Few words about Atlas, new league, nerf exp, prophecy, Melee, etc.

Hello, I decided to write about everything, even tho I know, it's too late to change anything as expansion already done.
I have playing Path of Exile 4+ years (not my first acc) and i love PoE so much, i respect GGG and their work, but i think we have right to comment and suggest if GGG doing something wrong. Even tho i has really bad experience and feel with prophecy league, will type it for no reason, maybe GGG will read it by any chance.

Nerf EXP
Prophecy was so bored and bad, that i decided to try leveling to 100 after nerf exp.
How was it? It was tiresome, dull and very time wasting. Oh and expensive! I should mention something that most already knew, with nerfed exp we get much higher penalty, i mean you need more time to get back lost exp. So its double nerf.
While running maps and done rotation i saw something that i never notice: map pack size does not make big different: 10% pack size or 40% pack size its literally 2-3 monsters added to each pack. Next what i notice was maps has a lot of free space without monsters or anything, just emptiness filled by nothing (absolutely nothing).
In my opinion nerf exp was useless as good party could get their level ultra fast, i know it as i was inside that party. It was so stressful and fast that makes no sense to play solo or with randoms, it just not effective as good party group. Fast clear map in 30sec or 1 min at worst - that how fast group could be. Fast speed meta ruined grind exp.
Nerf exp gear also was useless as now nerfed version has no use at all, at least before they has use with HIGH risk, now its vendor trash.

I would accept and understand nerf exp, if fast speed meta was nerfed to the ground, but as we can see it was buffed only. So, what was point? Party group could level to 100 super fast, but solo players, randoms, non group players and other get huge penalty to play, huge penalty when die, MUCH longer leveling process and no compensate at all. They could level also, but now it will be more expensive to them (around 40 000 chaos) then before. Still very long as before nerf, but more tiresome and unfun.

Red maps should not gave more exp, i think problem with reward and how fix it i think theres few ways:
- 1 make map mods on red tier maps increased stats like quantity and pack size with much higher chance to spawn strongboxes and torm spirit, then on white and yellow maps.
- 2 make red maps much bigger (x3 time) so time and fun used by players would make sense and maps will be rewarded by itself.
Any of there would help red maps become more rewarded and fun.

Prophecy league
Start was horrible: game crash every time, server lags, ultra boring quest (tracking and shit), etc.
I have used 80+ nemesis maps with full inventory of belts + chance orbs and didnt get HH. I has first Zana 8 lvl on prophecy league and done 80+ maps with no outcome at all.
I have used 2+ full stash orbs of chance on Sorcerer Boots with no outcome at all.
I have run every time prophecy and didnt get any good prophecy (no Fated Connections, no Trash to Treasure, no From The Void, etc) wasted so much time on it and no good outcome again. Is it fun? Dont think so.
Did all challenges, but it was worse then perandus challenges: 300 map drop just sux (i have run few thousand maps and done 300 only almost to the near league), uber lab farm was so unprofitable and boring... no comment how horrible it was, Prophecy chain was sux also, etc.
Almost all prophecy fated unique still so weak and useless... what was point to make them so weak? Not voidheart of course.

Overall that league was the most joyless, unrewarded and unlucky to me, i think GGG overnerf my RNG. Well, if it will be the same in next league i will leave PoE (even tho i dont want, but i cant play with that rng anymore).

Atlas of Worlds
Melee, as we saw in trailer and vids, will be utterly extremely bad: NO DPS, NO DEFENSE, NO CLEAR SPEED in same time, as always. If you not believe me, check trailer or vids from company that PR new expansion. Melee will be more dead then it now.
Coc still be tier 1 build, even after nerf.
Ranger will abuse FrostWall bug, bcs GGG lazy to fix it. And GGG think Ranged should have both single target and AOE, while melee should sux.
Performance improvements great, best thing what im looking in next expansion! Wish client will eat less memory and client will be stable.
Overall i feel new map system as nerf to rotation and nerf to exp even further, as gorge, plateau and springs will be red tier and much more expensive (x5 times or so).
We will see less rotation, as its expensive, but more party group with ultra fast meta builds that will get 100 lvl faster, while other players will leveling much slower. IMO!
T16 map bosses and New endgame boss will be part of the new challenges (100%) and that means again paid challenges and scammers will rule over Wraeclast. Thats bad.
New map system means scammer will leveling faster and they could flip now more effective.
Build will be same unbalanced as we got it now. Skill balance impossible to GGG. Sadly.

