[outdated] King of the Forest (Crit version)

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emaster wrote:

I'm using this amulet

And running Temporal Chains + Vulnerability (Temp Chains in gloves, Vulnerability in curse on hit setup) so I double curse on hit with Frenzy. Works pretty good on bosses. Of course that should be visa versa - Vulnerability in gloves, but cannot afford them yet.

That's really interesting actually. No range issues either, and TC on hit from LA is a great defense to have.

I'm not a fan of dropping CWDT in general usage though :(

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Thaya wrote:

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emaster wrote:

I'm using this amulet

And running Temporal Chains + Vulnerability (Temp Chains in gloves, Vulnerability in curse on hit setup) so I double curse on hit with Frenzy. Works pretty good on bosses. Of course that should be visa versa - Vulnerability in gloves, but cannot afford them yet.

That's really interesting actually. No range issues either, and TC on hit from LA is a great defense to have.

I'm not a fan of dropping CWDT in general usage though :(

Well I didn't notice CWDT to have any effect at all. Try to drop it and see yourself.

Hello guys,
I'm new to the game, this is my very first build and I'm having a lot of fun. My thanks to the author for a great build and the guide!

I've got a couple of questions though:

OP says that the 20k evasion is achievable. I can't figure out how is it possible.
I've tried to calculate it on OP's current items/passives:
Sum of evasion on gear: 3219
Dexterity (293+89=382) bonus: 77%
Passives bonus: 147%
Total: 3219*1.77*2.47 = 14 073, way far away from 20k.
Am I missing something?

Queen of the Forest, how does it work? I understand it is being used to boost movement speed, right? But it says -25% movement speed and +1% movement speed per 450 evasion. That means that I need a whooping 11250 evasion just to counter the penalty, let alone dreaming about bonus. In the particular OP's (expensive end-game?) gear; (14 073-11250)/450 = only tiny 6.27%.
Again, what am I missing?

Thirdly, it is highly encouraged to get +x% increased chaos damage on rings/amu and get 20/20 chaos gems. But "increase" is an additive damage, unlike "%more", right? So it just adds to all other multipliers (increase damage, chaos, projectile, physical). How can it be powerful?
Also is it better to get 20/20 chaos or 21/0? Is it worth to get 20/20 on other gems? And what about 21 level on other gems? How much difference does it make?

Thank you all in advance!

"

AgentDunham wrote:

Hello guys,
I'm new to the game, this is my very first build and I'm having a lot of fun. My thanks to the author for a great build and the guide!

I've got a couple of questions though:

OP says that the 20k evasion is achievable. I can't figure out how is it possible.
I've tried to calculate it on OP's current items/passives:
Sum of evasion on gear: 3219
Dexterity (293+89=382) bonus: 77%
Passives bonus: 147%
Total: 3219*1.77*2.47 = 14 073, way far away from 20k.
Am I missing something?

Queen of the Forest, how does it work? I understand it is being used to boost movement speed, right? But it says -25% movement speed and +1% movement speed per 450 evasion. That means that I need a whooping 11250 evasion just to counter the penalty, let alone dreaming about bonus. In the particular OP's (expensive end-game?) gear; (14 073-11250)/450 = only tiny 6.27%.
Again, what am I missing?

Thirdly, it is highly encouraged to get +x% increased chaos damage on rings/amu and get 20/20 chaos gems. But "increase" is an additive damage, unlike "%more", right? So it just adds to all other multipliers (increase damage, chaos, projectile, physical). How can it be powerful?
Also is it better to get 20/20 chaos or 21/0? Is it worth to get 20/20 on other gems? And what about 21 level on other gems? How much difference does it make?

Thank you all in advance!

You are definitely miscalcing something with the Evasion since I'm sitting at 18-19k with a shitty 1900 evasion roll on the qotf. I'm sure I'll get 20k+ if I invest into some Divine Orbs and fix my rolls. (Profile is public if you want to check/compare.)

What makes % Chaos so valuable is that it's one of the mods that double dips poison. Yes, it is additive with all other increases, but it will apply to both the Chaos portion of your Hits (thus increasing the poison damage applied first time, via increasing the size of the Hit), and then once again to Poison damage. See "Damage" at http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Poison

Worth noting is that %Damage and %ProjectileDamage do the same but apply to your initial Hits fully (to all portions, not just a certain one like the %Chaos), resulting in an even bigger double dip. This is why these 2 mods are superior to everything else on jewels, and why we get every possible source of projectile damage (i.e. it should explain the support gem choices, what makes Drillneck so good, etc).

Don't bother Vaaling a 20/0 gem. 21/0 is worth much less than a 21/20. You want to get quality on all of the gems we use (for learning sake, you could just wiki every gem and see what it's quality does), except for Lightning Arrow. It's quality effect is Shock chance, and since we always crit, we always Shock, and it does nothing at all for us.

Hi

I tryed shaper but i can't do it. My dps looks much lower than your's. (have problem with kiling monsters from portal)

I think my gear is good maybe i'm doing something wrong


i have swamp boots for whiter totem

"

AgentDunham wrote:

Hello guys,
I'm new to the game, this is my very first build and I'm having a lot of fun. My thanks to the author for a great build and the guide!

I've got a couple of questions though:

OP says that the 20k evasion is achievable. I can't figure out how is it possible.
I've tried to calculate it on OP's current items/passives:
Sum of evasion on gear: 3219
Dexterity (293+89=382) bonus: 77%
Passives bonus: 147%
Total: 3219*1.77*2.47 = 14 073, way far away from 20k.
Am I missing something?

