[3.2] HoWAbout Occultist. Shaper/Uber Elder, Minotaur flaskless on 1L!!

yeah it's a matter of preference. jugg is arguably more reliable, much more speed, immunities and so on, but occultist might have better combat stats. i was able to facetank shaper, elder and guardians with nasty mods without an issue with this guy though, thanks to high regen and leech. occultist might be way better if they'll finally rework curses tho ;p

I wouldn't say it's more speed since you don't have Profane Bloom :) I think since Occultist has higher dps and has improved clearspeed, its a winner. But of course like you said, it's all up to preferences and personal biases :>

Waffle09
Remember that every build is suited for a particular task. In battle of Frost Blades vs MS, even with Profane Bloom, Frost Blades will be faster, especially in lower tiers where you can one shot whole screen and maybe even 2 with FB. MS is decent enough, and this build is meant to run end-game content - just so happens that all Guardian maps and majority of T15 is very linear, where MS is doing surprisingly ok. If you want I can post a video of a more open map, but for now, here's a quick Chimera run: https://youtu.be/fxuCcQWAARI

I'm trying this build right now and its awesome!

Any thoughts about incandescent heart?

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Bristoling wrote:

I wouldn't say it's more speed since you don't have Profane Bloom :) I think since Occultist has higher dps and has improved clearspeed, its a winner. But of course like you said, it's all up to preferences and personal biases :>

you probably didn't realize that jugg's undeniable gives him more than 60% attack speed (along with small node), thanks to shaper's touch and int stacking;p there is also unstoppable with it's 14% movement speed and the fact that he doesn't need any immunities in his flasks, so he can go for more movement speed. in terms of clear speed and going through maps, it's not even close, jugg wins by far ;p

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dezda wrote:

I'm trying this build right now and its awesome!

Any thoughts about incandescent heart?

You are much better off with a rare. Your total ES will be much higher, with high Int there's little to no dps difference, you can get extra resists plus, most importantly, a decent rare will be a lot cheaper then 6L Incandescent Heart.

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you probably didn't realize that jugg's undeniable gives him more than 60% attack speed (along with small node), thanks to shaper's touch and int stacking;p there is also unstoppable with it's 14% movement speed and the fact that he doesn't need any immunities in his flasks, so he can go for more movement speed. in terms of clear speed and going through maps, it's not even close, jugg wins by far ;p

I did, but you are comparing apples to oranges. This is a Molten Strike build, and MS has crappy clear by default. Extra attack speed if you chose to adjust your build to MS wouldn't help you much, especially since the difference between your build and your build with my pre-3.3 BF Occultist tree would be only around 12% in Shield Charge attack rate, which isn't a lot. Yes, extra movement speed helps Shield Charge, but with Whirling Blades you don't need any movement speed at all, and you don't need a Shield when you get free super high level Discipline from Ascendancy, and dual wielding means 15% more attack speed. Anyway, charging once into a pack and exploding it in one attack beats the hell out of charging to 2-3 places to finish off stragglers in a pack if you MS didn't cover everything. Profane Bloom doesn't show up in PoB but has to be experienced.

Physical damage immunity is great but with your 800ish regen, 2.5k leech and inability to reliably proc Arakaali pantheon it won't be able to facetank a barrage of elemental attacks or degens like Shaper's beam. Which is super easy with 6k+ ES leech that you can get with VP (9-10k with Arakaali).
With that being said, physical damage isn't much of a problem once you get 10k+ ES and VP leech. Of course you have other advantages like being able to tank Dark Forest boss as much as you want, but again, apples to oranges.

I wish you luck with your build but I'm really not that much interested in how BF Jugg compares to MS Occultist :) Because for me the answer is simple, its a 3x more dps in favour of Occultist, and if you convert Jugg to use MS to have similar dps, then even with extra attack speed, Occultist will have same or better clearspeed due to Profane Bloom alone.

So I wanted to get an uber elder viable build and decided upon this one. I managed to do a deathless shaper at level 84 that was actually really easy, just held right click, didn't have to dodge too much. Never had it that easy. Getting some nice rings I can foresee being a real pain to get, tried crafting some opals but no luck.

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Bristoling wrote:

Physical damage immunity is great but with your 800ish regen, 2.5k leech and inability to reliably proc Arakaali pantheon

it's over 3k regen/s and 4k leech/s with flask on arakaali proc, which is up basically all the time;p also can proc it on will with manual immortal call

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Bristoling wrote:

it won't be able to facetank a barrage of elemental attacks or degens like Shaper's beam.

it can;p also the reason i really don't like vaal pact - degens or situations when you can't leech

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Bristoling wrote:

I wish you luck with your build but I'm really not that much interested in how BF Jugg compares to MS Occultist :) Because for me the answer is simple, its a 3x more dps in favour of Occultist, and if you convert Jugg to use MS to have similar dps, then even with extra attack speed, Occultist will have same or better clearspeed due to Profane Bloom alone.

don't get me wrong, just wanted to compare advantages of both classes. best of luck for you 2

What mod is the 1s priority when looking for a discipline watcher's eye ?
ES gain on hit or faster ES recharge ?

My bad, I forgot about Consecrated ground from flask. But doesn't Arakaali not work with your build since you never actually take any physical damage due to long Immortal Call?



For Discipline, you want either Recovery or ES on hit, both work well. Recharge is quite useless for us since we use Blood Rage and recharge is only helpful UN emergency situations, which shouldn't be common :)
If you got money to spare then obviously Clarity Wachers is going to be the best.

Ty for the fast answer !