The forsaken masters
I have leveling all of them from first day they was introduced to 8 levels (even Leo) and they never gave me any T1 unique. After 8 level theres no point to do their missions or even abandon it, no reward at all.
They has super bad designed and weak signature modifiers!
+(3 to 6)% to Quality of Socketed Support Gems = we know how it only used... even for it its still pretty weak.
−(4 to 8) to Mana Cost of Skills = thats interested and good one. Maybe best design.
+1 to Level of Socketed Support Gems = Absurd shit. Not worth to craft it. maybe shittiest one.
Causes Bleeding on Hit = Just trash, and it was always shit.
(20 to 40)% increased Life Leeched per second = No comment. GGG you really think this worth to craft?
(5 to 15)% increased Damage = Such a weak stats, if only it was 20-30 or higher... dreams.
Hits can't be Evaded = So good and so broken mod... why GGG create it, while in same time added such a trash as other mods?
This Map's Modifiers to Quantity of Items found also apply to Rarity = good bonus, but weak IMO!

Now lets see their ratio (Currency Discount): while alts, jews, fus ratio pretty good, other ratio absurd useless and trash. Why not change it? For what sake GGG safe it as is? Trolling?

Meta-crafting Mods and normal mods master could craft should be buffed, as stats they could craft SO much outdated and so weak!
Masters should help us to craft items, but stats masters could craft SO weak... rares cant be strong if we cant craft new strong mods.

Vorici chroms and just chroming process very bad and there should be better way to change colors in game.

Melee and their place in game
Melee Damage scaling and Gem Balance is completely fucked! Lack of good damage support gems for melee atm and forever. The ranger with all the general "projectile damage" allows you to scale anything you want which is really unfair imo. Also it allows for double dipping poison /bleed damage. So for melee gems you have melee physical and multistrike, multistrike being nerfed alot in 2.0. Melee on full life is mainly only for CI. Bloodlust is just not comfortable to use. Conc effect usually is bad because melee has (i guess by design) less AOE capabilities than other skills and therefore increased area gem is almost mandatory.
Not only do you put yourself in danger playing melee, you also have mechanically ancient skills as a choice, difficult damage scaling that mostly is based on your weapon, and you also are in constant check if you are keeping up your endurance charges, fortify or whatever.
Add more pure melee support skills!

Need to tie in more defensive attributes into melee weapon nodes, defense one of the biggest issue melee has, for example elemental dmg can oneshot melee with HP (Life), while CI/ES chars has bigger "Life" pool that makes then harder to be oneshotted.

Ranged/Spell characters think it is unfair for a build to have 60-70% of their clear speed and they asking for nerf EQ, but i think melee should has higher clear speed and defense, as Ranged/Spells much easier to play and to build up with no investment, while melee much more expensive.
If CoC wagon decided to play actually jugg EQ, you will see the clear is much slower, MUCH SLOWER! Also DPS lower and problem with defense. No talk about other melee skills... they just worse. Currently there are no incentives offered to people for playing melee and so most of the time, you see masochists playing it.
The limited AoE of certain melee skills just prevents melee from ever having parity to a ranged or spell caster clear.
Why broken gem like CoC untouched so long, but melee as class not getting any buffs at all for start of era? Whats so bad and sad.

BladeFall, Blade Vortex, Discharge, Poison, Lightning Arrow, Tornado Shot, Vortex, Spark, Kinetic Blast, etc skills absurdly OP and ultra effective, while NO melee could be even close as effective as there listed skills. Any nerf to there skills? Ofc no!
Bladefall miners put out more dps than almost any other builds in temporary leagues yet I see no one bitching about them. 5c CoC builds. Conflux builds. All are much worse offenders than EQ and yet all I hear is "OMG nerf EQ". I've played all 4 of these builds this league and can tell you EQ is the least offensive out of them all from a balance standpoint.

