[question to GGG] PoE items on d2jsp

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MonstaMunch wrote:

It ruins the game because it makes it effectively pay to win, but it doesn't take away revenue that would have gone to ggg. The whole point is that they don't sell in game items in the first place.

The whole point is that the sites existence has a negative for PoE, so I dont really get why you would be pedantic enough to point this out. I realise beta keys (what I was talking about) & in-game items are two different things, and also dont really care whatever FG actually is.

I just want people to understand that it is not OK, because if some people realise what they are doing, they are less likely to do it (sorry if this sounds like a rehash of what you said)

Consider these 2 points and see if you agree:

• GGG doesnt sell you in game items because that would be pay2win
• Every time someone sells an in-game item on one of these sites, it brings us 1 step closer to pay2win.

So what do you think? Do you want to help make PoE pay2win? I assume those of you that say you cant afford beta keys DONT want that, so by providing your support to these sites you are really shooting yourselves in the foot arent you? Its not really relevant if the currency is real money or not, any 3rd party currency is likely to have the similar negative effects.

I am hopeful that d2jsp won't be an issue with this game. Diablo 2 was a game where it had no real currency system. You had sojs, runes, and forum gold. Hopefully with the huge currency system that PoE has in place people won't resort to using those forums.



On a side note, supporting d2jsp is supporting njaguar(aka Paul Taulborg). The site rose up because of a popular bot program, which was soon turned into indirect pay2win. The only one allowed to sell d2jsp fg is the site, or they will perma ban your account.

I hated the fact it was so useful in diablo 2.

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Covert wrote:

Trading through external sources is against the rules. Please do not do so.

the problem is not d2jsp.. it´s the people who use it... the only thing we can do.. is avoid using that kind of things..

In my opinion D2jsp users deserve a banhammer just like cheaters.


First off, that site got big from a diablo2 bot named d2jsp.
So the first userbase of the site are the cheaters that ruined D2.
Fools Gold was originally something you got for posting on that website but some kids wanted to pay to own more fools gold so he saw a business idea, so donations resulted in some virtual currency.

1. Userbaser are mainly cheaters.


2003-2005 was the high phase of cheating in Diablo2 there were numerous dupe methods, so itemshopowners joined the site to buy certain Diablo2 items for fools gold which they duped and sold for real cash which ended up on that botterboard again.
The foolsgold itself will be traded vs cash on other 3rd party sites.

2. The botterboard is at fault for the rise of several itemshops.


Now look at races. Let's say somebody got some fools gold and a new 1 week race starts.
Some progressed player sells items for fools gold instead of normal ingame currency.
The new player suddenly got a boost with items he couldn't have found at his level.
Or some players sell ingame currencies for fools gold just to buy them back later for less fools gold.
Banned cheaters don't start with zero again because they buy equipment with fools gold again.
That's the main reason that site still exists because there are mainly cheaters that get banned in online games and there are kids that use items shops.
Fools gold is only used as cheater insurance not to start with zero again.

3. Fools gold totally ruins the trade system that any game indended. Races aren't fair anymore, because fools gold users get an advantage by buying equipment.
Cheaters get zero punishment.

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I guess you could sell that fg for real money also rather than trading but you'd have to do that elsewhere.

There is a so called donor forum, donors that donated several hundred dollars sums get access to it and are allowed to do cash trades.

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One way we can stop sites like d2jsp being attractive is to offer better trade tools ourselves. If people can link items and complete trades on our forums (without having to load the game), it'll be a lot more convenient than using d2jsp

That's not the reason why it is attractive to people.
It's attractive because it's a cheater insurance. 90% of the users there are online game cheaters.
Cheaters sell around 50-60% of their items there to have some fools gold.
When they get banned they use the fools gold reserve to buy new items which got cheaper.

Another reason why it is attractive is that many itemshoppers/shops are involved which results in unfair advantages in races.

The only thing you can do is to find users by any means and ban those users without mercy.
If there aren't any offers there nobody will use it and there isn't a cheater insurance.

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Diablo 2 was a game where it had no real currency system. You had sojs, runes, and forum gold.

That's total crap.
Before 1.10 you had perfect skulls, um runes, ist runes, PGs, chipped gems.
SoJ was a currency when it wasn't a rare ring.
The only reason the site got popular were dupers and itemshops and a "We don't give a fuck" mentality with 1.10.
The runewords in 1.10 could never been acquired in a legit way.
Cubing runes simply took too much time with hellforge quests and the rarest items were rare like a Vex rune drop. The highest runes almost never dropped.
It was so much simpler to for players to sell basic botter gear for fools gold and buy duped runes with it.

I played a game called Dark Ages (not the camalot one) and the way they did trade was in major cities they would have a trade bulletin board ingame and you can just browse on there and message each person....Good way to control it is once they sign offline there items for sale are removed from the board so it doesnt get flooded with so much junk.

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Chris wrote:

The views in this read definitely represent our opinions on the matter. We will not allow people to discuss external trades on our forum, and we'll do what we can to discourage external trades entirely.

One way we can stop sites like d2jsp being attractive is to offer better trade tools ourselves. If people can link items and complete trades on our forums (without having to load the game), it'll be a lot more convenient than using d2jsp.

I already have a suggestion for that.

Please include Itemlevel of Items you trade so you know if the Item you trade for can roll certain stats or sockets.

I love the fact that it is Chris who answer these kinds of questions. <3

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Chris wrote:

The views in this read definitely represent our opinions on the matter. We will not allow people to discuss external trades on our forum, and we'll do what we can to discourage external trades entirely.

One way we can stop sites like d2jsp being attractive is to offer better trade tools ourselves. If people can link items and complete trades on our forums (without having to load the game), it'll be a lot more convenient than using d2jsp.

The big reason why d2jsp works so well is that you can make actual real world money from the site. Blizzard tried to fix this with Diablo III, and it didn't work out at all. There's been no real good solution to d2jsp so far.

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Chris wrote:

The views in this read definitely represent our opinions on the matter. We will not allow people to discuss external trades on our forum, and we'll do what we can to discourage external trades entirely.

One way we can stop sites like d2jsp being attractive is to offer better trade tools ourselves. If people can link items and complete trades on our forums (without having to load the game), it'll be a lot more convenient than using d2jsp.

I think you're missing the reason why people use D2jsp, Chris. People use that site because they can buy FG (forum gold) and then use that FG to purchase what ever it is they want.

Basically they can buy items for RL money with d2jsp, which is why this is an issue.

This game could be amazing when it comes to the whole pay 2 win thing. But d2jsp destroys it, it still allows an option for pay to win. Sadly, I don't think there's really anything GGG can do about it.

Small hypothetical question:

Say I find the "Uber item of pure awesome" that has 6 good stats with near perfect rolls. What will stop me from selling it on another site for a ton of real money? This is the thing I fear most about the game, that third party trades for real money will happen.

Is it ok just because most of the community does not know it exists or does not care? When you draw the line is this not pay to win? Are people that naive or childish with the "if I close my eyes and ignore it it does not exist" mentality?