Dear GGG: You brought over a MASSIVE mistake from PoE1 to PoE2 and it hurts everyone! Resistance?!

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Snorkle_uk#0761 wrote:

by awful time you mean they have to find good gear with stats they need and use it.


thats literally what the game is designed around, its a loot game, theres stats on the loot you need and the fun is looking for the gear?

its not counterstrike? its a game specifically designed around hunting for items?

Unfortunately the game is about buying them from the market.

Only people in SSF should really have opinions that matter.
The resists ARE the game which is why it wont change.

The problem GGG has is power.
They have have hard time killing players without one shots or cheap deaths.

The resists are how all of the game works.
Those 4 stats will have a hole, that will be used to one shot the player.

The damage output will be scaled for 75% resists.
In Poe1 you need to be Over the max , if that makes sense ... to avoid one shots.

Now Poe2 has gotten better.
Deaths can occur from mob positioning and skill composition which is nice.
But the resists are just one of the gotcha! ways players die...

My displeasure comes from the fact that every character is the same and aspires to the same goal ... and we are back to spreadsheet gaming.
Need max all stats ...
Floor kills me in 1 second need max ailment resists in all categories.
Mobs one shot me need max resists in all resist categories.

In PoE1 you can target and fix a resist hole, with crafting.
PoE2 is a random number generator so resists suck even more.

Being able to socket resists on gear can help but is always secondary to raw DPS
which is the most viable way to achieve max resists ... never need them ...
and once done can't replace the resists which leads to being locked into gear, you can never afford to change anything and nothing ever drops, so now you are resist shopping online...
Binary gaming. Resists = 1 or 0
etc etc.

When they add crafting to the game, resistances will be easier to manage.

Because this is EA and we don't have any way to manage resistances besides puzzling our builds together, it is more difficult.

I would expect crafting when added will solve this issue.

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Maxxgold#3459 wrote:

When they add crafting to the game, resistances will be easier to manage.

Because this is EA and we don't have any way to manage resistances besides puzzling our builds together, it is more difficult.

I would expect crafting when added will solve this issue.

Crafting isn't really a solution to the problem of "necessary stats aren't really a choice." Similarly to the way people want move speed to be implicit on boots because they feel it's necessary, I want these stats to not be necessary, so that taking them is a choice to benefit yourself in some way. Obviously, due to the random nature of maps and enemies, we will never achieve the same level of that as you can achieve in a Souls game (and some gear checks are necessary in an ARPG), but I do think we can reasonably skew more towards skill checks that allow you do make them easier with gear than where we are now.

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First off I think you'd want a mitigation multiplier to be lower than 1

It literally is? Plug in a resistance value to my placeholder example formula.

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I like that you're thinking about how to make the system better but I disagree with the diminishing returns on resistances.

I've played a lot of ARPGs, ones that have a lot more involved multiplayer mechanics, which in turn require more balancing - One thing has always been true.

Nerfing a defensive mechanic only makes it even more necessary because no matter what dead monks don't do damage. You need to be alive.

If anything it would require less balancing. It's just reversing and smoothing out the curve. Changing the formula would also not be a direct nerf or buff it would simply give more balanced scaling and gearing agency to the player.

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I think what people are most disappointed with the current resistance system is that we don't have the tools we had in Path of Exile like horticult resistance conversion or crafting bench resistance onto items and the system they replaced it with so we could fine tune those resistances, runes, cannot be replaced thus making it a final choice causing all these problems of "oh this item would be so good for my build if it were just Light Resistance instead of Cold because I just put in Cold Res into my helm"

Runes 100% need to be replaceable regardless of any resistance rework. That's a majority consensus.

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If they made Resistances Diminish it would just mean every single item on your character would need to have high tier resistance rolls for all of your suffixes because you need to get 75% the game is balanced around that. In order to change it being balanced around a lower amount you'd have to change a ton of damage values for the entire game and then you're saying not to have a max resist well then what about the people who just massive stack a single resistance and its balanced at 50% now but they have 90% so they never feel a thing from Fire.

Enemy damage would in no way need to be re-balanced though? Neither the intention nor the outcome of such a change would cause GGG to re-balance monster damage. The game would still be balanced around a 0.25 mitigation multiplier. The diminished returns would also make it extremely hard to reach lower than a 0.1 mitigation multiplier. You would need over +900 res just to break a 0.1 multiplier with my example formula.

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Again, I like that you're thinking but I disagree with the proposed solution. I suppose Armor or Armour as they call it here does have a similar property to what you're describing but if they started making singular attacks from elements ignore 90% of your resistance well we'd definitely be needing more than 1 portal and I think the HC crowd would be upset.

As I've pointed out a couple times with other people, making resistance work like armour and be dependent on the hit magnitude would be a massive mistake. Armour also needs a balance overhaul too though. I have a separate post about that linked at the bottom of the OP.

I have close to 420 hours of early access right now and the whole endgame feels like the overall enemy damage is way too much or resists need to be rebalanced.

I honestly try to play with different classes and setups as it is early access and I like to make my own builds, but at the moment the game feels like you either one shot or you die in one shot.

I just tried a citadel with my chronomancer to test my chaos build and even though my damage was fine and the fight probably would last something close to 1 minute (which is still a long time for the end game standard right now, unfortunately). But, after halving Doryani hp, I took 2 hits. One from the red laser that spawns in the middle of the map and one from his framethrower that is a quick cast.

The end result was the following:
I have 1.1k hp + 5.2k energy shield.
- I lost 1/3 of my ES from the red laser hit
- I immediately died right after because of the framethrower.

I took 6.3k damage in two hits, one of them being a fire attack, which should have been mitigated to a certain extent because I have 75% fire resist. 4k hp drained in less than a second.


My first thought after dying was "Damn, I should have killed him with my spark sorc", because I could just end the fight in less than 5 seconds.

So, I lost a citadel, which is a random and rare spawn and I lost a piece of a entrance to the Arbiter.


So yeah, at the end of the day we have to do a mental gymnastics to accomodate a new item without losing resist and having 75% resists feels more like a "hey, your character now is at 0% resist, you will not take extra damage, but you will take normal enemy damage". And if you have anything less than 75% you are just taking extra damage on top of the normal elemental damage.

The announcement that Runes will be replaceable is really good for making resistances less tedious to balance and we can all (hopefully) agree that it's a great change coming up.

The Rune change isn't going to completely alleviate all of the bad symptoms of the current resistance system unfortunately. Any balm is better than none though. Hopefully GGG won't completely dismiss resistance scaling as a real issue. The whole system can still be a lot better.

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LaGueuze#7655 wrote:

+1
Resistance system could be so much better.
Penalties come from nowhere, could be balanced without them.

Literally just halve resist sources and you get the same exact result

Did anyone realize that we get +10% free perma resist in each act making the whole penalty -40% instead of -60% which makes whole resistance stacking far easier than in PoE 1? Also no chaos resist penalty right?

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Sakanabi#6664 wrote:

Did anyone realize that we get +10% free perma resist in each act making the whole penalty -40% instead of -60% which makes whole resistance stacking far easier than in PoE 1? Also no chaos resist penalty right?

Yeah people are aware. That difference was intended since crafting bench resistances aren't a thing anymore.

Doesn't change the fact that the resistance system could be balanced a lot better as a whole. This thread isn't about how easy/hard it is to cap resistances. It's about how messy the defensive layer that is resistances scales and the unfortunate symptoms of the current system.

Yeah this is a problem but bringing the diablo 3 style resistances is just worse imo.