Remove xp penalty's from death

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maxkardinal wrote:

GGG made a statement, that they are fine with current situation.

So basiclyy GGG are fine that people prefer time-saving boring grind low-level\easy mods maps over fun play.

Is that coorect?

Yeah, they are (and should be) fine with the idea that you actually have to have a good build in order to get level 100.

The QQ in this thread is u.n.r.e.a.l. Get better builds if you want to do harder content deathless. Removing death penalty makes build/etc not matter at all... any idiot with a two link cast on death build can get level 100.

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MrTremere wrote:

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tackle70 wrote:

The QQ in this thread is u.n.r.e.a.l. Get better builds if you want to do harder content deathless. Removing death penalty makes build/etc not matter at all... any idiot with a two link cast on death build can get level 100.

No matter my build (unless there is a build that can survive 10 seconds without any player input no matter the situation) and my skill, I cannot possibly hope to do deathless without buying a new computer.

If this was only about skill and build, the thread would have died at the first page.

So it's QQ about being poor? That's not GGG's problem, and even if it were, breaking standard leveling progression by removing the XP penalty for death is among the WORST ways to go about solving it.

Yeah their engine sucks. Save up $150-200 and get a new GPU.

If you need to survive 10 seconds with no input on your part, that's YOUR problem.

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MrTremere wrote:

You're right. I'm the only douche that's skipping strongboxes containing exiles because they generate a deadly screen freeze. There's nothing legitimate with wanting a better game experience when D3 works fine but PoE doesn't.


And who cares? GGG stated they are pleased with the penalty, so the thread is already over.

But the solution to this is to complain about the real problem: the lack of engine optimization... Not to QQ about a game mechanic that works just fine.

Yes, HC was fun. HOWEVER, I DON'T PLAY IT ANY MORE BECAUSE OF THE DESYNC PROBLEM!

And NO, I don't want to play an OP CANNED BUILD. If GGG has these skills available in the game they should work -- Otherwise, imo, they should be removed from the game. As the OP HC person pointed out -- don't use that skill. Use ones that don't desync. So, logically, imo, the skills that don't work or cause too many deaths should be removed or the death penalty should be lessened. Maybe, 1 Free death per day or something like that based on skill usage; or a UI option of the player checking "allow 1 death per day."

Also, imo, some of these skills are incredibly fun for certain players. And why should we all be alike?

Or, add to the Wiki -- Danger, Caution -- USING THESE SKILLS WILL CAUSE CERTAIN DEATH!

And it's not always in the same situation that desync can occur with the same skills. Sometimes it's in conjunction with other players' skills, monster AI, monster/party members effects, etc.

And yes, I use bad skills. And yes, I continue to play the game and die, etc.

Another possible solution would be for GGG to allow individual characters out of their history file to be restored as it's really their fault for the death, not the player's. A group of volunteers could visit the history files and determine the legitimacy of the complaint and suggest to GGG that the character should be restored.

Currently level 90 and I died 2x today due to lag/desync. Really unfair, imo, and the cost is exorbitant.

If you retire your char at 90, the XP penalty is a nuisance at best. Or non-existent, if you play HC :P

That said, the current system of flat % per difficulty level does the job extremely poorly. XP penalty should be adjusted per characeter level - made much more harsh in early game and less penalizing in late game.

OK heres what i think!

If you are able to handle high lvl maps when your lvl 85 or so then once you are in the 90s it should much harder to ever see a death happen once you get up in the 90s if you have a strong well thought out build! BUT as far as things like desync and such goes that just makes thing a bit unpredictable at times! And nothing as a standard can account for something unpredictable like desync in compensation!

While i think the exp penalty in its current state is very much intended according to Chis's statement about getting 100 should not happen for just anyone but ONLY dedicated players who push the limits to achieve such! I will also agree that the flat exp penalty is a bit harsh at 90+ in comparison to being almost non existent up until around 85 or so!

IF (And i mean a HUGE fucking IF) they were to do anything to the exp penalty the only way i could see it working is this...
Say your running a 66 map at 70... Well you are already getting 100% exp from the map at that lvl there fore if you die in a map you are getting 100% exp anyway the exp penalty should be much more harsh for that player! At the same time if you are lvl 99 and you are running 78 maps.. in the current penalty you will lose ALOT of maps progress for sure! BUT you are already suffering an exp penalty already from the lvl gap as it is so i think that should be taken into account in the penalty!
In other words if you are getting 100% exp from an at lvl map that exp loss from death should hurt ALOT!
But if you are already suffering a steep exp penalty from the lvl gap then the exp penalty should be slightly less in comparison!
In other words the exp gain/penalty from the map your running should have some bearing on the exp penalty upon death! I wont state any rough numbers because im not balance guy and im sure this has already been though of and im also quite sure there are huge drawbacks and ways this could be exploited if the numbers dont work out correctly! That would be totally up to GGG how they deem the numbers would work! this is just an idea! I just simply agree that the flat % penalty gets a little out of hand once you get in the 90s! and pushing a build up into the 90s can also get a pretty damn expensive too!