If melee is too weak (and it is) then it needs a buff that doesn't come in the form of a mandatory unique or an overpowered Ascendancy class. There are two goals, the first being to increase the number of viable melee options, and the second being to make melee as viable as ranged or spells or CoC.
As it is now, Melee is disadvantaged in both clear speed and ranged/caster survivability, thats big problem and even on trailer we can see how squishy melee are.
Things like getting movement speed on kill or on hit and getting additional melee range would at least help with the required positioning of melee or its mechanical problems (monster not directly in your face? That's a miss.)

Any single target melee skill feels clunky to use because of targeting issue. You have to target and click a specific monster, and if it decides to run away 1 millisecond before you play the hit animation, you hit nothing and instead your character starts chasing the monster, leaving you free to take damage and not leech/kill. In the current "kill it before it kills you" way of playing this is kinda huge.

Defense melee should be higher from armour or from new node or from bigger life pool or al together.

Ascendancy Classes.
Marauder (all), Duelist (all), Ranger (all), Witch (all), Assassin = super good, basically top tier classes.

Templar (all) classes super bad, every build can be done better then Templar (only good he has Inevitable Judgement node).
Support Guardian? Necromancer much better.
Totems Hierophant? Chieftain MUCH better!
Melee? HAHA, NO! Any marauder or duelist will be 500% more effective and better then templar melee.
Etc. Templar classes just utterly piece of shit!

Ascendant = good, but overnerfed IMO!

Saboteur and Trickster decent, but still weak if we compare to other classes and their ability.

Quest Rewards
Quest Rewards so outdated and almost all of them so bad.
Passive skill tree one of the best and interested thing GGG decided and added, but amount of those passive skills very low, Quest Rewards should add much more skills to players and gave better items/gear for completing it.
Dominus, Swig Hope, Sacred Ground, Malachai fight should gave skill points.

Movement Speed meta
There should be some equation between 300% ms and 20% ms.
Add some restriction or penalty or cap for movement speed, also remove from all ms skills ability to scales from MS and cast/attack speed! Right now MS and MS skills just insane without equation. 300% MS and 20% MS ultra radically vary. Cap or something should be done with it.

Party play
Monsters experience is awarded only to nearby (roughly two screens) party members <= that should be increased BY A LOT! Why? Because party with random and even with good friend become very hard... theres always someone or two who split group and run solo. This ruin exp and partys to everyone and fast clear speed meta only force splitting groups that would reduce exp IF not increase nearby (roughly five or even six screens) party members!

New league
Wont help, as it will be the same as Talisman was - scammers and other trash will get all of them and craft anything, also will able to re-sell for high price, while players will suffer from "craft" as its the same chaos normal chaos orb.
Rarity will be pretty bad so it wont be common and cheap.

How fix it? Add 7-15 pack monsters contained by essences per location; they drop the essence after defeating them with more essence. That way even scammers would had time resell and normal players will have easy way to farm them.

RNG
My rng sucks. 80+ nemesis maps, 2+ stash with chance gave no HH and no sky; no T1 prophecy, no T1 unique, no Exalteds drop, vaaled x15 empower 3 lvl in perandus and no 4 lvl, now i vaal 64 empower 3 lvl and only ONE 4 lvl, no goods for me. I know that GGG reduced my rng by 90% for some reason, well i get that signal and ready for last try before leave game, if same shit happens in new league then it will be faster to me to leave PoE.
If i will has same rng in next league i will just drop PoE. Tired playing the game, that good but ruin my experience and fun by shittiest rng i have ever seen in my life. It become more stressful then interested and fun. If game give so many signal as my shit rng (no goods at all) then its not worth time.
Just decided to type it, even if its late.

Thanks.

Agree with many but not all of your points.

Making a SSF HC league would address a good number of them.

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TreeOfDead wrote:

Prophecy league
Start was horrible: game crash every time, server lags, ultra boring quest (tracking and shit), etc.

One of the worst aspects of PoE and many other games. They do not work properly on release.

"

TreeOfDead wrote:

Prophecy chain was sux also, etc.
Almost all prophecy fated unique still so weak and useless... what was point to make them so weak? Not voidheart of course.

I think the prophecy is an ok concept. But there are simply not enough prophecies implemented to make it properly interesting. It becomes too repetitive too soon.
Disagree on all but one of the fated uniques being too weak. Kaoms Sign is already BIS vs traps. So Kaoms Way is clearly not "weak and useless".

"

TreeOfDead wrote:

New map system means scammer will leveling faster and they could flip now more effective.

