1.3 The Community's Molten Strike, Face Melting Build!! 1h+shield and 2h variants available

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Nagisan wrote:

I'm considering changing by build to use molten + multi + WED + LL + fire pen + blood magic.....then running grace/hatred with avatar of fire (was previously running BM keystone and no auras without AoF). I know AoF will eat into Hatreds damage, but at 35% additional damage * 0.5 (AoF) = 17.5% additional damage * 2.29 (129% inc fire dmg) = 40% additional damage from hatred.....BEFORE the 59% MORE multiplier of WED. Basically Hatred, even with AoF, should add about 63.6% of my physical damage, as additional fire damage if my math is right.

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Fearmonger wrote:

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Nagisan wrote:

I'm considering changing by build to use molten + multi + WED + LL + fire pen + blood magic.....then running grace/hatred with avatar of fire (was previously running BM keystone and no auras without AoF). I know AoF will eat into Hatreds damage, but at 35% additional damage * 0.5 (AoF) = 17.5% additional damage * 2.29 (129% inc fire dmg) = 40% additional damage from hatred.....BEFORE the 59% MORE multiplier of WED. Basically Hatred, even with AoF, should add about 63.6% of my physical damage, as additional fire damage if my math is right.

Strictly speaking your math is correct, but it's very misleading. With Avatar of Fire you don't deal any physical damage so comparing the damage you gain from Hatred to physical damage is kind of pointless. Your attack is already 100% fire, when you turn on Hatred it's still 100% fire; this means that if you want to compare Hatred's damage gain to the damage you're actually doing, the multipliers from increased fire and WED all cancel out. Basically the bottom line is that you're just gaining 17.5% of your fire damage as additional fire damage, which while it isn't terrible (it's still better than Haste) it's no 63% DPS gain.

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Nagisan wrote:

That being said, 17.5% * 1.3 = 22.75% added fire dmg (36.17% counting the WED gem) if I run AoF with Hatred.....vs 35% * 1.4 (40% inc WED) = 49% added cold dmg w/o AoF (~78% counting the WED gem).

Again, if the math is correct, that has me leaning away from AoF, either 36% added dmg as fire or 78% added dmg as cold. May be better to run that with molten/multi/WED/LL/BM......would fire pen still be worth it as the 6th link with phys/fire/cold dmg? What else could I put there that would work out better (if anything)?

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Fearmonger wrote:

Like I said, all of the damage modifiers cancel out. If you multiply 17.5% by anything you're double dipping on bonuses because when you take 17.5% of your final fire damage without Hatred, it already has all of those bonuses applied.

Taking AoF halves Hatred's effectiveness. That's it. If you're getting any other result you're over thinking it.

Fire Pen is somewhat questionable without AoF, yeah. With a level 20 Hatred only ( 0.60 / 1.36 = ) 44% of your damage dealt is fire so a mob with 75% fire resistance only reduces your damage by 33%, which is fairly manageable.

I've mentioned this before but I think it bears repeating in a different manner: One benefit of Avatar of Fire is it significantly increases your curse effectiveness. Without AoF, a little over half of your damage is elemental and a little under half is physical which makes both Elemental Weakness and Vulnerability fairly lackluster. But if you run AoF, you can use Flammability (or Ele Weakness) and it applies to 100% of your damage dealt which makes a significant different in curse power.

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Fearmonger wrote:

Some feedback on the guide for you Kry. First off I'll say you've done a pretty good job optimizing your tree, I ended up coming up with something very very similar once I found out that Iron Grip and Point Blank apply to the projectiles, so props for that.

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**There is the WED nodes right by point blank that are kind of nice, as well as

These nodes are pretty trash, I wouldn't take them under any circumstance. Even assuming you're running Avatar of Fire for them to be fully effective, you're only getting 8% increased damage per passive skill point and there's several other places on the tree where you can spend points more efficiently if you want to jack up your damage.

I see that you prefer going into the templar area for Catalyze and the life as well. I don't think there's any compelling reason that you wouldn't do this since they're some of the most effective nodes of their kind in the entire tree, and there's only one "wasted" node to travel through. You can also grab the Enforcer notable which is one of the most effective point expenditures you'll find on the whole tree; 22% increased physical for one point is just spectacular. And if the life is too much for some people there's better places on the tree to remove points (Duelist or Scion life). For these reasons I would advocate including it in the primary build.

The build is pretty severely lacking any significant amount of attack speed, and while your damage may be fine without it you should take this into account in choosing the few damage nodes you do take. The Wrecking Ball cluster by Point Blank is a very effective damage increase for this reason and I personally would take it as soon as I got Point Blank (even if I didn't need the damage I would respec out of other nodes into it, if possible).

Another way you can pick up attack speed would be to reroute your path through the Duelist area through Acceleration and Leather and Steel notables. It costs 3 extra points than just continuing on past Golem's Blood and you gain 12% attack speed (probably about a 8% DPS increase without Haste), 40% armor/evasion, and even some movement speed from the removal of armour penalties. It may be a good idea to take your route if you're rushing to Point Blank, but late game when you have some extra points to spare I think respeccing into this routing would be a no-brainer.

You're taking the "Armour and Life" nodes below the Marauder area (which personally I'm not sold on, but that's beside the point) but you're not taking the significantly more effective Armour and Life node in the Duelist area adjacent to Master of the Arena.

For reference of the changes I'm talking about, here's the build I would run.

I would also take Kraityn over Oak in Cruel, with the huge amount of increased damage and minimal amount of attack speed you've got it should be clearly better. For example, in the build I linked I've got 370% increased physical and fire damage with level 20 gems so if you run the numbers I would need 108% increased attack speed before Oak's bonus would surpass Kraityn's in value. That's obviously not going to happen.

Koam's really should have honorable mention in the suggest items section since this is a 2H build and you don't really need a second 6-link. Obviously it's unobtainable to most players, but if it is obtainable to you then it's almost a no-brainer.

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mopzi wrote:

any chance of posting tooltip dps pics ?