The mechanics thread - beta edition (in depth FAQ)

Any numbers on the new curses?

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herflik wrote:

Could someone post formula to count dmg ,without attack speed included ,just the dmg per hit.

I think it work something like that ,but not sure :

(weapon physical dmg +flat physical dmg mods/skills) * (1+weapon physical dmg mod) *(1+ physical dmg skill/mods increase) +(flat elemental dmg mods/skill * (1+elemental skill/mods dmg increase))

Legend in examples:
weapon physical dmg = axe with 100dmg
flat physical dmg mods/skills = +10 physical dmg
weapon physical dmg mod = axe with +50% physical dmg
physical dmg mod/skills = +5% axe dmg , +50% dmg increase in skill
flat elemental dmg mods/skills= +20 fire dmg, +10 ice dmg
elemental dmg mods/skills = +15% ice dmg , +7% fire dmg ,+10% weapon elemental dmg

No-one really knows at this point. It can't be discovered through experimentation since the numbers on skills are inaccurate.

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herflik wrote:

Could someone post formula to count dmg ,without attack speed included ,just the dmg per hit.

I think it work something like that ,but not sure :

(weapon physical dmg +flat physical dmg mods/skills) * (1+weapon physical dmg mod) *(1+ physical dmg skill/mods increase) +(flat elemental dmg mods/skill * (1+elemental skill/mods dmg increase))

Legend in examples:
weapon physical dmg = axe with 100dmg
flat physical dmg mods/skills = +10 physical dmg
weapon physical dmg mod = axe with +50% physical dmg
physical dmg mod/skills = +5% axe dmg , +50% dmg increase in skill
flat elemental dmg mods/skills= +20 fire dmg, +10 ice dmg
elemental dmg mods/skills = +15% ice dmg , +7% fire dmg ,+10% weapon elemental dmg

Pretty good request.
I'll try my best, but some things have been hard to test, and or give a bit funky results.

Before I begin, make sure you notice the distinction between ADDED physical damage (+x), and INCREASED physical damage (*[1+x]%)

Another thing to note: elemental damage and physical damage are affected by different mods, and hence would have to be kept separate.

physical damage:
(Base weapon damage + added physical damage on weapon) * (1 + increased damage from support gems + increased physical damage from support gems + increased damage from skill + increased physical damage from passives + increased physical damage from weapon + increased physical damage due to quality of weapon) + added physical damage from non-weapon, non-quiver gear

elemental damage:
(elemental damage from skills + added fire/lightning/cold damage on weapon[possibly/probably, if an attack] + added lightning damage from passive + added cold/lightning/fire damage from support gem ) * (1 + increased elemental damage on weapons [if an attack] + increased fire/lightning/cold damage passives + increased fire/lightning/cold damage from gear + increased damage from skill + increased damage from support gems + increased elemental damage passives + increased spell damage [if a spell])
+ added elemental damage from other sources[if an attack]) * (1 + increased fire/lightning/cold damage passives + increased fire/lightning/cold damage from gear + increased damage from skill + increased damage from support gems + increased elemental damage passives + increased spell damage [if a spell])
(everything except increased damage from increased elemental damage on weapons)


This IS NOT 100% accurate (at least for spells), but it's roughly how it seems to work. This is based off the display the game says for damage (therefore presuming it's right). (not to say you're wrong Malice, but I haven't heard devs say displayed damage is wrong)

things to note /summary:
• Increased elemental damage on weapons does not apply to elemental damage from other sources as the name implies (perhaps not even weapons either, have not tested — as the name would not imply)

• Added lightning/cold damage essentially Adds damage to the base damage of a spell (if cold/lightning spell), which makes it extremely efficient damage booster.

• Added physical damage off of a quiver or weapon does not gain any increased PHYSICAL damage at all! (except from critical hits and I presume curses, neither of which were included in the previous expression)
Aparently this is wrong (look at the post underneath me)

•No INCREASED damage mods (short of critical strikes obviously and maybe curses — still haven't tested/heard) stack multiplicatively with each other.

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Mark_GGG wrote:

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Xapti wrote:

• Added physical damage off of a quiver or weapon does not gain ANY increased damage at all! (except from critical hits and I presume curses, neither of which were included in the previous expression)

Not correct. But there are a couple which don't apply which I thought did, so I'll look into those. but some of them definitely do.

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Mark_GGG wrote:

Via PM:
Damage on skills is one of the most wrong things on the skill popups.

Oh okay.

I was basing everything off the displayed damage — what else can a tester do :P

So.....

Can you tell us how elemental damage and physical damage DOES work for attacks and spells?
It is useful for us to know this so that we may give proper feedback.

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Mark_GGG wrote:

Btw, for an example of horrible damage on skill tooltips, get a weapon with added fire damage. Compare the skill tooltips for default attack and leapslam - the default attack doesn't include the elemental damage in the tooltip (it does deal it). These are all getting redone in a huge rebuild of that system I'm working on.

Oh I'm aware of that bug.

True that it's a tooltip damage error, but IMO it's quite MINOR problem, not horrible one, lol.

AFAIK elemental damage just isn't displayed for that skill — that's not biggie at all, I can just look at a skill that DOES show the added elemental damage and use it (taking into account any increased/decreased damage from quality mods or stuff)

From what you told me earlier though, a horrible damage display error would be the fact that added physical damage ring would not actually be affected by any enhanced physical damage modifiers. THAT is a horrible display error

And to correct myself, I should say that physical doesn't not benefit from ANY damage multiplier, just the physical multipliers, which are the main ones. ALL DAMAGE multiplier does affect it, but generally those are only on quality skill/support gems, and/or specific higher level skill gems

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Mark_GGG wrote:

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Xapti wrote:

• Added physical damage off of a quiver or weapon does not gain ANY increased damage at all! (except from critical hits and I presume curses, neither of which were included in the previous expression)

Not correct. But there are a couple which don't apply which I thought did, so I'll look into those.
However, some of the increases definitely do apply to such damage.

Thanks for looking into it Mark.

EDIT: post below completely ignored effect of hit% and crit into DPS character sheet calculation. Oops.

Currently when I equip this ring my DPS in the character screen increases by 23. My attack speed is 2.0 (theoretically 2.016 so rounding isn't a big issue here). So the expected DPS contribution, if unmodified, would be 20.

I'm having trouble coming up with a set up modifiers that would increase the effect of the ring by only 15%.

Ok just had a eureka moment while typing this: All my ED% mods are bow passives, or 5% dmg from Archer mod gear. Except 15% to projectiles in general.

Tested on duelist: Also 2.0 attack speed, expected DPS contribution 20, character sheet contribution 20. So none of the general melee dmg passives, 1h passives, DW passives or Sword passives are factoring into the displayed calculation either.

bugged/screwed up quote post. said something wrong anyway