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I like traps; I think they add a really cool new dynamic to the few areas of the game where they've been implemented. Izaro, however ... well, when he lags or DCs the game due to GGG's servers not being strong enough, there's no telling if your build would have been good enough or not.
-VG-
Invited to Beta 2012-03-18 / Supporter since 2012-04-08
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Posted byVideoGeemer#0418on Mar 25, 2016, 1:19:58 AM
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Turtledove wrote:
The highlighted part or sidtherat's statement is misleading. He keeps repeating this. When people called him on it in another thread he posted the supposed proof that his statement was true that labyrinth runs should only take 5 or 7 minutes. First, let me state that sidtherat LOVES labyrinth play. This is fine, of course. But, it means that he plays it over and over, again and again, which he freely admits. So, he posted a video of HIM running the labyrinth. He admits that he had just previously run the labyrinth FOUR times before his video run. This was the exact same layout, four times immediately previously. He went amazingly fast through it in the video, didn't bother picking up loot, didn't kill monsters unless he had to, all the traps were perfectly scouted out so he knew which ones he could just barrel thru and which ones to be careful with etc.. He finished in about 8 minutes. (He got lost during the run for a minute, which just demonstrates how difficult it is to find your way around in this content.) So someone that doesn't have the layout memorized and plays the labyrinth as little as possible, it would be absolutely impossible to do it in 5 minutes. I would guess that a half hour would be a much more reasonable figure for someone that does the labyrinth as little as possible.
The problem for many people is that the labyrinth is not fun to them. This should be the message to GGG here in the feedback section. Please don't let others intimidate you into not giving your feedback to GGG here in the feedback section of the forum.
It's not misleading at all.
It's possible and it's very much doable, he also had to try the layout for the first time in order for his later attempts to be much faster.
If you're not willing to memorize layout/invest time in the labyrinth, then you shouldn't expect your labyrinth runs to be short. Logic 101.
As for the other part of not being fun for them, well, that's not actually a new thing in PoE, is it?
A bunch of player don't find maps, races, 90+ lvl grind, gear grind and trade fun.
Guess what those players do while they play the game?
People and their entitlement... heh.
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Posted bytinko92#6447on Mar 25, 2016, 6:58:31 AM
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Agreeing with the opener, was really hyped before the Add-on came, now I am as annoyed and bored of PoE as I was hyped before.
I dont want to play Super Mario on 1 single life. Neither do I want a trap game.
Wanna kill mobs and test out different builds and hilarious combinations of the tree and items.
I dont want to play only life based boring builds from the western side of the tree.
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Posted byboesersven#5678on Mar 25, 2016, 8:46:22 AM
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tinko92 wrote:
It's not misleading at all.
It's possible and it's very much doable, he also had to try the layout for the first time in order for his later attempts to be much faster.
If you're not willing to memorize layout/invest time in the labyrinth, then you shouldn't expect your labyrinth runs to be short. Logic 101.
As for the other part of not being fun for them, well, that's not actually a new thing in PoE, is it?
A bunch of player don't find maps, races, 90+ lvl grind, gear grind and trade fun.
Guess what those players do while they play the game?
People and their entitlement... heh.
It is misleading, It's not feasible to run the lab in 5-10 minutes if it's your only run of the day and why would we spend the time to run the lab 3 or 4 times when we find it so boring and tedious? I have no problem with the lab being "Difficult" as so many people say but dodging traps just isn't fun, At the end of the day if we don't find something to be fun then we're not going to play it and gating the ascendancy points behind boredom has just turned so many of us off of even bothering to go through it.
The other day i did my cruel and merciless lab runs and after i'd got my points i closed the game and didn't play for the rest of the day, It left me feeling exhausted and frustrated not because of the difficulty of it but because of how tedious it is. I'm not at all excited by the prospect of having to go back there 3 times for every new character i create because it's a chore, The idea of the lab is great but the execution just doesn't work.
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I stopped playing this league after I cleared t14 and only map I got was fucking Desert.