Will this happen... Nope i very much doubt it!
Do i think it should happen.. not really because in its current state the exp penalty doesn't really become such an issue until you start pushing past 90 anyway which is only 10 more points away from a 100% complete build which in turn would only mean a bit more damage or final tweaks which would in turn make the game very boring once you achieve it! Your build should be complete and fully functional long before even 90! From 90 on you should simply be adding more to the build!

Think about it this way... what if you hit 100 on your character... then what?
What are you gonna do from there? Reroll? you can already do that once you hit the wall around 90-95!
I think the exp penalty is not only intentional in its current state but necessary to keep us with something further to work for! and as far as i can tell... its working pretty well as intended ATM!

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There's nothing legitimate with wanting a better game experience when D3 works fine but PoE doesn't.

D3 is missing elements that PoE have so they can lesson the effects. D3 doesn't have, accuracy, , flexible movement speed (they have capped movement speed), doorways (for the most part), smaller enclosed areas and many other things that PoE does have. These all have an impact in desync so if GGG removed them desync would be less of an issue, problem is these things make PoE unique and add complexity. So for players like yourself that have issues with desync all the time you probably wouldn't care if these were removed, but for players like myself (that experience little to no desync) having these positive features removed in order to reduce this negative impact on your gameplay isn't worth it.

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Another possible solution would be for GGG to allow individual characters out of their history file to be restored as it's really their fault for the death, not the player's. A group of volunteers could visit the history files and determine the legitimacy of the complaint and suggest to GGG that the character should be restored.

Doesn't matter whos fault deaths are, yours, GGG's, your ISPs, a warning is made for HC characters they will not under any circumstance be restored. The same mentality should be made for SC death penalty. You are trying to suggest a system that isn't needed and could possibly be highly abused. Poe is a hardcore ARPG game, whether you play in SC\HC\Torment\Bloodlines we are all "relatively" playing the same game, only difference is death in HC\Bloodlines is you not just lose that XP, you lose the ability to play it in HC\Bloodlines.

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That said, the current system of flat % per difficulty level does the job extremely poorly. XP penalty should be adjusted per characeter level - made much more harsh in early game and less penalizing in late game.

The current system works very well. It isn't suppose to scale to make it easier to get to 100, that is the key point people are missing. You have a stronger character, better gear, ect you shouldn't be deing at 90+

Your suggestion is the opposite of what PoE needs and what we currently have. If the penalty is too harsh while leveling those early levels then players have a hard time reaching endgame, considering the rolls items have its important that players can get to maps at an appropriate level.

Sometimes I wonder if people even read 1 paragraph of the post before making such comments. The penalty shouldn't be more forgiving after you have a strong, over-leveled character how does that even slightly seem logical to be more forgiving at the top end?

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morbo wrote:

XP penalty should be adjusted per characeter level - made much more harsh in early game and less penalizing in late game.

You have it completely backwards. Reaching level 100 should be an honour, not a entitlement, so the only time you need very harsh xp penalties is level 90+. Prior to level 90, the "keep level 100 prestigious" incentive is virtually non-existent and xp penalties could be reduced.

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Demonoz wrote:

IF (And i mean a HUGE fucking IF) they were to do anything to the exp penalty the only way i could see it working is this...
Say your running a 66 map at 70... Well you are already getting 100% exp from the map at that lvl there fore if you die in a map you are getting 100% exp anyway the exp penalty should be much more harsh for that player! At the same time if you are lvl 99 and you are running 78 maps.. in the current penalty you will lose ALOT of maps progress for sure! BUT you are already suffering an exp penalty already from the lvl gap as it is so i think that should be taken into account in the penalty!
In other words if you are getting 100% exp from an at lvl map that exp loss from death should hurt ALOT!
But if you are already suffering a steep exp penalty from the lvl gap then the exp penalty should be slightly less in comparison!
In other words the exp gain/penalty from the map your running should have some bearing on the exp penalty upon death! I wont state any rough numbers because im not balance guy and im sure this has already been though of and im also quite sure there are huge drawbacks and ways this could be exploited if the numbers dont work out correctly! That would be totally up to GGG how they deem the numbers would work! this is just an idea! I just simply agree that the flat % penalty gets a little out of hand once you get in the 90s! and pushing a build up into the 90s can also get a pretty damn expensive too!

I like the core of this idea, but... like morbo, you have this completely backwards. Take a level 82 character, for instance; if they die in a 66 map you want to absolutely slam them with the xp penalty, because they were in a low-risk zone and still died somehow. Put the same character in a 78 map and I don't believe a high xp penalty is as justified, because it acts as a disincentive for players to actually challenge themselves.

If you combine (the opposites of) the two ideas together, I think the synthesis is brilliant: as long as arealevel is close to characterlevel, the death penalty should be trivially weak, but as the gap between alvl and clvl widens the xp penalty should get progressively more extreme. This would naturally scale hardest for that 90+ group which needs a severe xp penalty, ensuring that lvl100 is very difficult to achieve.