Make this step and POE will be better than D2.

This +10. Glad to see @GGG responding on this matter again !

"

TheAnuhart wrote:

"

Barry wrote:

I think people are seeing D2's trading through rose-tinted glasses. It didn't work, that's why everyone used jsp.

No, it did work, exactly as intended.

Free trade in a loot find H&S worked in harmony with loot find BECAUSE of limited trade tools.

D2jsp bastardised that, made gearing up far too easy, by potentially making every item that anyone ever dropped, available to everyone.

GGG keeping that model don't want those who would gear up too quick and thus spoil their own game experience, to gear up to quick.

The result is the gutting of the loot find element.

Difficult trading should be working as intended, it can exist somewhat with loot find.

The easier trading becomes, the more items available to everyone, the more the core of the game will be gutted to balance. A balance that is, by way of item availability, a ridiculous imbalance as regards to loot finding and trading.

It's killing the genre.

Being unable to progress for days on end having to spam trade chat isn't fun. Working as intended doesn't mean it works. Listen to yourself, you're trying to say that having a poor trade system is a way to save players from themselves.

It's just nonsense, don't tell me what is fun.

"

Barry wrote:

"

TheAnuhart wrote:

"

Barry wrote:

I think people are seeing D2's trading through rose-tinted glasses. It didn't work, that's why everyone used jsp.

No, it did work, exactly as intended.

Free trade in a loot find H&S worked in harmony with loot find BECAUSE of limited trade tools.

D2jsp bastardised that, made gearing up far too easy, by potentially making every item that anyone ever dropped, available to everyone.

GGG keeping that model don't want those who would gear up too quick and thus spoil their own game experience, to gear up to quick.

The result is the gutting of the loot find element.

Difficult trading should be working as intended, it can exist somewhat with loot find.

The easier trading becomes, the more items available to everyone, the more the core of the game will be gutted to balance. A balance that is, by way of item availability, a ridiculous imbalance as regards to loot finding and trading.

It's killing the genre.

Being unable to progress for days on end having to spam trade chat isn't fun. Working as intended doesn't mean it works. Listen to yourself, you're trying to say that having a poor trade system is a way to save players from themselves.

You kind of missed the elephant in the room.

A 'poor' trade system works when YOU DON'T NEED TO RELY ON TRADE.
A 'poor' trade system doesn't work when trading is a virtual requirement (or hundreds upon hundreds of hours).

The trade system worked in D2 (without D2jsp) because drops were tuned without giving a single shit about trading or economy.

The same trade system only fails in PoE because they, in major error, tuned the game such that trading is the main way to progress.

Think outside the box, dude.

"

Barry wrote:

It's just nonsense, don't tell me what is fun.

I wouldn't dare.

You find shopping fun, that's cool.
I find looting fun, in.. you know.. a loot-finder.

Right now, in PoE, one outshines the other, pretty drastically, I don't think that's good for the genre.

"

Barry wrote:

"

TheAnuhart wrote:

"

Barry wrote:

I think people are seeing D2's trading through rose-tinted glasses. It didn't work, that's why everyone used jsp.

No, it did work, exactly as intended.

Free trade in a loot find H&S worked in harmony with loot find BECAUSE of limited trade tools.

D2jsp bastardised that, made gearing up far too easy, by potentially making every item that anyone ever dropped, available to everyone.

GGG keeping that model don't want those who would gear up too quick and thus spoil their own game experience, to gear up to quick.

The result is the gutting of the loot find element.

Difficult trading should be working as intended, it can exist somewhat with loot find.

The easier trading becomes, the more items available to everyone, the more the core of the game will be gutted to balance. A balance that is, by way of item availability, a ridiculous imbalance as regards to loot finding and trading.

It's killing the genre.

Being unable to progress for days on end having to spam trade chat isn't fun. Working as intended doesn't mean it works. Listen to yourself, you're trying to say that having a poor trade system is a way to save players from themselves.

It's just nonsense, don't tell me what is fun.

What you have to consider is both sides of this argument. Yes making trading too easy like on d3 is a no no. Making trading too hard like it is now is boring and annoying.

The best solution is to have a system where by it's fun and interactive for the user but they dont feel the need to resort to poexplorer or poe xyz.

