XP loss on death is atrocious game design and should have no place in PoE 2

This is easily one of the most frustrating things in the game to me; however I have changed my stance on it.

Making level 100 difficult is a design decision. So, thats fine, they want it to have meaning. Ok cool.

What is not cool, is it being gated by a grind.

The key here is figuring out the root of the problem. Players obviously hate it, and some don't, why?

I offer because the penalty punishes unfairly, blindly.

What do I mean. You do a map, beat it, die in the next one, lose the previous map exp that you didn't die in, and more.

Its like if you picked up loot, died to the next monster, and the previous loot was taken away. That is obviously nuts, but we do it with exp.

We're punishing the past, without any consideration for behavior in the past.

Start gating exp in some manner. For instance, a map, you gain exp in the map but you don't keep it until you clear the map. So there is a green bar of exp on your bar, you don't get to keep it until you clear the map. To me, that sounds fun.

It also captures punishment, especially when you die on that boss or that last rare- but it also adds some edge and excitement. The punishment also fits the crime. I died, I didn't deserve that exp. Vs I died, I didn't deserve my last x amount of time exp.

Players are mad because its too much, its out of balance.

Oh, and you should also lose exp for death all game. It should be a thing, or not a thing. If you're doing it for half the game, for no clear reason, its a bad design decision.

Things should be done for reasons.

As I hardcore only player these posts confuse me. My suggestion is to make 1 HC character, try to play it as far as you can. After that experience you will never ever feel bad about whatever punishment a non-hardcore death causes again... in any game or genre ever again. Not being facetious here, it's an actual recommendation. You might end up loving HC.

Suggest things which make the game more HC friendly, that way you get a better game overall imo ^^

It was bad in poe 1 but its far worse in poe 2 because past lv 90 it takes like a 1000x times longer to reach 100 than in poe 1 past that lv.

Bah you cant even gain xp from maps unless you di T16 exclusively.

This is totally retarded design that makes you quit as there is really not much point levelling past lv 90.

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Fapmobile#0758 wrote:

I disagree 100%. Death has no meaning without penalty.
Why would I invest in defenses at all if I can just mindlessly keep dying.

100% agree with this. Idea of your glasscannon character would be lost without a penalty. Just cannon than, because it wont matter youre glass.

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Isobel#6615 wrote:

As I hardcore only player these posts confuse me. My suggestion is to make 1 HC character, try to play it as far as you can. After that experience you will never ever feel bad about whatever punishment a non-hardcore death causes again... in any game or genre ever again. Not being facetious here, it's an actual recommendation. You might end up loving HC.

Suggest things which make the game more HC friendly, that way you get a better game overall imo ^^

No thanks. I work 50-60 hours a week. Don't want all my progress wiped out from a single death. If I played for 10 hours a day then I could deal with it, but my time is limited. A lot of people share this opinion.

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kazajhodo#6457 wrote:

What is not cool, is it being gated by a grind.

Grinding is most of the genre. Its called 'Grinding Gear Games' for a reason.

A lot of the people that hate the xp penalty have already set reaching lvl 100 as a goal without understanding what that means. Which is: grind for ages for 1-3% more total skill points.

Level 100 is not required for anything at all (except a skill point). Its an optional goal available for people that want to grind/play more than the average player.

Lv100 is required to even start searching for lv100 skillpoints builds. Not seen a single one.
I dont get it. Nobody cares about that number. It just displays what build the character can already play or not. Thats it.
Let me build my character ffs.

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CovidPatientZero#0332 wrote:

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Isobel#6615 wrote:

As I hardcore only player these posts confuse me. My suggestion is to make 1 HC character, try to play it as far as you can. After that experience you will never ever feel bad about whatever punishment a non-hardcore death causes again... in any game or genre ever again. Not being facetious here, it's an actual recommendation. You might end up loving HC.

Suggest things which make the game more HC friendly, that way you get a better game overall imo ^^

No thanks. I work 50-60 hours a week. Don't want all my progress wiped out from a single death. If I played for 10 hours a day then I could deal with it, but my time is limited. A lot of people share this opinion.

Why should we make a game easier for hc? Isnt hc the point of the game beeing to easy? Hardcore and make it friendly in one sentence?
That is the paradoxon poe2 has created. Same with currency.

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CovidPatientZero#0332 wrote:

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Isobel#6615 wrote:

As I hardcore only player these posts confuse me. My suggestion is to make 1 HC character, try to play it as far as you can. After that experience you will never ever feel bad about whatever punishment a non-hardcore death causes again... in any game or genre ever again. Not being facetious here, it's an actual recommendation. You might end up loving HC.

Suggest things which make the game more HC friendly, that way you get a better game overall imo ^^

No thanks. I work 50-60 hours a week. Don't want all my progress wiped out from a single death. If I played for 10 hours a day then I could deal with it, but my time is limited. A lot of people share this opinion.

Games are meant to give you fun while you stay "inside". If you add some other value to it, just ask how much fun you get of it. If you will have more time to play it will probably end the same, that you will not want to lose your progress. Ok with more time, maybe you would try other mods game offers and maybe you will have the same fun. You never tried so you never know.

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kazajhodo#6457 wrote:

We're punishing the past, without any consideration for behavior in the past.

Start gating exp in some manner. For instance, a map, you gain exp in the map but you don't keep it until you clear the map. So there is a green bar of exp on your bar, you don't get to keep it until you clear the map. To me, that sounds fun.

It also captures punishment, especially when you die on that boss or that last rare- but it also adds some edge and excitement. The punishment also fits the crime. I died, I didn't deserve that exp. Vs I died, I didn't deserve my last x amount of time exp.

Players are mad because its too much, its out of balance.

Oh, and you should also lose exp for death all game. It should be a thing, or not a thing. If you're doing it for half the game, for no clear reason, its a bad design decision.

Things should be done for reasons.

This is an excellent example of terrible design.

The current system keeps the highest levels difficult to achieve, while the punishment is relatively minimal on the lower levels (where gaining skill points to make a difference).

Your plan, which has been posted on these forums repeatedly in different forms, does the exact opposite. It barely affects the player pushing the highest levels, while massively punishing the lower level player. When you can get MULTIPLE levels in a single map, losing all of that experience to one death is huge. Losing 10% of your progress towards the current level (you can never delevel) is a pinprick at level 75.

Deaths at the highest levels are, by design, more painful because getting to level 100 is a stretch goal. The current system allows some consequences at earlier levels, without being massively painful for occasional mistakes, and more punishing at levels where you should be stronger and better.