SET FREE THE ASCENDANCY POINTS (or rework the lab) [New ascension methods/lab rework ideas]

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Jgizle wrote:

Finally, do you think power creep should just be handed to you for free, as in no difficult content is required to obtain it. If yes, what content is there left in the game for you to do that actually tests this new found power you have obtained.

If you understand that power creep must be worked for and not given without a challenge, then you understand that AC points can not be removed from lab.

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gibbousmoon wrote:

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Jgizle wrote:

Finally, do you think power creep should just be handed to you for free, as in no difficult content is required to obtain it. If yes, what content is there left in the game for you to do that actually tests this new found power you have obtained.

If you understand that power creep must be worked for and not given without a challenge, then you understand that AC points can not be removed from lab.

Anything that gives you power is called power creep when overall difficulty of the game remains the same. I dont think you understand what power creep is. We equip items for power, we trade for power, we buy power, and AC gives power on top of all these things we use to get more power. Shaper is a joke that can easily be faced tanked and dpsed down. The most difficult content is uber lab, and that is a breeze once you learn lab.

We are getting stronger and stronger every patch while enemies stay the same. They cant even buff monster life or eventually it becomes problematic for non meta builds.

We are in a period of time that any more power creep will destroy this game. Jewels alone was good enough. Now we got AC points which are OP and dont count towards our skill tree point limitations. It doesn't matter what AC you choose the per node values are better than any in the normal passive tree.

Lately GGG has been adding uniques that are way overtuned such as Varunastra, Voidheart, Reach of the Council, and so on. Even if they get minor nerfs their legacy items will forever exist. And since standard makes up the majority of the player base, its only a matter of time before this games gearimg process ends up like D3 and people get bored within a week or 2.

I know what power creep is. You don't seem to understand what it is, or the impact it is having on the game.

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Jgizle wrote:

I know what power creep is. You don't seem to understand what it is, or the impact it is having on the game.

"Power creep" is a form of inflation.

You used it as if it were interchangeable with "power." (You basically said the reason a player runs the Labyrinth is to obtain "power creep.") They are not the same.

You are about to cough out a wall of text in response to this, but I'm really not interested in it, so don't bother. Your original post speaks for itself, no matter how you dance and shake and throw smokebombs.

It's not a big deal to be wrong about something or make a mistake, you know. Or to be teased for it a bit. Coming up with convoluted (and patently false) reasons one didn't actually say what one said just makes one look foolish. I know you will resist the temptation to do just that.

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Jgizle wrote:

Anything that gives you power is called power creep when overall difficulty of the game remains the same.

Sounds like a more in depth way to say inflation.

AC points is power inflation. The difficulty of the game has not changed. You dont require AC points to beat Uber Lab, which means the hardest content in the game right now, Uber Lab, is not balanced for Ascendancy because that is how you get your AC points.

They need to add harder content for power creep to decline. Atlas of Worlds did not do that and adding a few traps to maps does not count when monsters remain the same.

This is the reason AC points are locked to lab. GGG made it clear the game is not balanced for AC, that makes it a fact that AC is power creep. The entire design philosophy of AC was to create build diveristy by making certain classes excel at different things really well. Hence the problem with pathfinder overshadowing all content without even trying. Pathfinder doesnt even need to be able to see what they are fighting to kill things, as was made apparent by the Shaper Kill with a black screen.

AC points will never be removed from Lab because of power creep. Lab as we know it will never change. If you are lucky they might reduce trap quantity or make it flat damage. Other than that really these threads are useless.

I do however enjoy writting in them, regardless if any one agrees. Ignorance is not always bliss.

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Jgizle wrote:

This is the reason AC points are locked to lab. GGG made it clear the game is not balanced for AC, that makes it a fact that AC is power creep.

Saying that AC points need to be gated behind lab because of power creep is a complete non-sequitur. Labyrinth does nothing to mitigate the power creep. I see no logic here that connects power creep to labyrinth, only to it being the source of ascendancy points gated behind labyrinth. It seems to be a totally disconnected argument to me?

GGG has stated that the power creep was planned and that their plans to mitigate it involve beefing up other parts of the game. They have already implemented some measures and announced that further things will be done in the next releases.

Lab needs to gate ac to make it have difficulty to be obtained. People wouldnt complain they need to be seperated if it wasnt difficult. Ths makes the power creep at least worked for compared to other suggestions which make the points guaranteed achievable for any one.

Nothing they change can make the game more difficult. They cant buff monster life and they cant nerf skill damage to bring it more inline as it would just inflate the meta build issue.

They would have to make ai smarter and work together like warbands to facilitate difficulty. That does nothing when you wreck everything in a couple hits which only leaves bosses for difficulty improvement which are optional outside of the main story, which can be out leveled. They might continue adding traps to normal gameplay to slow down progression and facilitate difficulty.

In the end, there is little they can do without removing mechanics like jewels or ac points from the game.

If they just want the game to have shortlived fun, they can seperate ac from lab and continue their trend of free power without difficulty increases to balance it. We are on a track where red maps with 8 mods will be a cake walk and the game has no true end game goals.

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Jgizle wrote:

Lab needs to gate ac to make it have difficulty to be obtained. People wouldnt complain they need to be seperated if it wasnt difficult. Ths makes the power creep at least worked for compared to other suggestions which make the points guaranteed achievable for any one.

Nothing they change can make the game more difficult. They cant buff monster life and they cant nerf skill damage to bring it more inline as it would just inflate the meta build issue.

They would have to make ai smarter and work together like warbands to facilitate difficulty. That does nothing when you wreck everything in a couple hits which only leaves bosses for difficulty improvement which are optional outside of the main story, which can be out leveled. They might continue adding traps to normal gameplay to slow down progression and facilitate difficulty.

In the end, there is little they can do without removing mechanics like jewels or ac points from the game.

If they just want the game to have shortlived fun, they can seperate ac from lab and continue their trend of free power without difficulty increases to balance it. We are on a track where red maps with 8 mods will be a cake walk and the game has no true end game goals.

You ignore the fact that GGG has already stated that the solution to power creep is not what you state above. The whole post is based on the fallacy that labyrinth is difficult content. Labyrinth is boring, irritating, tedious and not fun game play. It is different game play from the rest of PoE. It is not difficult only different and many people dislike because it is boring, irritating, tedious and not fun. You continue to try to tell me what my motivations, likes and dislikes are. You don't know better than me what my motivations, likes and dislikes are. It makes you look silly to keep doing it.

I can do uber lab in 10-30 minutes depending on if im skipping through eveything or going for all keys. It is not difficult once you know layout and have a build that doesnt care about traps.

Just because its not difficult for me as a juggernaut doesnt mean it isnt difficult. Pathfinder can cheese because of flasks. But what do other classes have that can trivilize traps, or wreck a full power Izaro. Just range which requires perfect gameplay to not be 1 shot by Izaro in Uber.