New Skill Development - Part 2

There goes my discharger... Instead of killing cwdt + EC + IC completely, how about just adding a small internal cooldown on it? This would mean that it prevents the instant death from various monsters, while you wouldn't be able to tank physical damage continuously. My character has loads of offensive capability and I wouldn't mind having to get some extra defensive nodes, but cwdt + EC + IC in practice is the only way to keep my character alive in certain burst damage situations even with those nodes. Evasion only works until it doesn't and you die, armor is nearly useless, block means my offensive capability goes downhill and the build doesn't work.

Casting enduring cry, then ICing manually is very clunky and takes a whole lot out of the dynamic gameplay on certain characters, unless you use spell echo on EC to bypass the cooldown in which scenario, with proper gear and loads of buff nodes would make it last 15-20 seconds. Enduring cry's effectiveness would have to be nearly doubled to make it viable (read: not a pain in the ass to use) in late game, unless you want us to enduring cry, run away until the cooldown is over, then enduring cry and then IC. Or cast EC + IC all the time. Also this would mean that nearly every melee character would have to get buff duration nodes. Not every build can get these, nor can they get the armor necessary to make enduring charges themselves useful without IC. Especially dischargers who can't do this no matter what.

I hope GGG can come up with something that 1) doesn't destroy half of melee characters 2) doesn't switch from dynamic slaughterfest to clunky self-cast-every-5-seconds (followed up with curses) fest. I personally love playing PoE with melee, and I enjoy not having to spend 10 minutes on every single map due to giving up half of my damage in order to survive.

dont touch enduring cry!
CwdT would be almost useless, evasion and other no-armour chars are pretty much fucked and will get insta killed all the time without it and burning discharge also gets more or less destroyed again without spell echo enduring cry.
Daresso chest will be even more crappy and the gameflow will be totally broken again.

We finally have a game now where you dont have to stop every 3 seconds to recast some stupid bullshit....

"

BisuProbe wrote:

so before the fake correction to hide your embarassment, its a YES.

whats so bad about admitting that you do rely on automated defense before, are you elitist or something. oh that sig of yours wow so pro!
yeah stupid decisions, how sad.

Lol. I made a correction, not hiding anything. If I was, I would've edited the original. I didn't. And yeah, sure, it was necessary in early Invasion. That's -exactly- what I wanted the correction to indicate. Post-tuning, not necessary, because even GGG realized things needed scaling back.

And yeah, stupid decisions. Because I actually learn from my deaths and instead of blaming it on "overpowered" monsters, I've realized what adjustments I need to make in order to survive those situations.

You want to go ahead and blame the game, go nuts. I don't. I look between the chair and the computer to solve my problems first.

. 4 Sec cooldown seems excessive, when the goal 'n point here is to have a few cries at dispose and make our choice inbetween them.

. "Taunt" shouldn't be an implicit of the "Warcry" tag, I mean, if we were to have different cries, both interactions and buffs should be unique to that cry - reference to Enduring Cry.

. The socket/link skill system started with just active and support skills; over the past 3 years, Vaal Gems, Counter-Attack, Heralds, and now Warcries became part of the core-game. It hasn't been balanced in the way that the number of sockets remained in comparison with the added new skills/supports.

Anyhow, enjoy reading these development reports.

"

Serleth wrote:

"

Sternenfeuer wrote:

Just because you are a lucky guy, don't call other players unskillful. I got riped two times the last two weeks, both character mid level 70. The first was a pack of around 20 devourers and it took a fraction of second and i got around 6k life and the second time it was a pack of champion frogs from outside the screen and was even faster. With around 9k armour and 5.5k life in a 68 map. Both character didn't used a cwdt setup, because i really wanted to play a character reliable to high level without cwdt, but IMO at the moment it is just suicidal do try it.

I was in your situation on my last melee character who knows how many times, with either otherworldly chimerals or savage devourers or deadly bone rhoas, etc. 5.5k life, 4k armour, 3k evasion, level 74 maps. Not once did I ever NOT have the reaction time to be able to pop my granite, start leeching, and time my flask use.

