Haven't PoE 2 devteam learned from d4 devs?

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IcyMist27 wrote:
i was trying to reply to someone who said NO ONE asked for POE2 to be like this. this is my response:


Excuse me? The entire ARPG community WANTS this. Only strict POE1 traditionalists want POE2 to be the same. The rest of us: We all want a great new ARPG experience that is better than D4 and the other games in the genre.
poe1 is better than D4 is... just saying last epoch is better than D4 hell even D3 is better than D4 in my eyes.

and my personal opinion. i "donated" quite a lot into poe1 and well as far i've seen poe2 looks neat but gameplay wise i doubt it will be that fun to play for a long period tbh. so unless they have poe1 specific support packs i doubt i will longer support the games. unless i'm wrong and i'm having a blast with poe 2 and poe 1 that is.

tbh if every boss in the campaign takes a couple minutes and will get fully healed if u die. then i doubt it is an arpg i am willing to play. i play arpg's to become strong and rape a ton of mobs at the same time. i don't want to peg myself as i go through the campaign and barely make every single encounter i see that's fucking horrible.
"Now all that's left is for you getting on your knees."
if you know thanks me:) i'm dying to find out x'D
"
satanttin wrote:
"
IcyMist27 wrote:
i was trying to reply to someone who said NO ONE asked for POE2 to be like this. this is my response:


Excuse me? The entire ARPG community WANTS this. Only strict POE1 traditionalists want POE2 to be the same. The rest of us: We all want a great new ARPG experience that is better than D4 and the other games in the genre.
poe1 is better than D4 is... just saying last epoch is better than D4 hell even D3 is better than D4 in my eyes.



Not just your eyes. It changed a little after Season 2, but untill then Diablo 3 was pulling better numbers on Twitch than Diablo 4.
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Aynix wrote:
"
satanttin wrote:
"
IcyMist27 wrote:
i was trying to reply to someone who said NO ONE asked for POE2 to be like this. this is my response:


Excuse me? The entire ARPG community WANTS this. Only strict POE1 traditionalists want POE2 to be the same. The rest of us: We all want a great new ARPG experience that is better than D4 and the other games in the genre.
poe1 is better than D4 is... just saying last epoch is better than D4 hell even D3 is better than D4 in my eyes.



Not just your eyes. It changed a little after Season 2, but untill then Diablo 3 was pulling better numbers on Twitch than Diablo 4.
can't say i'm surprised still a bit surprised it pulled more numbers in season 2 though guess cause of the QoL but still think D3 beats D4 :P
"Now all that's left is for you getting on your knees."
if you know thanks me:) i'm dying to find out x'D
"
And you think making PoE 2 more punishing, where you need to watch your steps, strategize your next move, because monsters are this much harder, is better formula that will bring more casuals?


As opposed to guaranteed failure if they don't copy a build guide? Yes, I expect so.


"Oh yeah, this strategy only works if you have these items, these skills, and play exactly this way."

And as the dev comments about not needing to do ridiculous damage because they expect everyone to have insane recovery, having the 'you die" scenario removed makes things EASIER for casuals.


It sounds like the goal is to enable different strategies to work. If elemental resistance was a "Hey, nice perk if you run into X" but not absolutely necessary the game becomes more approachable. As it is, if someone didn't invest into it (indeed, max it), they're doomed. Ditto maxing out health to survive... it's not an optional choice, it's mandatory. That's not casual friendly. And why are these things required? Because they had to make your enemies stronger and stronger to pose some danger in the 1 second they can do damage to you before they get wiped out.

"Harder" isn't just about how much damage enemies can take before dying, it's also how much punishment they dish out. Sounds like they're reducing the latter into not needing all of the one-shot scenarios, fewer foes (ie. cumulative "one-shot" volleys) and encouraging people to think and react instead of just pressing a button and letting the qualities of the build do the work (which most just copied from someone else anyway.)


Last edited by koratrice on Nov 5, 2023, 7:36:05 AM
Why would they?