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Posted byGosen#5296on Mar 25, 2016, 9:07:50 AM
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tinko92 wrote:
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Turtledove wrote:
The highlighted part or sidtherat's statement is misleading. He keeps repeating this. When people called him on it in another thread he posted the supposed proof that his statement was true that labyrinth runs should only take 5 or 7 minutes. First, let me state that sidtherat LOVES labyrinth play. This is fine, of course. But, it means that he plays it over and over, again and again, which he freely admits. So, he posted a video of HIM running the labyrinth. He admits that he had just previously run the labyrinth FOUR times before his video run. This was the exact same layout, four times immediately previously. He went amazingly fast through it in the video, didn't bother picking up loot, didn't kill monsters unless he had to, all the traps were perfectly scouted out so he knew which ones he could just barrel thru and which ones to be careful with etc.. He finished in about 8 minutes. (He got lost during the run for a minute, which just demonstrates how difficult it is to find your way around in this content.) So someone that doesn't have the layout memorized and plays the labyrinth as little as possible, it would be absolutely impossible to do it in 5 minutes. I would guess that a half hour would be a much more reasonable figure for someone that does the labyrinth as little as possible.
The problem for many people is that the labyrinth is not fun to them. This should be the message to GGG here in the feedback section. Please don't let others intimidate you into not giving your feedback to GGG here in the feedback section of the forum.
It's not misleading at all.
It's possible and it's very much doable, he also had to try the layout for the first time in order for his later attempts to be much faster.
If you're not willing to memorize layout/invest time in the labyrinth, then you shouldn't expect your labyrinth runs to be short. Logic 101.
As for the other part of not being fun for them, well, that's not actually a new thing in PoE, is it?
A bunch of player don't find maps, races, 90+ lvl grind, gear grind and trade fun.
Guess what those players do while they play the game?
People and their entitlement... heh.
Claims of how easy it is to run lab quickly when you run it a lot begs the question:
"If you don't enjoy lab, then why would you run it a lot and bother to memorize the map?"
If somebody says "I don't like the taste of crab and it's a pain to eat them" then it doesn't make much sense to say "You can learn to eat them really easily and quickly if you eat a lot of them!" That doesn't fix the problem of not liking the taste of crab.
It's a borderline non-sequitur to talk about solving one problem as if you've solved two problems.
Lab has probably divided the community more than even RNG-based access to maps ever could because it's a mini-game found nowhere else, one many didn't expect to find as a core part of an ARPG, and even new players will be attempting lab and forming an opinion about their experience.
Now that prestige classes will finally leave lab in 4.0, will GGG get it right this time or will they find new ways to repeat old mistakes? Last edited by EnjoyTheJourney#0109 on Mar 25, 2016, 9:33:21 AM
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Just so you all know, you don't actually have to run the lab multiple times to get it memorized.
Every single day there's a post on the poe subreddit containing the layout of the Merciless labyrinth, and sometimes the cruel and normal ones as well. Here's a link to the most recent thread:
https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/4buacj/daily_labyrinth_march_25_2016/
This makes running the lab trivial. I enjoy running the lab on days where the layout is easy (either 0 or 1 gold door) and I can do ~5 minute runs.
As for leaving the game because of traps, well that's just silly. You can do all the labs for your character in an hour and be done with it forever. Or, you can just not do the labs! The rest of the game hasn't changed much since 2.1. Traps are incredibly easy to avoid, as well. Just leap slam/whirling blades/lightning warp through. |
Posted byMaswasnos#1352on Mar 25, 2016, 9:41:55 AM
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Hate the lab myself but 3x won't kill you. Worth the reward. Just go to reddit and find the daily map and quickest way through. Don't seek to clear or explore every nook and cranny and that bad memory is gone in no time.
I did it at 62 atziri at 67 than went into mapping and never looked back. Fuck that place.
Git R Dun! Last edited by Aim_Deep#3474 on Mar 25, 2016, 9:43:43 AM
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Posted byAim_Deep#3474on Mar 25, 2016, 9:42:10 AM
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EnjoyTheJourney wrote:
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tinko92 wrote:
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Turtledove wrote:
The highlighted part or sidtherat's statement is misleading. He keeps repeating this. When people called him on it in another thread he posted the supposed proof that his statement was true that labyrinth runs should only take 5 or 7 minutes. First, let me state that sidtherat LOVES labyrinth play. This is fine, of course. But, it means that he plays it over and over, again and again, which he freely admits. So, he posted a video of HIM running the labyrinth. He admits that he had just previously run the labyrinth FOUR times before his video run. This was the exact same layout, four times immediately previously. He went amazingly fast through it in the video, didn't bother picking up loot, didn't kill monsters unless he had to, all the traps were perfectly scouted out so he knew which ones he could just barrel thru and which ones to be careful with etc.. He finished in about 8 minutes. (He got lost during the run for a minute, which just demonstrates how difficult it is to find your way around in this content.) So someone that doesn't have the layout memorized and plays the labyrinth as little as possible, it would be absolutely impossible to do it in 5 minutes. I would guess that a half hour would be a much more reasonable figure for someone that does the labyrinth as little as possible.