I've been playing this game since open beta. Not saying that to be elitist, but to illustrate that I have a boatload of experience behind what I'm saying and that the majority of the time I rip to the burst damage is when I literally haven't planned for it. The other half is when I make stupid decisions. I hardly ever run with cwdt/ec, and never have IC in the chain anyway, so.

Luck has nothing to do with it.

Irrelevant of your other post's i will say this, luck does have a part in it.

Part of the reason why people use the Cwdt combo is because it can save there asses during a laag spike or "out of sync" moment. Since the trigger happens on server-side automated.

That's not to say it's not healthy for the game to remove/break it.

But don't intentionally disregard why these gems where introduced to begin with simply to claim superiority.

1) it facilitated better control during a fight, since endurance charges can be automatically generated which allows shifting priorities of focus.

2) it allowed desync/laag to happen without players actually being frustrated by it, since the cwdt ic combo saved them in vulnerable moments. (simply put, this allowed lean-way for GGG on this subject, since yeah it does exist, but yeah the effect's could be minimized "if build for it" sort of speak)

3) ranged kill speed vs melee kill speed. Cwdt allowed a melee character to be "on the move" much more and facilitated in bringing the gap closer between them, not that that gap is fixed or anywhere near an acceptable balance, but it did help. (in this regards, this will be a step back)

Obviously this is all just assumptions and bullcrap, like everything in this thread, since we have no clue of what other changes will be implemented in tandem with these.

But luck, as long as PoE is an online game, always has a role to play in hardcore.

Peace,

-Boem-

I really hope they'll fix armour, else this change will cause a lot of tears...

"

Boem wrote:

Irrelevant of your other post's i will say this, luck does have a part in it.

Part of the reason why people use the Cwdt combo is because it can save there asses during a laag spike or "out of sync" moment. Since the trigger happens on server-side automated.

That's not to say it's not healthy for the game to remove/break it.

But don't intentionally disregard why these gems where introduced to begin with simply to claim superiority.

1) it facilitated better control during a fight, since endurance charges can be automatically generated which allows shifting priorities of focus.

2) it allowed desync/laag to happen without players actually being frustrated by it, since the cwdt ic combo saved them in vulnerable moments. (simply put, this allowed lean-way for GGG on this subject, since yeah it does exist, but yeah the effect's could be minimized "if build for it" sort of speak)

3) ranged kill speed vs melee kill speed. Cwdt allowed a melee character to be "on the move" much more and facilitated in bringing the gap closer between them, not that that gap is fixed or anywhere near an acceptable balance, but it did help. (in this regards, this will be a step back)

Obviously this is all just assumptions and bullcrap, like everything in this thread, since we have no clue of what other changes will be implemented in tandem with these.

But luck, as long as PoE is an online game, always has a role to play in hardcore.

Peace,

-Boem-

I kind of agree on this :)

My biggest fear isnt about manually casting stuff and the lost of Cwdt combo , its the fact that warcries might overshadow curses because they will do stuff really really similar as shown by abyssal cry.

In my opinion , Abyssal Cry is a fucking horrible example of a warcry. Why should we use that when Temporal chain does that even better while not needing to be in range ?


Why doesnt Warcries synergize instead with curse ? What i meaa by that is that we have various war cry which have an unique use and when linked with a curse , the warcry also cast the curse and the curse is improved by the number of mobs around (on top of having a unique flavor like shown in abyssal about the mob dealing chaos damage)

That way as a melee i have an incentive to use it with a curse and the risk vs reward is there while a ranged or caster would still keep the faster casting + curse combo, so it make they use worthwhile given the risk of using them and i like it because in its current state Abyssal Cry is not worthwhile.

and in the end it would synergize well with curse and not add another layer of buff.

Nevertheless , its a slippery slope i hope GGG handle well and i dont want it to be reactive gem 2.0 lol

So no more cwdt ic Ed combo. This will slow the game down so much for melee. Remember when you were told your game was way to slow GGG and that's what put people off before you added this? Who wants to go back to casting enduring cry before every mob. Melee is in a bad enough state as it is.

You now also have to make room for 2 skills on your limited toolbar.

Good but where is more socket ? What do you think to have 5l on boots or gloves . Or a belt whit 2,3 socket for new gem setup.