I saw you mix scammers and flippers together in some other thread. They are not on the same level. Scammers are bad. Flippers are neutral. One can even argue that flippers keep the market liquid. Disclaimer: I have never traded with another player in PoE.

"

TreeOfDead wrote:

Now lets see their ratio (Currency Discount): while alts, jews, fus ratio pretty good, other ratio absurd useless and trash. Why not change it? For what sake GGG safe it as is? Trolling?

I really dont understand these imbalances either. Obviously they dont play their own game. At least not like normal players.

"

TreeOfDead wrote:

Any single target melee skill feels clunky to use because of targeting issue. You have to target and click a specific monster,

At least the namelocking should go away or be made easier. This worked better in Diablo 2 IIRC, you could right-button to move-autoattack the nearest or sth like that. Unless there is some trick that I am not aware of?

"

TreeOfDead wrote:

Party play
Monsters experience is awarded only to nearby (roughly two screens) party members <= that should be increased BY A LOT! Why? Because party with random and even with good friend become very hard... theres always someone or two who split group and run solo. This ruin exp and partys to everyone and fast clear speed meta only force splitting groups that would reduce exp IF not increase nearby (roughly five or even six screens) party members!

Dont agree. It would give a huge buff to clearspeed of good party on maps other than Gorge.

"

TreeOfDead wrote:

while players will suffer from "craft" as its the same chaos normal chaos orb.
Rarity will be pretty bad so it wont be common and cheap.

How fix it? Add 7-15 pack monsters contained by essences per location; they drop the essence after defeating them with more essence. That way even scammers would had time resell and normal players will have easy way to farm them.

I dislike the pure randomness of the chaos craft system. The new orbs dont change that much. I would rather see a somewhat more deterministic crafting - a crafting which is really a "crafting" instead of a "lottery" - not an increase of the drop counts.
Example of the problem I see: If I craft a Vaal regalia per Chaos spam then I want a T1 ES roll. Every 30 (or whatever) chaos orbs gives one. With the new orbs every orb gives one. Which means that the new orb is just a concentration of 30 chaos orbs. Its not really something new. Just a bit better as it gives a T0 instead of a T1. But its still the same "lottery" instead of "crafting".

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Zrevnur wrote:

I dislike the pure randomness of the chaos craft system. The new orbs dont change that much. I would rather see a somewhat more deterministic crafting - a crafting which is really a "crafting" instead of a "lottery" - not an increase of the drop counts.
Example of the problem I see: If I craft a Vaal regalia per Chaos spam then I want a T1 ES roll. Every 30 (or whatever) chaos orbs gives one. With the new orbs every orb gives one. Which means that the new orb is just a concentration of 30 chaos orbs. Its not really something new. Just a bit better as it gives a T0 instead of a T1. But its still the same "lottery" instead of "crafting".

May have been wrong here due to the possibility of using lvl 8 mastercrafts for fixing prefix/postfix. See: https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/4xqj0k/mastercrafting_with_15_phys_to_coldlets_start/

If that works then the new orbs are very powerful. Possibly too powerful.

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Zrevnur wrote:

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TreeOfDead wrote:

Now lets see their ratio (Currency Discount): while alts, jews, fus ratio pretty good, other ratio absurd useless and trash. Why not change it? For what sake GGG safe it as is? Trolling?

I really dont understand these imbalances either. Obviously they dont play their own game. At least not like normal players.

100% Sometimes i wonder why not make it correct and useful as other ratios? Also vendor has outdated ratio, why not update it?
More recipe, but cheap and useful recipe would be great to game overall, but if it wont be secret recipe for few ppl who will abuse it, why not reveal all secret recipe so players can use it?

"

Zrevnur wrote:

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TreeOfDead wrote:

Any single target melee skill feels clunky to use because of targeting issue. You have to target and click a specific monster,

At least the namelocking should go away or be made easier. This worked better in Diablo 2 IIRC, you could right-button to move-autoattack the nearest or sth like that. Unless there is some trick that I am not aware of?

Agree, but GGG seems dont like making melee easier and cheaper to play... When melee was same strong as CoC? Or Spark? Or Bladefall mines? Or Blade Vortex? Never!
Never melee was strong or equal (par) basis with others classes! How long Melee will be worst class? To me it seems forever, as GGG stated clearly they dont care about melee.
All new skills that GGG adding only for spells, there new support gems all has "More dmg" multipliers. Now wheres melee support gems with "More dmg"?

