe they can still do something like that.

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Phaeded wrote:

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JoeShmo wrote:

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Shagsbeard wrote:

You can create other characters to hold stuff.
You can create other accounts to create more characters.
I don't know about the mechanisms for creating a guild/guild stash because I've never looked into it, but if that's free you can do that too.

You choose not to because it's inconvenient.

Last Epoc isn't even in Beta yet.

Why are you saving all those essences that you'll never use? You can also cut back on the stones and scraps. 4 stacks of stuff you could find in an hour or two doesn't make sense. Keep one stack... if that.

Ugh...I get so tired of hearing the same lame excuse, "you can just create more ____. Don't be lazy!"

I really doubt any company or player actually thinks its a valid practice to create additional accounts or characters just to hold items. It's just a dumb copout some people use to validate bad design; like how saying "git gud" is just a meme now with little to no correlation to what it's in response to.

No, characters are there to be played, not to hold onto your items.
And no, you shouldn't be juggling multiple accounts to do the same thing. I'm pretty sure there are grounds for you to get banned for doing stuff like that in 99% of company's eyes.

I strongly disagree. Muling has been a part of almost every game in the genre that I can remember and I don't recall any game having rules against muling. Inventory tension isn't "bad design". It's an inherent part of this class of games. You may not like how low the starting inventory is but it's not necessarily a bad design decision to limit inventory space. We can argue all day about whether 4 tabs or 6 tabs or 10 tabs is the right limit but there should be a limit IMO.

My proposed solution to alleviate some of this stash envy was to give starting players a lower capacity currency stash tab for free. I made that suggestion the day they announced the currency tab. Nobody liked it as far as I know. My thinking was that it would generate some good will and certainly eliminate the frustrating currency tetris one has to play with regular tabs. Maybe they can still do something like that.

Muling had only been a part of some games because there wasn't adequate storage space. Nobody is going to argue that Diablo 2 stash space was adequate; the fact players risked losing items by dropping them on the ground to be picked up by their other characters doesn't mean it was an intended or okay design. No, it was a bad design.

I also didn't say there was rules against muling, I said there was likely rules against having multiple accounts for that purpose. Why would GGG even want you to have multiple accounts to store items? They want you to buy stash tabs.

This is not an inherent part of the genre, it's a side effect of lazy / restrictive design. You don't see JRPGs having this issue, because they give you all the space you need. In fact, the only time you ever see this problem is with online games, because the developers / publishers don't want to pay for that little bit of extra server space for item storage, yet insist on creating the problem to begin with by having things like "loot tetris".

I agree that there should be a limit, and considering GGG offers you the option to have an infinite amount of storage so long as you pay ...that limitation is rather excessively forgiving. I also agree that the currency tab ( in some form ) should be a baseline feature of the game ( including a map tab version as well ). But the point of the argument was the dismissive statements about how you're expected to just make characters and accounts to hold items.

Comparing PoE to Fortnite lolol

I've played since closed beta and I've only ever bought currency tab, divine tab, essence tab, and converted 2 of my 4 tabs to public tabs and I have no problem whatsoever. All my other coins have gone into mtx. You can survive easily just by having a currency tab only. Most cards are not worth keeping those that are are better off being sold. Essences are crap unless it's screaming + even so you can buy most for 1-2c which when you get to maps is easily attainable after 1 map. I sell pretty much an entire stash tab in 1-2 days by undercutting people. You need to prioritize more, even with no money spent, you can use the old forum way to sell shit on poe.trade. Public tab just makes life easier.

everything has a price.

storage space in poe is either paid with time , with mule accounts or setting up shops on the forums.
it can also be conveniently paid with money .


now lets think about entertainment value for a moment.
consider how much you pay to go to see a movie, it entertains you for a few hours and then it is done. Do you consider it a waste , probably not.
So lets consider that the movie outing was 20$ for 2 hours of fun.
surely a game is worth 10c + per hour of fun right ?
play 100 hours , thats 10$ , play 600 thats 60$

most people who like poe enough to play 10 hours , are going to play it for hundreds, so investing some money here and there is not so bad. I usually look for supporter packs that have a nice full set of armor.

point being, for less then the cost of a movie a month, you can support the game that entertains you for much longer.