The problem for many people is that the labyrinth is not fun to them. This should be the message to GGG here in the feedback section. Please don't let others intimidate you into not giving your feedback to GGG here in the feedback section of the forum.
It's not misleading at all.
It's possible and it's very much doable, he also had to try the layout for the first time in order for his later attempts to be much faster.
If you're not willing to memorize layout/invest time in the labyrinth, then you shouldn't expect your labyrinth runs to be short. Logic 101.
As for the other part of not being fun for them, well, that's not actually a new thing in PoE, is it?
A bunch of player don't find maps, races, 90+ lvl grind, gear grind and trade fun.
Guess what those players do while they play the game?
People and their entitlement... heh.
Claims of how easy it is to run lab quickly when you run it a lot begs the question:
"If you don't enjoy lab, then why would you run it a lot and bother to memorize the map?"
If somebody says "I don't like the taste of crab and it's a pain to eat them" then it doesn't make much sense to say "You can learn to eat them really easily and quickly if you eat a lot of them!" That doesn't fix the problem of not liking the taste of crab.
It's a borderline non-sequitur to talk about solving one problem as if you've solved two problems.
Lab has probably divided the community more than even RNG-based access to maps ever could because it's a mini-game found nowhere else, one many didn't expect to find as a core part of an ARPG, and even new players will be attempting lab and forming an opinion about their experience.
Thank you! Well said.
Guild Leader - LÉGÄCY
POE is happy good luck fun time for great imperialistic leaders!
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Posted byDigitalDreams#4105on Mar 25, 2016, 10:22:55 AM
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tinko92 wrote:
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Turtledove wrote:
The highlighted part or sidtherat's statement is misleading. He keeps repeating this. When people called him on it in another thread he posted the supposed proof that his statement was true that labyrinth runs should only take 5 or 7 minutes. First, let me state that sidtherat LOVES labyrinth play. This is fine, of course. But, it means that he plays it over and over, again and again, which he freely admits. So, he posted a video of HIM running the labyrinth. He admits that he had just previously run the labyrinth FOUR times before his video run. This was the exact same layout, four times immediately previously. He went amazingly fast through it in the video, didn't bother picking up loot, didn't kill monsters unless he had to, all the traps were perfectly scouted out so he knew which ones he could just barrel thru and which ones to be careful with etc.. He finished in about 8 minutes. (He got lost during the run for a minute, which just demonstrates how difficult it is to find your way around in this content.) So someone that doesn't have the layout memorized and plays the labyrinth as little as possible, it would be absolutely impossible to do it in 5 minutes. I would guess that a half hour would be a much more reasonable figure for someone that does the labyrinth as little as possible.
The problem for many people is that the labyrinth is not fun to them. This should be the message to GGG here in the feedback section. Please don't let others intimidate you into not giving your feedback to GGG here in the feedback section of the forum.
It's not misleading at all.
It's possible and it's very much doable, he also had to try the layout for the first time in order for his later attempts to be much faster.
If you're not willing to memorize layout/invest time in the labyrinth, then you shouldn't expect your labyrinth runs to be short. Logic 101.
I believe that it is misleading because the context of the discussion is people that do not enjoy labyrinth play. Those people are not generally interested in memorizing boring layouts and definitely not interested in practicing boring content that is not fun for them. The context is how long do people that do not find the labyrinth fun have to "suffer" through the labyrinth run. Or how much time do these people lose when they die in the labyrinth or leave the labyrinth.
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tinko92 wrote:
As for the other part of not being fun for them, well, that's not actually a new thing in PoE, is it?
A bunch of player don't find maps, races, 90+ lvl grind, gear grind and trade fun.
Guess what those players do while they play the game?
People and their entitlement... heh.
I believe that GGG should make the labyrinth optional by not gating the ascendancy points behind the labyrinth. That way people that don't find it fun don't have to do it. People that enjoy playing the labyrinth can play it all they want. This way the labyrinth would be made optional like the other things you mention, maps, races, etc.
Over 430 threads discussing labyrinth problems with over 1040 posters in support (thread # 1702621) Thank you all! GGG will implement a different method for ascension in PoE2. Retired!
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Posted byTurtledove#4014on Mar 25, 2016, 10:56:31 AM
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