Fixing Melee (Warrior/Mace)

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CPTBRUMBL3Z#3146 wrote:

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Schverika#2698 wrote:

I've been quiet on warrior topics until I reached maps myself with mine. Haven't gone deep into high tier maps, but I feel I can say a few things at least.

I'd be curious what tier you're clearing so far that you feel safe in, but the biggest problem as I see it with warrior/mace right now is that the speed of attacks (certainly 2hander) means you get hit more often than not. We need the tools to withstand the hits because the problem is that so many hits either aren't reduced by armor or are so hard that armor's "small hit" aspect never really applies. As a two-hander slammer, I flat out just cannot survive sufficiently or safely to get my attacks off and handle crowds. I can appreciate that T14 and 15 are supposed to be hard, but I'm just over base max ele resists with 73% armor and a single white mob can do 800 damage to me, mobs with bonus damage or map mod with bonus damage (esp if it stacks with that) and certain effects and attacks even from a white minion can fucking one shot me. More means to improve armor effects and reduce damage of non-physical is imperative to make warrior/mace feel it can compensate, especially with slower attacks that mean you're being hit.

To sate the curiosity, terribly undergeared while starting out at T2 maps. Still farming (pseudo SSF) to get basic resists from 20% to 75%. 28% armour (955), 1950 life. If top tier maps have even white small mobs reach truck swinging strength, then I'll consider stranger things like Frost Wall and minions to further shape the battlefield.

The only time I grab my 2H mace is when I'm certain everything is too distracted or obstructed to be swinging at me. Anything less and I'm likely to just get interrupted out of the animation. If that's not viable, I'm spamming 1H Molten Blast (I basically run at the same speed as WASD movement if I hold down that button), Ancestral Totem (limit 2) putting down Earthshatter (3 per swing with Upheaval) and zero cooldown Seismic Cry (Greatwolf's Howl ascendancy) to thin out the crowd while staying very mobile.

As someone who has pushed his Warrior up to almost 90 now and finished all my 15s and is hunting down endgame bosses.... Warrior (and anyone who attempts to do melee) suffers from the following:

1) HEALTH - We don't have any. I have seen people get up to 6k health, and people get up to 24k ES. There is no way GGG removed all the life nodes from the tree and thought "yea this will balance well". The massively nerfed health regen is pretty horrible as well unless you are playing a Reduced CDR build and having Time of Need go off every second.

2) CAST TIMES - Warrior has a cast time on nearly every big attack it does, where other classes have none. Sunder would be a great ability if you could cast it instantly and on the move. Perfect Strike on a CD that hits incredibly hard that consumed broken armor would make Warbringer feel great. Instead, the abilities are stuck behind long cast times that you have to "set up" where none of the other classes have to do that.

3) Armour - LOL you buffed the mobs DR more than you helped the players GGG. If this doesn't indicate that the people designing the game don't understand it or test it...... goodness...... Warrior better have a shield (thanks for 3x strength need) because Block is the only defense we have.

4) Stun - This is very powerful but not nearly fleshed out enough to make it a tactic Warriors can really use. Stun should be as powerful for Warrior as Freeze is for Monks. We should have a physical Herald that allows us to spread stuns or stun AOE.



As it stands, Monk is like a Warrior that has no cast time, double the health, able to have 80% block, no cast times and way faster attacks and dashs, and a stun mechanic that not only allows them to destroy bosses without being touched but also chain clear screens of mobs.



My warrior was mace strike up to level 85. With 3k health, 75% block, over 200 Inc AOE and "the mace type" I was able to melee clear screns of mobs. I got up to about level 8-10 maps before I realized how dangerous it was getting. I swapped to Shockwave Totems with a similar build (physical instead of fire, thanks GGG for the 2 unintended nerfs this patch of which you've only fixed 1). I have cleared the rest of the map tiers through 15s without any issue, but I absolutely feel like paper.


GGG has alot of work to do.

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Gumble69#4089 wrote:

GGG has alot of work to do.

Did you see the interview w/ the 2 reps from GGG..?

TLDR: don't get your hopes up. (this is being the most optimistic honestly...lol)

The idea that Melee can't use WASD to move while attacking the is worst most insane decision the devs made.

If anything it should be reversed, most ranged attacks should be either immobile while attacking or very slow to move while attacking. Only very low accuracy ranged attacks should be usable while moving quickly so you need to stack accuracy and dex to be able to use them effectively.

Melee skills should ALL be usable while moving and almost at full speed.

Everything is backwards.

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Gumble69#4089 wrote:

Instead, the abilities are stuck behind long cast times that you have to "set up" where none of the other classes have to do that.

As it stands, Monk is like a Warrior that has no cast time, double the health, able to have 80% block, no cast times and way faster attacks and dashs, and a stun mechanic that not only allows them to destroy bosses without being touched but also chain clear screens of mobs.


GGG has alot of work to do.

A lot of work in what direction? The Q&A interview did say reaching godlike zoomy speeds is legit but added the caveat that they need to smooth the transition of campaign -> maps. That you'd hit godlike a little later than what happened in EA.

My interpretation of that is nerfing the other playstyles to require some set up before getting the screen clear. Little point speculating which way the devs will take it, but we can think: how does the community feel about having to set up the battlefield when say, they're farming for gear around T8 maps?

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maltretacja#6160 wrote:

I think the life regen is good enough if I can get that much passive healing.

how do u get that?

That is not possible from base regen on gear and talents. That is likely only possible with a shrine active.

I'll take the wild guess that he Trades lol.

Either that or...SSF Masochist (lol :D).