I hope i'm part of the silent majority...

You are OP. The labyrinth is in my experience the first time an ARPG has had content that you can't simply outgear. That is fantastic. It gives more life to the game.

From a lore standpoint I find Izaro one of the better-developed and more interesting characters in the game. I'd love to know more about him. As for the Lab itself, eeeh... I'm torn. I have mixed opinions on it and this doesn't seem like the thread to go into detail about that!

it's god awful

The majority of people who are content and like things in the game tend to not be very vocal. Because they are enjoying the game and enjoying the content. You will notice most of the threads are complaints or things people find personally unpleasing within the game. Most people dont come post on the forums when they are content. Thats why they say the people who do complain about things such as the lab are in fact the vocal minority. Most people are ok with the fact you have to overcome a challenge and upon doing so you are rewarded with great power for your build.

Lab is actually a great addition to the game. as was the Atlas. People these days i also have noticed who complain about things also seem as if they never played a lot of the old school video games. games that were in fact unfair at times and presented unfair and sometimes nearly impossible challenges. But that was half the fun playing over and over trying over and over till you finally overcome the challenge. And upon doing so it felt good. Most times there's was also little to no reward either other than just being able to know you did it. Now days people want some sort of reward for everything they do and if the challenge is too great they complain and beg for changes to be made instead of continuing to try and overcome the challenge.

I like it in principle but I don't like running it 4 times per character. I would be happy if you could run the merc one (or the 3.0 equivalent) first time and get all 6 ascendancy point from that if you so choose.

Also you can be majority but not silent if you make a thread about it.

I am part of the silent majority too b/c I like the lab!

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ladish wrote:

I like it in principle but I don't like running it 4 times per character. I would be happy if you could run the merc one (or the 3.0 equivalent) first time and get all 6 ascendancy point from that if you so choose.

Also you can be majority but not silent if you make a thread about it.

I mean if you can do Merciless lab then obviously Normal and Cruel versions will not present any sort of challenge other than the time invested in the run itself. But on the other hand i do believe the reason behind why they do not do it this way is because they actually would rather encourage people to gain the ascendancy points as they progress through the content. Getting the normal points while finishing up Act 3 Normal and going into Act 4 and same with Cruel. And if they would do something like this then everyone would pretty much skip normal and cruel labs and just wait till merciless to do the lab once and gain 6 points. So i dont really think this would be something they would do just because it would make the mere existence of normal and cruel labs pointless.

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The_Reporter wrote:

I agree with you, Demonoz. There shouldn't be a reward for completing the lab. The reward should be the time spent doing it. No points, no enchants and no phat lewtz

Im not saying there should be no reward. All im saying is now days even when people have a challenge to overcome and upon doing so they are rewarded and quite handsomely i might add they still complain because the challenge is either too much or they just dont like it or whatever their reason is to complain. Point is if you have a challenge set before you and you are able to surpass it and get a reward in the process then there shouldnt be an issue. Yet you see countless threads complaining for things like Ascendancy's to be gained from simply playing the game and doing nothing for that same reward. Just goes to show how different things are is all. Older games didn't give you shit for overcoming much more brutal challenges. Maybe a shitty little congratulations screen but that's about it. Of course back then we also didn't have the internet for people to complain how much something sucked to do either we just either did it or played something else.

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Demonoz wrote:

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ladish wrote:

I like it in principle but I don't like running it 4 times per character. I would be happy if you could run the merc one (or the 3.0 equivalent) first time and get all 6 ascendancy point from that if you so choose.

Also you can be majority but not silent if you make a thread about it.

I mean if you can do Merciless lab then obviously Normal and Cruel versions will not present any sort of challenge other than the time invested in the run itself. But on the other hand i do believe the reason behind why they do not do it this way is because they actually would rather encourage people to gain the ascendancy points as they progress through the content. Getting the normal points while finishing up Act 3 Normal and going into Act 4 and same with Cruel. And if they would do something like this then everyone would pretty much skip normal and cruel labs and just wait till merciless to do the lab once and gain 6 points. So i dont really think this would be something they would do just because it would make the mere existence of normal and cruel labs pointless.

I would be ok with that except that there is no incective atm to do normal/cruel lab until you are vastly over-leveled - it is faster and safer (especially hc) to do them when you hit merc - which imo makes them arbitrary and a bit tedious (the normal/cruel runs).

Chris already mentioned they might shorten the equivalent of normal lab in 3.0, but I hope they go a bit further.