They have plenty of ppl pumping money and supporting this game,streamers praising how good it is,etc. while game is messed up and imba sooooo much that even most basic and simple thing like loot filter is not made by GGG themselfs but the 3rd party.

They don't have time for fixing that since 2013 and You think You will recive nice game next year.

Last edited by tutanoo on Nov 5, 2023, 4:25:40 PM
"
tutanoo wrote:
Why would they?

They have plenty of ppl pumping money and supporting this game,streamers praising how good it is,etc. while game is messed up and imba sooooo much that even most basic and simple thing like loot filter is not made by GGG themselfs but the 3rd party.

They don't have time for fixing that since 2013 and You think You will recive nice game next year.



GGG does give you a loot filter though. It's actually pretty good also, it's just not great when you're MF and in 100% deli, juiced T16 maps. If GGG gave you the option of a built-in VERY STRICT filter - the only one I'm willing to use - then they're basically acknowledging 99% of the drops are garbage. All those div cards players created and all those uniques nobody uses would be considered invisible. They're willing to integrate third party filters though, which is very good of them.

PoE will suffer when PoE2 comes out. It won't fall off a cliff imo, though I don't see it pulling a diablo 2 once the next iteration comes out. All the big streamers will switch as their financial situation will demand it. Really big streamers don't play PoE, though there could be some who stick with PoE1. We'll see.

There are definitely balancing issues and GGG know that.
I'm struggling to come up with new goals to keep me playing this game.
"
I love everything about POE 2 except, yeah these are pretty big ones, the overall slowness and how much they seem to try to make it into some super difficult and punishing game.


You hit the nail in the head, trick is to make the game fun with some busy work but not a slugfest
"
koratrice wrote:
"
And you think making PoE 2 more punishing, where you need to watch your steps, strategize your next move, because monsters are this much harder, is better formula that will bring more casuals?


As opposed to guaranteed failure if they don't copy a build guide? Yes, I expect so.


"Oh yeah, this strategy only works if you have these items, these skills, and play exactly this way."

And as the dev comments about not needing to do ridiculous damage because they expect everyone to have insane recovery, having the 'you die" scenario removed makes things EASIER for casuals.


It sounds like the goal is to enable different strategies to work. If elemental resistance was a "Hey, nice perk if you run into X" but not absolutely necessary the game becomes more approachable. As it is, if someone didn't invest into it (indeed, max it), they're doomed. Ditto maxing out health to survive... it's not an optional choice, it's mandatory. That's not casual friendly. And why are these things required? Because they had to make your enemies stronger and stronger to pose some danger in the 1 second they can do damage to you before they get wiped out.

"Harder" isn't just about how much damage enemies can take before dying, it's also how much punishment they dish out. Sounds like they're reducing the latter into not needing all of the one-shot scenarios, fewer foes (ie. cumulative "one-shot" volleys) and encouraging people to think and react instead of just pressing a button and letting the qualities of the build do the work (which most just copied from someone else anyway.)




[Removed by Support] You might like that and think its better. but casuals will just say "fuck that" and go play easier games, like Diablo 4 (or Diablo 3). Dying over and over wont make them think what strategy can they use to beat the challenge. They will just quit the game and never think about it again.
Last edited by JamesM_GGG on Nov 5, 2023, 7:28:30 PM
Now it is time for Einhar to do EINHAR BUSINESS
Last edited by tutanoo on Nov 5, 2023, 7:50:31 PM
"
Aynix wrote:
[Removed by Support] You might like that and think its better. but casuals will just say "fuck that" and go play easier games, like Diablo 4 (or Diablo 3). Dying over and over wont make them think what strategy can they use to beat the challenge. They will just quit the game and never think about it again.


People around the world loved the dark souls series. Many casuals became die-hards. I don't think that was translate to an isometric arpg exactly, though don't write off difficulty as an impasse for the casual.

In saying that though, I have tried to get some gamers into both DS and PoE. They all had the sanity to avoid them ^^
I'm struggling to come up with new goals to keep me playing this game.
Last edited by hmcg020 on Nov 5, 2023, 8:00:43 PM

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