What Do You Think GGG's Stance is on These Bugged Items Being Made and Traded?

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ArtCrusade wrote:

it's still against the ToS

I’d argue it isn’t. Where in the Terms are you restricted from using a bugged item?

The menetal gymnastic people use to justify their exploits is amazing

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GusTheCrocodile wrote:

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ArtCrusade wrote:

it's still against the ToS

I’d argue it isn’t. Where in the Terms are you restricted from using a bugged item?

https://www.pathofexile.com/legal/terms-of-use-and-privacy-policy

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Grinding Gear Games also reserves the right, acting at its sole discretion, at any time to cancel your registration and access to your Member Account or to restrict, limit or otherwise change your existing rights of access to your Member Account, or any specific feature or benefit afforded to you in relation to your Member Account, including without limitation in respect of any Virtual Items, if it believes you have breached these Terms of Use or any other agreements you may have with Grinding Gear Games, if you have engaged in behaviour which Grinding Gear Games deems in its sole discretion is not in keeping with the intended spirit of participation in PoE or for any other reason whatsoever.

https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/

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If you uncover an exploit in Path of Exile and abuse it for your benefit, we will ban you.

I'm sure you could have found this information yourself, but you're welcome

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Aynix wrote:

The menetal gymnastic people use to justify their exploits is amazing

Honestly, at this point I just have to assume anyone who is defending that shit is in on it

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ArtCrusade wrote:

I'm sure you could have found this information yourself, but you're welcome

Not an information-gathering issue, I'm aware of this statement. But it's not in the Terms.

That section of the Terms, as it indicates by "GGG reserves the right...", is about GGG's rights, not your responsibilities as a player. It even has that bit about actions being 'in keeping with the spirit of participation in POE'. But I want to be very clear: the section does not restrict players from taking actions that are not within the spirit of participation in POE. And it does not restrict players from using bugged items.

That section is not about placing restrictions on players. It's about empowering GGG. It doesn't say "you can't use an item made with an exploit". It says "if GGG says you've done something wrong, they can change your access rights".

I would completely agree that bans issued by GGG for this behaviour are justified by the Terms (I also personally don't have a problem with that, ban away). Indeed, bans issued by GGG for literally any reason are justified by the Terms, because they, at their sole discretion, can declare any behaviour to be 'not in keeping with the spirit of participation in POE'. GGG could ban me tomorrow for walking in a circle in town; this section is there to justify that.

Using exploit-generated items is clearly against GGG's desires at the time of that statement being made. And GGG can ban you for that. That just isn't the same as those behaviours being 'against the Terms of Use'. The Terms of Use doesn't restrict this behaviour.

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GusTheCrocodile wrote:

Using exploit-generated items is clearly against GGG's desires at the time of that statement being made. And GGG can ban you for that. That just isn't the same as those behaviours being 'against the Terms of Use'. The Terms of Use doesn't restrict this behaviour.

So you are just imposing because of the choice of words? You don't like me saying ToS as a stand-in for "them is the rules" and common sense? Fine, have it your way, Gus... exhausting as this is

Everyone's always imposing because of the choice of words, that's a discussion forum.

It's not about 'don't like', but there may be more appropriate stand-ins if that's what you wanted to say, I suppose. I suspect you'd agree legal documents and "common sense" are more or less opposite ends of a spectrum.