See my suggestion at top of page 7. I think this is a reasonable midway solution.

+1 and in fact, I've made a similar suggestion 4 months ago:
http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/108266

I hope the devs are finally really listening.

It would be a great addition.

"

sl0w_moti0n wrote:

"

DexDeus wrote:

What about "Market Place" instances.
A new currency item is introduced to the game: Merchant Token
Each market instance has 30 Merchants all eager for your token!
You give the Merchant your token. In return you get a stash tab of space to advertise your items in for 24 hours.
(...........................)

Some nice idea's here.

Let me modify your point of view a little and tell, what i would like to play if it goes for more trading content.
--------------
Here it goes:
--------------
I think that instead of making a "whole new market instance", it would be cool to insert a feature like another common (could be also instance related) npc.
He would displays our goods in tabs - just like regular vendor.
(..........................)

Not bad thoughts there too.
But what would happen if you are offline, but npc in the market is advertising your items?
A whole new market instance isnt a best idea, it wouldn't really fit in the world of Wraeclast, it would be more work for the developers, and if it were launched, who would trade and stay in the existing towns instead of going to market instances?
Also, placing a new NPC to town isnt the best solution, because GGG would have to place the same trading vendor npc to every town. And the contacting through the NPC is complicated too.

BTW the new trading stash tab wouldn't make trading easier, its point is only making it enjoyable,less monotonous, and making people communicate.
This feature wouldn't give players a sight to thousands of items at a once, you won't be able to brose between thousands of items like with an auction house. It would just make ITEM VS ITEM trading more frequent which i think doesnt do any harm.

Your idea mainly differ from what i wrote with the thing that a player's trading stash could be seen through an NPC, instead of through the player itself. I would prefer to simply know who's trading stash i am seeing, and for this the player should be in the same town instance as me which is also a good thing.

"

mushioov wrote:

+1 and in fact, I've made a similar suggestion 4 months ago:
http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/108266

I hope the devs are finally really listening.

It would be a great addition.

Yes its cool too, the three above different ideas mostly want the same thing with a little difference, but its good to see more versions to this matter. I attach these to the post.

"

TheAnuhart wrote:

"

Thaelyn wrote:

"

Moeeom123 wrote:

An online game like this is built around trading

It may well be me, but one of us is definitely in denial. ARPGs are built around loot gathering, not trading. While the online component makes trading possible, it doesn't change the foundation of what the game is, which is killing monsters and rifling through their pockets.

That's not to say that there shouldn't be some focus from GGG on the trade systems in the game. It is to say, though, that such focus should be secondary in my opinion, as trading is a secondary element of an ARPG.

If only Brian and Chris shared the view.

Sadly, they seem quite happy to copy D3's failings and sail the aRPG genre off to the land of shopping.

Fkn great for the loot-find game.
It goes from bad to worse.

Yep.

In an ARPG, once trading becomes the easiest way to acquire gear, design has failed. This is a hunt and seek game! Trading for upgrades is so easy that only chumps would do it the hard way and actually hunt and seek.

Sadly, I am still one of those chumps. Please consider a self-found league GGG, with appropriate drop rates.

"

Moeeom123 wrote:

But what would happen if you are offline, but npc in the market is advertising your items?

Sry to quote myself but:

"

sl0w_moti0n wrote:

- Item's could only be seen in the merchers tabs while the selling char is online !!! - that's where i totally agree with you :) it's a must :)

I will add that this npc doesnt have to be a new one! :)
Just use the vendor we got already... give him extra option to "browse the local offers" :)
Browse effects could be instanced as well (so we would see not only online players items but mainly those who are currently in town) ...

"

Moeeom123 wrote:

Your idea mainly differ from what i wrote with the thing that a player's trading stash could be seen through an NPC, instead of through the player itself. I would prefer to simply know who's trading stash i am seeing, and for this the player should be in the same town instance as me which is also a good thing.

Imagine u have 30+ chars in already small town area (mb except a3)...
I just thought it would be more comfortable to check only one place for offers rather than clicking chars one after another... You will understand what i mean if u will check crowded stash area and try to right click some particular toon :)

I wholeheartedly agree with the OP.

yes