General Discussion - Heist is balanced for later on in the league - Forum

*Note:-* In addition to this, note that - 1) You can craft "guards remove alert level on death" on contracts. https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2940430 2) Neversinks' loot filter is not highlighting follower gear in Heist. https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2940560 Also, we just got a patch to fix some of the bugs. Still many left though. " DISCLAIMER: THIS POST IS ONLY IN RESPONSE TO THE LOOT, ALARM METER AND GRAND HEIST COMPLAINTS. I do not like one shots, crashes, bugs or body blocking either. With so much negativity in this subreddit in the past 48 hours, it's hard to gather one's thoughts properly to even attempt to write a counter piece, but here goes: HEIST IS BALANCED FOR LATER ON IN THE LEAGUE. YOU'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO GET ALL THE LOOT IMMEDIATELY. That's the tldr. Explanation: Tons of complaints are pointed towards the alarm meter rising to quickly, yet many people seem to conveniently forget that there's straight up characters (and map Mods) that reduce this alarm level substantially. I'm not that far into my heist progress (most rogues have one lvl 3, rest one), but I'm already at the point where I can reliably open EVERY SINGLE STASH (either all the small ones, or all the big ones, or combination thereof) in every heist that I bring specific characters to. Especially karst is the poster child for this. And yes, that includes killing guards to make the jobs go quicker. I ignore the mobs between each door that requires jobs, but kill the ones close to job doors immediately. But this is not even all there is. It seems that all the people complaining about the alarm meter and rewards, especially grand Heists, conveniently ignore the entirety of the equipment system. Not only does each character have 3 inventory slots, but each item has VERY POWERFUL effects. Just a singular one of them can easily stack up to 20%+ reduced alarm level generation. ON ANY CHARACTER. For grand Heists, with just three of those items stacked, that's 60% reduced alarm rate. And that's just ONE item slot, out of three. Most of you have likely not even SEEN an item for all three slots of a singular character, much less spent a singular second to craft them and set up some equipment for your rogues. This is not legion league, and it's goos that isn't. This is a progression league, where you progress as a heist boss, together with your rogues. With them getting better and you pulling off successful heist after heist, you will all become more proficient at that exact thing, heisting. Represented here by LITERAL EXPERIENCE as well as the upgrade items for your rogues, which can substantially decrease alarm, increase rewards, make you tankier in the runs or increase your damage, etc. Etc. Stop whining about every league mechanic and its balancing, before you even spend a single proper second to investigate the entirety of the mechanic. Stop ignoring the MAJORITY OF THE LEAGUE, just to push your own story of how everything is bad and unbalanced. Thank you for coming to my TED talk. -LunaWolve *Source:-* https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/iwtfd2/the_entirety_of_this_subreddit_is_completely/ Last edited by Exile009#1139 on Sep 21, 2020, 3:17:35 AM Last bumped on Feb 9, 2021, 9:28:59 AM	Posted by Exile009#1139 on Sep 21, 2020, 3:11:12 AM On Probation Quote this Post
whats the TLDR? we need to use another filter for now?	Posted by Lyutsifer665#1671 on Sep 21, 2020, 3:14:02 AM Quote this Post
" Exxxiled665 wrote: whats the TLDR? we need to use another filter for now? He's already responded to that thread and said he's going to update it soon. But that's not what this post is about, just two additional things to keep note of as well. The tl;dr of this post is right at the top of the quoted section.	Posted by Exile009#1139 on Sep 21, 2020, 3:16:38 AM On Probation Quote this Post
I've done very few red maps and my build has not reached high red tier dps confort clear zones(it works but its meh farm wise) but I feel I can do heist pretty well already... It is definitely hard for some builds probably as always but for mine it's smooth as f.	Posted by galuf#4435 on Sep 21, 2020, 3:42:44 AM Quote this Post
Yeah, as usual, people ignore/forget the progression system, and critique the league around what they are able to do from the get-go. Personally, I love myself a progression system. You level up the thieves, making them better and better and give them loot/gear. They become rather impactful after a while. Is this a "Betrayal system", where you feel like you're going on and on forever? No, far from. It's nicely leveled, with rather short, impactful intervals and a firm, graphical interface. That said, even with said progression system in mind, I think a lot of the monsters in there, are a little bit overtuned, both when it comes to damage and health. I find myself just dashing through them after raising the alarm, because I just can't be bothered to stand there for 40 minutes attacking them (yes, that was what they call an exaggeration). Maybe it's just a melee-leveling-scaling problem, and not a Heist problem. But the aesthetics? No one can disagree that this league looks good and is pure quality when it comes to lore, looks and feel (and audio+voice acting), if we ignore the idiotic stash-bugs and over-populated Rouge Town. Sometimes, just sometimes, you should really consider adapting to the world, instead of demanding that the world adapts to you. Last edited by Phrazz#3529 on Sep 21, 2020, 4:06:33 AM	Posted by Phrazz#3529 on Sep 21, 2020, 4:00:51 AM Quote this Post