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JoeShmo wrote:

Muling had only been a part of some games because there wasn't adequate storage space. Nobody is going to argue that Diablo 2 stash space was adequate; the fact players risked losing items by dropping them on the ground to be picked up by their other characters doesn't mean it was an intended or okay design. No, it was a bad design.

All right, let's compare. Note that I haven't played all of these games; some of the info is based on screenshots from Google image search. In some cases it was difficult to determine what is offered by the base game and what by player-created mods, but I've done my best to list the base sizes.

Diablo (1996): inventory of 10×4 slots. Total 40 slots. Items take 1-6 slots.
Diablo II (2000): inventory of 10×4 slots. Per-character stash of 6×8 slots. Total 88 slots. Items take 1-6 slots.
Diablo III (2012): inventory of 10×6 slots. Shared stash of 6 tabs of 7×10 slots each. Stash expandable to 12 tabs by purchasing the necromancer expansion and completing four season journeys. Total 480-900 slots. Items take 1-2 slots.
Torchlight (2009): inventory of 3 tabs (gear / spells / fish) of 7×3 slots each. Pet inventory of same size. Shared stash of 7×6 slots. Total 168 slots. Items take 1 slot.
Torchlight II (2012): inventory of 3 tabs (gear / potions / spells) of 8×4 slots each. Pet inventory of same size. Shared stash of 3 tabs (same categories) of 8×5 slots each. Total 312 slots. Items take 1 slot.
Sacred (2004): Inventory of 20×8 slots. Per-character stash of 20×10 slots. Total 360 slots. Items take 1-9 slots.
Sacred 2 (2008): Inventory of 15×12 slots. Per-character stash of 24×13 slots. Shared stash of presumably same size. Total 804 slots. Items take 1-6 slots.
Titan Quest (2006): Inventory of 12×5 slots. Extra bags of 3 tabs of 8×5 slots each. Per-character stash of 8×15 slots. Shared stash of 6×12 slots. Total 372 slots. Items take 1-8 slots.
Titan Quest Anniversary Edition (2016): Same as above but per-character stash has doubled in size. Total 492 slots.
Grim Dawn (2016): Inventory of 12×8 slots. Extra bags of 5 tabs of 8×8 slots each. Per-character stash of 10×18 slots. Shared stash of 8×16 slots. Total 724 slots. Items take 1-6 slots.
Path of Exile (2013): Inventory of 12×5 slots. Shared stash of 4 tabs of 12×12 slots each. Stash infinitely expandable with microtransations. Total 606-infinity slots. Items take 1-8 slots.

Path of Exile compares pretty favorably. Only three games have it beat in terms of the number of slots: Diablo III, Sacred 2 and Grim Dawn. In terms of the number of items stored, Diablo III is the clear winner thanks to its smaller item size. Torchlight II ranks fairly high as well, even with its tabs limited by item type.

It's worth nothing that Path of Exile is the only free game on the list. All other games must be bought before playing and their release prices range from $20 to $60. So really, $20 worth of stash tabs should be added to Path of Exile to make the comparison fair. That would buy a six-pack of stash tabs, pushing the total amount to an impressive 1440 slots. With sale prices you could add a currency tab as well, evening out the playfield against the other games which all have an immaterial currency.

Pretty much all listed games have forum posts complaining that the available storage space is too small. Path of Exile is set apart from the competition by the possibility to purchase an unlimited number of extra stash tabs. Since most of these games are offline single-player games (Diablo III and Path of Exile being the exceptions), there are various third-party mods that provide additional storage space. Such mods however carry the risk of destroying items if something goes wrong.

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drakgoku wrote:

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Acolina87 wrote:

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drakgoku wrote:

Poe is not F2P, because you can not continue until the end of the game.

Who comes saying that it is F2P but it is not a collector game, this person does not exist for me.

The company POE is small, but with what has won and still have not done anything about the prices ... Fornite with better graphics and better experience, costs only 10 euros (Skins, characters...) for ever, while in POE with 100 euros you lack things ...

However much they write, they are only excuses, they can deceive some, but not the other majority.

Please do not take my money, because do not I give it to you


LAST EPOCH -> free to play. (ALPHA) New ARPG style Diablo and POE.

Go buy some stash tabs you cheap bastard. The game is f2p and its great.

Go buy some stash tabs... The game is f2p and its great.



I do not need to hear anything else, enough with what I've seen.

lol