Added fire = bad for ele reflect
Hatred = bad for ele reflect
Herald of Ash = bad for ele reflect
Weapons ele dmg = bad for ele reflect
etc.

Where melee support gems? Where melee defense? Fortify? But its weak and bad... and even so spell casters /coc / rangers also use it, so its not melee defense. What else? Nothing.
Melee has no attention from GGG.

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Zrevnur wrote:

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TreeOfDead wrote:

Party play
Monsters experience is awarded only to nearby (roughly two screens) party members <= that should be increased BY A LOT! Why? Because party with random and even with good friend become very hard... theres always someone or two who split group and run solo. This ruin exp and partys to everyone and fast clear speed meta only force splitting groups that would reduce exp IF not increase nearby (roughly five or even six screens) party members!

Dont agree. It would give a huge buff to clearspeed of good party on maps other than Gorge.

The problem is good party group already clearing any maps with few seconds or 1 min at worst.
But random party always suffer from splitting or different line or when separated from each other. Right now everyone try to clear map faster and going solo from party that means everyone in party get LESS exp and less drop... it only ruin party play at all, good party group already doing it super effective. It wont change good group, but improve random party play.
Also problem is clear speed meta.

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Zrevnur wrote:

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TreeOfDead wrote:

while players will suffer from "craft" as its the same chaos normal chaos orb.
Rarity will be pretty bad so it wont be common and cheap.

How fix it? Add 7-15 pack monsters contained by essences per location; they drop the essence after defeating them with more essence. That way even scammers would had time resell and normal players will have easy way to farm them.

I dislike the pure randomness of the chaos craft system. The new orbs dont change that much. I would rather see a somewhat more deterministic crafting - a crafting which is really a "crafting" instead of a "lottery" - not an increase of the drop counts.
Example of the problem I see: If I craft a Vaal regalia per Chaos spam then I want a T1 ES roll. Every 30 (or whatever) chaos orbs gives one. With the new orbs every orb gives one. Which means that the new orb is just a concentration of 30 chaos orbs. Its not really something new. Just a bit better as it gives a T0 instead of a T1. But its still the same "lottery" instead of "crafting".

Exactly! I want to see more deterministic crafting - a crafting which is really a "crafting" instead of a "lottery"!

I want to see more deterministic crafting - a crafting which is really a "crafting" instead of a "lottery"!

But new essences "orbs" not help at all, it same random shit as chaos spam, but more expensive! It will be even more unfair and more trade force change, nerf to non trade players and casual players.

Also there essences has very very weak, small stats to be worthy craft.

GGG wont make rare great again, at least with there new essences for sure. New essences will make it expensive and scammer food. Nothing else.

Well Melee got a lot better, and there are no indications it is worse (likely a nerf to Voidheart will hit melee). But right now Earthquake is basically the same as Vortex (even the playstyle is fairly similar). Vortex is Warp, Vortex, Loot, Warp, Vortex Loot and Earthquake is Leap Slam, Earthquake, Loot, Leapslam, Earthquake, Loot.

In a game like PoE that is centered around giving effects to all possible classes and playstyles essentially you will never be able to make melee as good as ranged since it would require you to put on restrictions on playstyles. It would also mean you would have to enforce this playstyle. Right now a Ranged character can be as tanky as a melee one, which means you can force ranged characters into melee situations without making these situations impossible for those characters to handle. The issue right now is that GGG doesn't ensure that the opposite doesn't happen. Melee are naturally forced into situations you should avoid but can't as a melee, and that is something they have to work on.

So overall the two things melee needs is a look at certain melee killers (like Revenants, not sure why they brought Shotgunning back with those, when they removed it before) and a certain addition to Supports. Also some of the quality boni should be looked at, since they are kinda odd for Melees. Multistrike is a good example, since it should have Melee Damage not Melee Physical Damage. Exspecially some green melee supports would be nice.

"

Agree, but GGG seems dont like making melee easier and cheaper to play... When melee was same strong as CoC? Or Spark? Or Bladefall mines? Or Blade Vortex? Never!