Queen of the Forest, how does it work? I understand it is being used to boost movement speed, right? But it says -25% movement speed and +1% movement speed per 450 evasion. That means that I need a whooping 11250 evasion just to counter the penalty, let alone dreaming about bonus. In the particular OP's (expensive end-game?) gear; (14 073-11250)/450 = only tiny 6.27%.
Again, what am I missing?

Thirdly, it is highly encouraged to get +x% increased chaos damage on rings/amu and get 20/20 chaos gems. But "increase" is an additive damage, unlike "%more", right? So it just adds to all other multipliers (increase damage, chaos, projectile, physical). How can it be powerful?
Also is it better to get 20/20 chaos or 21/0? Is it worth to get 20/20 on other gems? And what about 21 level on other gems? How much difference does it make?

Thank you all in advance!

You are missing Grace aura, which gives 2575 evasion at lvl 20. With that, 20k is easily achievable. This answers your first two questions (Queen of the forest will give you 20% movement speed with 20k evasion).

As for %chaos, yes they are additive, but you can get 80% from 3 pieces, and that is quite some damage. As for 21 lvl - just added chaos worth it, since it adds flat chaos damage.

Hey! New player here, started playing few days before Breach. Following your leveling guide and still using Bladefall at the moment. Really smooth leveling with it, its like Firestorm but way cooler :D

Anyways, I'm wondering if this build was significantly nerfed/changed with that poison hotfix few days ago, or was that not the same thing?

I tried looking for answer in the thread but way too many pages O.o.

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Thaya wrote:

What makes % Chaos so valuable is that it's one of the mods that double dips poison. Yes, it is additive with all other increases, but it will apply to both the Chaos portion of your Hits (thus increasing the poison damage applied first time, via increasing the size of the Hit), and then once again to Poison damage. See "Damage" at http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Poison

This is all true and very well said. To further clarify: +% Chaos Damage is the only damage affix on jewelry we can get that double-dips, because +% Projectile Damage and +% Damage are not available on jewelry (only jewels/tree). Flat physical damage will only make the initial hit higher and therefore slightly increase poison damage, but it does not "double-dip." Therefore +% Chaos Damage is far superior because you get the full bonus on the initial hit and the resulting poison damage.

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Plaguuuu wrote:

Hey! New player here, started playing few days before Breach. Following your leveling guide and still using Bladefall at the moment. Really smooth leveling with it, its like Firestorm but way cooler :D

Anyways, I'm wondering if this build was significantly nerfed/changed with that poison hotfix few days ago, or was that not the same thing?

I tried looking for answer in the thread but way too many pages O.o.

Are you referring to the nerf to Blade Vortex's poison damage?

From https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1801669:

• Blade Vortex's "More Damage per Blade" modifier has been changed to apply only to spell damage instead of all damage types. This will remove a double-dipping effect that should not have been occurring.

This hotfix only impacted Blade Vortex's poison damage. This league changed how Blade Vortex worked (see the "Version history" here), and introduced a "more" modifier to the overall spell damage with each additional blade. This modifier was incorrectly double-dipping by also applying poison damage. It was only supposed to apply to spell damage, not both. The hotfix simply fixed/nerfed this (depending on who you talk to!). Therefore it did not impact the way our build uses the existing Poison double-dipping mechanisms, which have now been left in place after several similar Poison-related nerfs/modifications so I think they're safe for now. Especially for this league, at least.

@Thaya@emaster
Thank you for your answers boys.
You are indeed correct, I've forgot about grace. Although it's still just 16648 on OP's setup. Dunno if he just doesn't care for more, or I'm still doing some miscalculation.
Edit: Actually if the grace is added before multipliers, it will give an insane 25,330 evasion. So I suppose that must be it :).

So queen is only worth getting as long is I know I'll be sitting on a evasion close to 20k.

Ok, I see if I get high rolls on +%chaos on rings/amu it'll make a difference, but 20q chaos gem is just additional 10% too ALL multipliers, right? Can't be that big of a difference. I mean sure if I'm rich as fuck, why not. But making it a priority? So if I get to choose, 21/0 or 20/20? Because 21/20 was like 2.5ex (best deal). OP says he just leveled 6 of them and vaaled, but damn, it's 339,855,551xp which is actually 3,398,555,510 considering earning 10% of xp.

Also it is important to get 21 of other spells? Like barrage/lighting + supports? And how important is to get 20/20 of them all?

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CadmiumFlow wrote:

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Thaya wrote:

What makes % Chaos so valuable is that it's one of the mods that double dips poison. Yes, it is additive with all other increases, but it will apply to both the Chaos portion of your Hits (thus increasing the poison damage applied first time, via increasing the size of the Hit), and then once again to Poison damage. See "Damage" at http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Poison

This is all true and very well said. To further clarify: +% Chaos Damage is the only damage affix on jewelry we can get that double-dips, because +% Projectile Damage and +% Damage are not available on jewelry (only jewels/tree). Flat physical damage will only make the initial hit higher and therefore slightly increase poison damage, but it does not "double-dip." Therefore +% Chaos Damage is far superior because you get the full bonus on the initial hit and the resulting poison damage.

Not sure its true that physical does not double dip. Quote from wiki:

The base damage per second dealt by a given application of poison equals 8% of the combined physical and chaos damage dealt by the hit which applied that particular instance of poison