Our view on map drop rates

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wiggin wrote:

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ethone wrote:

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And why the endgame as a whole even has the possibility of players falling out of it again after having reached it.

I agree with most of your post but this sentence. If you didn't fall out you would simply stay in the highest set of maps and run them over and over while selling or using in a recipe the rest. The possibility of getting down actually adds to the variety of maps you are running.

Edit: Actually I didn't understand it well I think. I'll just leave it there to prevent confusion.

Will it's just logical that a level 75 player should be doing high level content....it's called progression and it's the stable of any ARPG.
In fact according to your statement why should high level areas drop high level items?

progression.

I'd like to add something.
This game is very good.
The core idea is really nice but it's missing something which are carrots.

If you die at higher level you lose a large portion to your exp.
If you try to make a 6l item you mostly will lose a fortune.
If you like to try a high level map with hard mods on them and you can't progress you end up losing in most cases both a huge amount of exp and a rare map.
It's all about sticks and very few carrots far between.
A system like this mostly drive the players to give up and go to much more friendly alternatives that already exist.

I still see level 30 loot in level 64+ maps.
Still see that when i sell a level 59 rare to vendor give me very similar currency amount to a level 20 rare.

No i don't want the game to be more easy but i want it to be more rewarding....i don't want the best loot in game but i want a loot that is maybe just 10 or 15 levels behind the map i'm currently doing.

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Burgingham wrote:

I am amazed at people's grasp on sample sizes here.

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In this case you simply got to trust GGG's assessment and maybe after you ran 300, 400 or 500 maps you could give your opinion on current drop rates.

I personally like the general stance of GGG on the reward ratios being tied to the risk one chooses in a map. Right now people try to go for low risk factors on big maps to get a maximum of drops and that just seems wrong to me.

Why? I don't have to run 400 maps to see I dislike the current system. Heck I don't even have to run one map to see that. And since I ran out of maps a while back I do not intend to try again until PoE offers me a system I do like.

I don't care if GGG balanced it perfectly, like you said. The fact is: there is a risk (and thus it will happen, at least to certain people) to completely run out of maps. And if there isn't any chance to this, because the drop % is so high, then there is no point in implementing this structure to begin with.

So once again: I believe RNG endgame is not the way to go, no matter what numbers you add to it. RNG to determine my chances to move up in level faster / get better drops, yes! RNG to determine whether i'll be stuck at lvl 60 maps forever or out of maps, no!

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Burgingham wrote:

I am amazed at people's grasp on sample sizes here. "I ran 40 maps and now I can exactly tell what the drop rates are."

what kind of post is this?

the people posting in this thread make up a large portion(probably the majority) of the maps that are run on this game daily

and what's GGG's sample size? you seem pretty quick to try to discourage our thoughts but have you even considered that the posters in this thread probably run more maps per hour than the alpha/dev team combined?



so explain again why our opinions aren't valid

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zriL wrote:

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Chris wrote:

For every person who has a bad experience with a string of eight maps, someone else is basking in riches.

Yep, and naturally, only the ones with the bad experience whine on the forums.

And they have every right to do so.
Im not going back to the pyramid with my lvl 70 ranger to farm for 12 hours because i am one of the "unlucky" doods.
I rather deinstall path of exile and be done with it.

Thats why the "for everyone that doesnt get a map, there is someone that gets two" logic is flawed.
If you are already playing higher level maps and then run out of maps because you got unlucky, being forced to go back to the pyramid is a bad joke.

I dont think GGG´s design decision for maps to be random drops is going to work out for hardcore people that want to experience endgame and do everything to do so, but arent able to because they flipped head instead of tails.

Its the same as saying that you can only PvP if you flip a coin and get heads.
If you get tails, you have to go back to a low level area and farm for several hours in order to find another coin.
I cant even begin to wrap my head around that logic.

For three days, since 9.12 came out, been running maps.

Yes, it seems the bell curve distribution is sticking it good, because on average from 3 maps completed I get about 1 map dropped. Cheers to all of you that get several map drops from a single completed one.

Been alching the maps to try to get >100% quantity with many difficult mods (had no life/man regen and 50% reduction in ES regen at the same time), and whenever find a chisel use it for +5% to both quality and quantity.

It seems for each map drop one needs about 4 chisels to make it +20% to have any hope of a map drop. Current drop ratio of chisels to maps is not known, but for sure there are more map drops than chisels.

Will try to improve luck until run out of maps (stock is steadily declining since 9.12).

It surely was more fun before 9.12 as far as end-game maps go.

I really like the map system, all the challenging mods, with forced me to change support gems or even skill for a certain situation. And I'm running out of 64Lv maps, with leads to conclusion I'm not founding them. You ask why ? Couse even in 101% map I run today I can't find the appropriate maps. I'm really pissed of when shit (sorry for this bad word) like 60s drops in 64 and 65. I was angry before 9.12 when I found those in 68Lv maps, but now its just frustrating. In this moment players are forced to burn the hell of chaos/scourges/alchs to get a CHANCE of chance for same/+1 Lv map. and in most cases they got nothing. Its like hitting a wall with head hoping that it would move for a little distance. I'm tired...

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BigBadWolf1776 wrote:

For three days, since 9.12 came out, been running maps.

Yes, it seems the bell curve distribution is sticking it good, because on average from 3 maps completed I get about 1 map dropped. Cheers to all of you that get several map drops from a single completed one.

Been alching the maps to try to get >100% quantity with many difficult mods (had no life/man regen and 50% reduction in ES regen at the same time), and whenever find a chisel use it for +5% to both quality and quantity.

It seems for each map drop one needs about 4 chisels to make it +20% to have any hope of a map drop. Current drop ratio of chisels to maps is not known, but for sure there are more map drops than chisels.

Will try to improve luck until run out of maps (stock is steadily declining since 9.12).

It surely was more fun before 9.12 as far as end-game maps go.

I stopped playing before i use up all of my stashed maps because i have the suspicion that i might deinstall PoE if it ever happens that i run out of maps and have to go back to the pyramid with my high level character.
Going back to pyramid is not gonna happen.

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silentman wrote:

Will it's just logical that a level 75 player should be doing high level content....it's called progression and it's the stable of any ARPG.
In fact according to your statement why should high level areas drop high level items?

progression.

This is wrong. Progression has nothing to do with that. There will always be a point where the content ends. Once you reach that point, there needs to be a variety of things you can do if the game is aiming for longevity. Map level downgrades add to that variety, running the highest map could easily become just another 'pyramid run' if there wasn't this possibility of downgrade.

About the items, that is completely irrelevant.

I wouldn't react if you didn't quote me because as I said, I am getting enough maps after the patch, I even tried running some 20-30% ones and they sometimes drop some map sometimes not. Also it is possible to get over 50% just with alts. Fleet map of smothering is, I think, the right combo.

So many reactions here are not about the actual change of drop rates but about the map system itself. The only thing they changed in the patch are drop rates and they seem to be just fine, many maps are dropping for many people, all you need to do is to run a bit harder maps (from what I have seen I think the threshold is around 40%, not 50%). I gained more maps than I ran (and in this math is a map, over 100% iiq btw, I lost to crash included) without using a single chisel.

I have run maps since their introduction with 120-160% quantity, usually solo. I use alchs on them, rerolling 63+ for ideal mods for my spec.

My experience, for what its worth, is similar to what Chris posted. There would be a string of maps where I would not get a replacement. Then, just as randomly, I would get 5 or 6 in one map!

On the whole, I have had a surplus of extra maps to sell since they were introduced.

I certainly have noticed an increase in chisels, which is welcome.