Well as Spark... yeah it was back in Marohi Groundslam days. But those over skills didn't exist back than. Also Blade Vortex is pretty melee, a spell, but as melee as most melee attacks.

The XP changes... I personally don't notice them, since I never go that high, I usually start new chars once reaching 85 or so. The issue I see with them is that they punish people for doing red maps. The most effective maps are gorge and plateau and partially some other easy layouts like Courtyard or Shipyard which allow a player at least to partially avoid backtracking. But most of the other maps are just not on comparable. They are not that much better, but they are more risky, drop less (since you will have less killed enemies in the same time with the same quantity) and are more expansive. But that could be something that Atlas fixes, not sure.

"

Movement Speed meta
There should be some equation between 300% ms and 20% ms.
Add some restriction or penalty or cap for movement speed, also remove from all ms skills ability to scales from MS and cast/attack speed! Right now MS and MS skills just insane without equation. 300% MS and 20% MS ultra radically vary. Cap or something should be done with it.

Well if a movement speed would be worse than just moving there nobody would use it expect for terrain avoiding. The thing is those skills should have a cost. They should get charges like Flame Dash and the ability to use them with Endurance Charges for Leap Slam, Frenzy Charges for Whirling Blades and Power Charges for Lightning Warp. Flame Dash and Blink Arrow already have a cooldown or Charges.

Movespeed in general is actually way too low early game at can be too powerful later. They should make it a less important stat by just improving the base movespeed and lowering the effect of bonus movespeed from items etc.

"

Almost all prophecy fated unique still so weak and useless... what was point to make them so weak? Not voidheart of course.

Ignoring the 3 obvious power houses (Prism, Opus and Voidheart) Gryphon and Cauterizer are pretty impressive. Silverbrough is also really nice, but competes with Death Harp, a battle that is hard to win. Wall of Brambles is awesome, the first decent leveling armor, although most won't care because Tabula. Kaoms and that 70% Firedamage amulett are also nice. But they are not meant to be super powerful. I could even see Gryphon and Silverbrough getting one more version around lvl50.

I've been playing melee since the game released. I've never felt weak enough that I couldn't do something in the game. And I even play self found for the most part. (I trade for orbs to craft, and uniques)

The only thing wrong with melee skills is how they feel so clunky with targetting. Especially the targetted abilities. Why they haven't addressed this yet is beyond me. Nothing feels worse then going up to a group only to swipe at the air. Increasing the range of weapons and allowing a missed click to auto target the nearest enemy would go wonders for some of these skills.

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e1337donkey wrote:

I've been playing melee since the game released. I've never felt weak enough that I couldn't do something in the game. And I even play self found for the most part. (I trade for orbs to craft, and uniques)

The only thing wrong with melee skills is how they feel so clunky with targetting. Especially the targetted abilities. Why they haven't addressed this yet is beyond me. Nothing feels worse then going up to a group only to swipe at the air. Increasing the range of weapons and allowing a missed click to auto target the nearest enemy would go wonders for some of these skills.

Second part i agree, but first part bs.

You never played CoC? Bcs it seems so from your msg, you never felt weak as melee? What maps and mods have you played? How fast you clear uber atziri? What map mods you think as hard, 3, 5, 10, 40?

Your first part either masochistic or you never felt how easy and strong CoC and other clear speed meta or bladefall mines.

I agree with almoust everything. Specially Master affixes that are useless except few and Meta OP builds that need nerf.

"

Party group could level to 100 super fast, but solo players, randoms, non group players and other get huge penalty to play, huge penalty when die, MUCH longer leveling process and no compensate at all. They could level also, but now it will be more expensive to them (around 40 000 chaos) then before.

What are you talking about?

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TreeOfDead wrote:

Atlas of Worlds
Melee, as we saw in trailer and vids, will be utterly extremely bad: NO DPS, NO DEFENSE, NO CLEAR SPEED in same time, as always. If you not believe me, check trailer or vids from company that PR new expansion. Melee will be more dead then it now.

dat build...I think...no I know, dat build are terrible, chris cyclone is terrible, infernal blow too

I agree with many things that u said, I hope we can change GGG mind, they need look forum

About that new nerfed exp is what made me play a lot lot lot less now. Just don't have the motivation to lvl with that crap exp rates as a solo player.

For rotation with infinite amounts of gorges is propably whatever anyway.