Tanking definition

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Mahesys wrote:

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ancalagon3000 wrote:

Nothing beats life / armor / block guys, get over it

Evasion = lol oneshot, MOM / AA = not enough buffer

That's false and depends on the enemy you're facing. MoM is way more useful against, for example, vaal smashes instead of armor.

Some maths with ZERO ARMOR lvl20 AA and MoM from cloak of defiance (40%) VS. 20k armor

500 damage, 20k armor provides 76,92% mitigation = 115,4 final damage
500 damage, MoM decreases that by 40% = 300 - 189 from AA = 111 final damage

1000 damage, 20k armor provides 62,5% mitigation = 375 final damage
1000 damage, MoM decreases that by 40% = 600 - 189 from AA = 411 final damage

1500 damage, 20k armor provides 52,63% mitigation = 705 final damage
1500 damage, MoM decreases that by 40% = 900 - 189 from AA = 711 final damage

2000 damage, 20k armor provides 45,45% mitigation = 1090 final damage
2000 damage, MoM decreases that by 40% = 1200 - 189 from AA = 1011 final damage

And so on. This assuming no inner force, pushing AA to 229 flat reduction and ZERO armor.

5k armor + MoM + AA are better than high armor alone. Stack 50%+ block and you're set. Also MoM protects against spell damage and very big hits too while armor doesn't. Check Ziggy AA MoM armor EK build for firther information :)

And in all honest, my SC templar with 11k armor and AA tanks better than my ex 13k armor 60% block duelist too :/

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tinko92 wrote:

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TheTenthDoc wrote:

Block is just as good with evasion as it is with armor (the exception being a broken unique).

Evasion is entropy-based, NOT random. If you have 80% chance to evade, you will be hit 1 out of 5 attacks, period.

From the mechanics thread: "If an incoming critical strike succeeds its hit roll, a second independent hit roll is performed to determine if the critical is evaded or not. If this roll succeeds, a critical strike is scored. If it fails, the attack still hits, but only for regular damage."

Basically, if an attack crits you can make it a non-crit with an evasion roll, while armor characters just get shit out of luck since critical hits obliterate armor efficiency.

Physical attacks and spells that cause "a hilarious amount of damage" do plenty of damage to everyone thanks to the pretty pathetic mitigation armor offers large hits (which is why the plated affix does jack shit, but the physical resist map mod does a lot).

It's still luck based, just not that much like relying on block, of course.

Even Vaal's crit smash can't take more than 5k life when I use my Granite/Jade flasks.
While an evasion character gets one shot even without crit.

And I have no idea how can anyone play 90+ level melee character as an evasion based, not to mention tank anything serious.

Evasion is best suited for ranged characters, if you don't try to tank with that character, from my experience.

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You cant eat a touch of god with mom / aa / 5k armor because i know those builds have less than 4k hp

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kasub wrote:

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You cant eat a touch of god with mom / aa / 5k armor because i know those builds have less than 4k hp

Um why? I have an AA/MoM build with 6k HP.

AA does make characters extremely tanky(especially with inner force). Getting high HP pool is still very much required.

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ancalagon3000 wrote:

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kasub wrote:

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You cant eat a touch of god with mom / aa / 5k armor because i know those builds have less than 4k hp

Um why? I have an AA/MoM build with 6k HP.

AA does make characters extremely tanky(especially with inner force). Getting high HP pool is still very much required.

AA doesnt even do jack vs big hits

you are one of the few builds aa mom with lots of good gear and hp, good 4 u, you got some common sense

Most of my complaints are for retards that post 'immortal tank' and make videos of lunaris (serious!) or 66 maps with 3k hp, or tank a story Vaal smash rofl. Then after proclaiming immortal tank build, start replying to questions by saying what map mods and bosses they avoid, basically every fucking boss a real tank would stand up to. Ridiculous. And should I mention all these ''immortal'' builds are on scrubcore.

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kasub wrote:

Well I use AA with inner force so I am reducing 229 physical/fire dmg. Rhoas/chargers/evangelists are extremely easy in most maps due to this. I am able to do all map mods(although half regen kinda sucks..) I still use IR for the jade/granite combo.

Yes, many people are playing low maps with few damage mods and seeing how nice AA is. It is still verrryyy good at high levels(being immune to voidbearers is great) but at low levels you can tank whole champ groups without worry.

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Saltychipmunk wrote:

the funny thing i see in the game is there are a few mechanics in the game that render evasion and armor , 90% unnecessary.


1 cwdt + enduring cry + immortal call + endurance charges + increased duration = no need for armor .

2 gmp + faster casting + flame totem + blind ... or just blind on anything with 8+ aps = no need for evasion.

3

75% block chance .... over kill.


you set up a build with immortal call and blind . and you literally can ignore getting armor and evasion

and the times you do need armor and evasion .. you can always pop a jade or granite flask.

id go so far as to say that once Ir is all properly nerfed , alot more people are going to roll with blind and immortal call builds .

hell most of my spell casters roll with blind on a support skill or totem now.

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ancalagon3000 wrote:

not sure if srs, troll, or n00p

cwdt requires you to take the dmg first ... derp

block and evasion are not even the issue or point of discussion here

this game is well known for its dmg spikes