The main issue with heist is that you don't have a chance for a mistake, if you are not careful enough you lose all the rewards, spent coins, members exp, your exp, quest progression, time. You got very upset watching those carefully looted items laying on the ground without any possibility to get it back. Add here crashes, one-shotting mobs, lag-spikes, infinitely spawning unbalanced mobs, and you don't really want to come here again and will prefer to keep farming maps as you could do on Standart. Also due to the reasons above, this league is very build-specific so you are forced to play defense-builds. PoE nowadays looks more and more like a fork server with tons of custom weird experimental stuff rather than original game with carefully thought out balance brough live to players. Last edited by judikator#2053 on Sep 21, 2020, 5:51:22 AM	Posted by judikator#2053 on Sep 21, 2020, 5:41:46 AM Quote this Post
" judikator wrote: The main issue with heist is that you don't have a chance for a mistake I disagree. The mistake was made by rolling your heist as blue or yellow. The mistake is that you run your heist "underleveled/geared". Running white lvl 70 heist as lvl 80 char is quite doable. At least my death rate is very low compared to earlier attempts. " if you are not careful enough you lose all the rewards I disagree. Heist and escapes are for taking risks. Do you want to trigger the alarm or just walk out with what you already looted. " without any possibility to get it back It makes it valueable if you loose it by your own fault.[/quote] " Add here crashes, one-shotting mobs, lag-spikes, infinitely I agree. Disconnects and lags can not be tolerated in such situation and GGG should address that. " spawning unbalanced mobs Currently nobody knows what will work. The options are not explored right now. Did you utilized lesser used skills like Decoy Totem, Smoke Mine and flasks like Quartz Flask or Stibnite Flask? " Also due to the reasons above, this league is very build-specific so you are forced to play defense-builds. No, but movement speed helps.	Posted by knivil#1164 on Sep 21, 2020, 6:36:05 AM Quote this Post
" knivil wrote: " judikator wrote: The main issue with heist is that you don't have a chance for a mistake I disagree. The mistake was made by rolling your heist as blue or yellow. The mistake is that you run your heist "underleveled/geared". Running white lvl 70 heist as lvl 80 char is quite doable. At least my death rate is very low compared to earlier attempts. " if you are not careful enough you lose all the rewards I disagree. Heist and escapes are for taking risks. Do you want to trigger the alarm or just walk out with what you already looted. " without any possibility to get it back It makes it valueable if you loose it by your own fault. " Add here crashes, one-shotting mobs, lag-spikes, infinitely I agree. Disconnects and lags can not be tolerated in such situation and GGG should address that. " spawning unbalanced mobs Currently nobody knows what will work. The options are not explored right now. Did you utilized lesser used skills like Decoy Totem, Smoke Mine and flasks like Quartz Flask or Stibnite Flask? " Also due to the reasons above, this league is very build-specific so you are forced to play defense-builds. No, but movement speed helps. Just adding to this; the new area control skills and other old skills such as the previously stated smoke-mine go well in escapes. The new void sphere helps a ton especially 'just before' opening a locked door with many enemies behind during escapes. Heists can be made pretty easy; it just takes 'a little' preparation before hand and, as stated, some upgrading on your part. Which is to be expected; I mean, it's an arpg game. (My build isn't optimized or built for heist, but it does a good job. It's in theme with the league though: Raider Flicker Strike. Thief who's a ninja I guess) Last edited by Reinier11#4457 on Sep 21, 2020, 7:08:30 AM	Posted by Reinier11#4457 on Sep 21, 2020, 7:07:22 AM Quote this Post
" judikator wrote: The main issue with heist is that you don't have a chance for a mistake, if you are not careful enough you lose all the rewards, spent coins, members exp, your exp, quest progression, time. You got very upset watching those carefully looted items laying on the ground without any possibility to get it back. Add here crashes, one-shotting mobs, lag-spikes, infinitely spawning unbalanced mobs, and you don't really want to come here again and will prefer to keep farming maps as you could do on Standart. Also due to the reasons above, this league is very build-specific so you are forced to play defense-builds. Well what do you expect its a "heist" you shouldnt be able to make mistakes and still reap the rewards.. -Official Forum Dweller- -I started the hoho movement- -Exploit Early - Exploit Often- -Moderators are absurd and OP- -Heist Enjoyer-	Posted by xPiranha#4678 on Sep 21, 2020, 7:19:29 AM On Probation Quote this Post
No one will be playing later on in the league.	Posted by stoat#0718 on Sep 21, 2020, 7:24:28 AM Quote this Post