For the love of god, please, rework DEXTERITY. (Updated)

@Real_Wolf

Not going to reiterate what's been said in this thread already. Think what you want mate.

Having made a successful evasion based build, that was a melee FB cyclone build, and with a good understanding of mechanics, I can say that in general the assumption evasion is broken is wrong.

This is an evasion build based around arrow dodging WITHOUT acrobatics.

Spells hurt it quite badly, due to no phase acrobatics.

But in terms of physical, with the addition of endurance charges (all melee required), and the ridiculous leech I can get with my phys based build, I can say the challenge is stacking health.

If you read epsi's thread adn moos's thread it says it much more elegantly tahn I can. Evasion is health tank. Armour is not as much health tank. If you go EV no IR then you need a TON of health, and my FB build actually doesn't have enough for me to feel safe, and I have to play cautiously. I use Immortal call as a safety for when I can't get into range to use my lifeleech, and my regen doesn't keep up. I run a vitality aura along with haste, grace and purity to keep a high EV.

But I can tell you that getting more EV on my gear is not the priority at all. Maxing resists, getting my health up, getting %regen and getting leech are of FAR more importance than getting a higher EV. The EV is just not as efficient to stack as it is.

Ranged projectiles are ignorable. I dodge almost all of them now. But melee is still dangerous. That is how EV works, it is not broken, it is powerful, but it is hard to build. Whats more my build was extra hard due to the lack of amazing HP nodes like the disc+training nodeset in templars area. My build up until level 50-60 was pretty much a mix of grabbing HP nodes and rushing to RT. I hit RT at about the point when my accuracy was suffering (RT a must as no crit on FB).


I know about EV. I know it is weak. But it is not broken. The system actually works very well, and against mobs I can easily deal with, I can actually tank them fairly well while autoing the rare monster with something like frenzy. I take damage and heal it almost instantly regardless of the hits damage. Armour can do similar but the difference is I can do this against the low level map bosses, armour can't because armour you get hit and you take far more damage than you would if you had dodged.

The inbuild crit protection also works fairly well to just decrease damage against me.




EV is always overstated as 'worse' than it should be. The truth is EV and AR are both in a bad place compared with life, and AR is not stable due to its equation but still gives better outcome vs swarms of minor mobs like monkeys. EV works equally well against all mobs assuming you can tank them with your HP

Make evasion flasks that work similar to granite flasks.

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Real_Wolf wrote:

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johnmaikeru wrote:

http://en.pathofexilewiki.com/wiki/Evasion

You're guaranteed to be hit. Evasion is meant to be a primary defence- you seem to be confused about the actual role of evasion in the game. Even if it wasn't meant to be a "primary [sic] defense", you're admitting that dex builds are gimped from the get-go.

This issue has been flayed multiple times throughout the span of this thread- evasion is stupid and any/all of the top ladder characters use Iron Reflexes or have some sort of hybrid build.

Armor/HP/ES is fucking reliable. Evasion is not.

Evasion IS reliable, armour is not.

HP is reliable

ES is reliable

Go learn about the actual mechanics. Evasion you are gaurenteed to be hit AT SOME POINT, but you will actually evade the correct amount of hits so you can plan around it. Armour you can't, as you can't plan around the difference between a 3k hit and a 1k hit.

All of the top ladder characters use IR because health is their primary resource, IR happens to be very close to the route that those who use EV armours use, and with the unwaverying stance on the same highway and the bonus of not getting stunned being ridiculously valuable, thats why you get IR.

To say that Ev is useless is false. I suggest you read epsi's great thread that was necro'd by another great person who makes great feedback posts. Its not a case of EV is useless, its the problem that even as a tertiary defense it is outshadowed by the HP/Regen/Leech taht you NEED to stack in large number.



As I said, if you could get hte HP to survive 3-4 hits and had ~75% EV you would be invincible. Problem is the size of hits in OB is ridiculous to the point of extreme. Armour is just as useless lategame, thats why everything is HP and avoiding damage by moving around

Real wolf is right,

You need either a nominal pool of HP or ES to go along with Evasion Rating, else you are a glass canon.

If i am not wrong, the Evasion is now much better than it used to be. Back then, it was just plain "direct" evasion calculation.
If i not wrong, there is another set "evasion calculation" added to it, now. What i heard is that this added calculation is a damage reduction, but i cant say for sure.



BTW, if u notice your armours (boot, glove, helm, etc), the ER is higher than the AR or ES at the same level.

didnt read the thread, only starting post and:

Compeltely agree. I just had these thoughts for a long time, that dex-only sucks.

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Real_Wolf wrote:

"

johnmaikeru wrote:

http://en.pathofexilewiki.com/wiki/Evasion

You're guaranteed to be hit. Evasion is meant to be a primary defence- you seem to be confused about the actual role of evasion in the game. Even if it wasn't meant to be a "primary [sic] defense", you're admitting that dex builds are gimped from the get-go.

This issue has been flayed multiple times throughout the span of this thread- evasion is stupid and any/all of the top ladder characters use Iron Reflexes or have some sort of hybrid build.

Armor/HP/ES is fucking reliable. Evasion is not.

Evasion IS reliable, armour is not.

HP is reliable

ES is reliable

Go learn about the actual mechanics. Evasion you are gaurenteed to be hit AT SOME POINT, but you will actually evade the correct amount of hits so you can plan around it. Armour you can't, as you can't plan around the difference between a 3k hit and a 1k hit.

Ok lets spell it out to make this more clear

Evasion is unreliable in practise, armor is reliable in practise

Its much easier to calculate how much damage I am going to take when I am getting armor, there is a reason why almost everyone gets IR (Iron Reflex's). Evasion is change based, yes you are garunteed a dodge on every round, but you have no clue when that is going to happen

Its also pretty much irrelevant when an entire pack is hitting you, which is common place in PoE

Iron reflexes?

Add +1% increased critical strike chance per 5 or per 10 DEX (whatever feels more balanced as a whole).

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Add +1% increased critical strike chance per 5 or per 10 DEX (whatever feels more balanced as a whole).

There is an accuracy check in the game. I'm not exactly sure how the roll goes, but I infer that there is a roll, and that some rolls can be better than others. What I would suggest is not a built in CC for DEX, but rather a modest increase in damage for well-rolled accuracy checks. This would give high accuracy and high DEX both additional implicit value.

Possibly, this facility could be activated through a notable/keystone.

--C

Just recognized: Main main attribute is dex and i have a hitchance of 76%....wtf? This is so fucking stupid. Dex is just 100% broken.

Strg: health + %melee dmg(like: wtf)
int: es + mana (usefull for more auras --> more dmg)
Dex: evasion (eva only useless) + accuracy (yeah, would be nice if i would have at least enough to NOT miss every 4th hit then....speaking here of a lvl 63 dual claw char).


So talking about dex being broken would be in my op. a nice understatement.

Greetings.