Looting -- The official thread for discussing the loot system. Updated 18th March, 2013.

It should be clear by reading most of these posts that an FFA system is bad news. Far too exploitable by players who will strong arm low level characters into "getting exp" at the cost of the best loot drops and best Orbs.

Individual drops would be the best solution for a fair game experience.

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Danntboy wrote:

It should be clear by reading most of these posts that an FFA system is bad news. Far too exploitable by players who will strong arm low level characters into "getting exp" at the cost of the best loot drops and best Orbs.

Huh? The best loot drops and orbs only show up in the highest-level areas. Partying with a low-level character in such an area - even assuming they would get better experience in the area, which is questionable - would be just as abusive if not more so under an individual-loot system.
The difference would be that the low-level character, having no incentive to actually endanger him- or herself, simply stands back and lets the high-level character do all the work, picking up their free items after the danger has passed. How would you prevent this?

How about you take a more traditional MMO approach.
Set up a loot table when things drop from bosses or things that require a team effort.

OR you can make it so that the loot table only appears if a monster is attacked by more than one person.

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Skivverus wrote:

Huh? The best loot drops and orbs only show up in the highest-level areas. Partying with a low-level character in such an area - even assuming they would get better experience in the area, which is questionable - would be just as abusive if not more so under an individual-loot system.
The difference would be that the low-level character, having no incentive to actually endanger him- or herself, simply stands back and lets the high-level character do all the work, picking up their free items after the danger has passed. How would you prevent this?

That would be an easy fix. Just make it so they have to be relatively close to get drops. Maybe make it that if your level is too far below the highest person in the group you have to be in the same screen to get drops.

Frankly, individual drops solves all of your problems. Only exploiters would have issue with that system. You get your own drops, and if someone else got a drop that would benefit you, they can redrop it and let you have it if they wish.

Nothing else is as clean and simple. Those arguing for an FFA system have anterior motives. Period.

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Danntboy wrote:

Frankly, individual drops solves all of your problems. Only exploiters would have issue with that system. You get your own drops, and if someone else got a drop that would benefit you, they can redrop it and let you have it if they wish.

Nothing else is as clean and simple. Those arguing for an FFA system have anterior motives. Period.

After playing several characters for the last two months........
I agree 100%. If a person has a problem with individual drops, them they have a problem with fairness. This would alleviate the temptation of high level players to get max number of lower level players into their instance so that they can get maximum numbers of drops and run ahead (or make other exp rush agreements) to collect orbs.

Leve the playing field and balance this game for everyone. Individual drops all the way.

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Danntboy wrote:

Only exploiters would have issue with that system...
...Those arguing for an FFA system have anterior motives. Period.

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Darbarian wrote:

If a person has a problem with individual drops, them they have a problem with fairness.

Kindly refrain from such insults in the future.

That said, I do have a problem with "equality of outcome" when contrasted with "equality of opportunity". The first of these makes no sense in the context of Wraeclast - even in the first area, you're thrown onto a beach filled with exiles who came before you and died. If Wraeclast were fair, you wouldn't have to be fighting hordes of zombies (and bandits, and wildlife, and occasionally other players) in the first place.
If you want to be fair towards other players, there's nothing stopping you. But expecting Wraeclast to do it for you strikes me as delusional.

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Danntboy wrote:

Only exploiters would have issue with that system...
...Those arguing for an FFA system have anterior motives. Period.

I think the word you're looking for is "ulterior." Also, you're accusing GGG of being exploiters.

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Darbarian wrote:

If a person has a problem with individual drops, them they have a problem with fairness.

There are many ways to look at "fairness." Some may think it's unfair that an individual's IIR and IIQ should affect drops from kills that he didn't participate in. Some may think it's unfair that a player can tag along and get drops for doing nothing.

I have nothing against fairness, but individual loot isn't any more fair than FFA. All loot can go to anyone, restricted only by the players' response. It's not like the game automatically gives loot to melee characters. Everyone has a chance to get to it, and when the timed system is implemented ranged characters will have the presumed disadvantages removed.

PoE isn't meant to be a hand-holding, everyone's-a-winner game. It's meant to be hardcore and cutthroat where players are pitted against the world and each other for dominance. FFA loot definitely fits the bill.

First off, there were no insults made unless you are an individual who plans to exploit others with an FFA system. Therefore, I make zero apologies about offending such a person.

second, and this is the insult, your reasoning about how the world of Wraeclast is by nature "unfair" and so the game play should also be IS delusional to the nth degree.

Oh, and I hope that people saw the hypocrisy of you telling others to not throw out insults when in THE SAME Paragraph you say my and the other poster's views are delusional.

So, what I will take from your post is that your acknowledgement that the FFA system is as unfair as the hard, cold world that Waerclast actually supports the idea that the current system is, indeed, unfair. That, is in fact, the debate and I doubt that the developers actually want a player to feel screwed over and angry just because the game world they created is like that for the characters. No, I think that no matter how rough and tumble the virtual word becomes, the developers will want the player to have an enjoyable experience.

Let's leave the "unfair" part of the experience as part of the storyline and not part of how much advantage one player can take of another.

I'd love to hear a dev chime in on this. I'd really like to know if they intend for other gamers to be exploited because that would somehow fit their vision for players of PoE. Somehow, I don't think it does in the least. Quite the contrary, the struggles in the game should bring people together in working together, not making a few elite player more elite.

Please, by all means, let's continue this debate. I want to know more about how an individual drop system is flawed when everyone is still getting drops.


D

Oh, and the notion that the actual game experience is supposed to be a struggle and constant battle against other players who are out to get the better of you will not sell games. People do not play games I general to struggle. They play for enjoyment. If GGG intends to market a game where a player should expect to get taken advantage of by other players, then they would be fools in the business sense.

People do not want to get taken advantage off by you or anyone else. If you are saying that to play this game, one should just expect to get screwed, then why play? I would be very surprised if a GGG representative came into this discussion and indicated that scammers and exploiters would be welcome because that "fits the overall theme of the game world"

Give me a break exploiters. Your pathetic reasons for not wanting a personal drop system is fooling no one. You just want first shot at all the loot. PERIOD. Even a timer would not fix this because you could just tell lower level character to stay back until the timer expires or you will kick them from the exp rush.

Keep posting though. The more you protest, the more information on scams and other looting exploits we can see. It helps the devs.

Tag, your it.