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If you apply the shock, this is the problem. You don't apply shock, unless you break the threshold. And even then, you spend 4 ascendancy points on 20% or rather 24% increased damage taken on an enemy. Elemental focus does more, and doesn't eat up 4 ascendancy points.
What exactly are you doing where you have to hit something more than 500 times to kill it? If you aren't doing 1/500th of a targets health per hit you might want to consider reasons your build is shit other than being an Ascendancy choice.
You can also roll 90% elemental ailment avoidance on a map, thus nullifying half your ascendancy. Meanwhile inquisitor still gets to enjoy his 15% increased damage taken from one of his twopointers.
Also among the strongest skills are those who hit rapidly, e.g. molten strike, barrage, storm call etc. try channeling flame blasts as an elementalist against the minotaur, lacking any built-in defenses. totems don't benefit from conflux, so it's up to you, to shock the chimera.
and on top of it, in order to get 25% elemental penetration (which you could get by simply using elemental hit, swinging in the air), you actually have to spend a resource now, which you might have spent on defenses instead.
it's not even funny anymore, having to defend this trainwreck of a revamp.
augury of penitence, a two pointer, gives you 16% increased damage taken on enemies, and 8% less damage on enemies. it fully stacks with shock. throw in vinktar's, and you get 26% increased damage taken, vaal lightning trap, you get 31% increased damage taken. get a massive high-end shock, and you get 66% increased damage taken.
elementalist gives you a minimum of 20% increased damage taken, if you shock an enemy. vinktar's? doesn't stack, 20%. vaal lightning trap? doesn't stack, 20%. high-end shock? well, it doesn't stack either, but you get ailment effect, so you get a total of 60% increased damage taken, so it is STILL WORSE.
ok with conflux your fire and cold spells can shock too, great!. shocking conflux and conflux, 6 seconds of shocking out of 14 seconds. with a base duration of 2seconds, you might get a perfect uptime of 8seconds, or 57% uptime. 57% uptime on a 20% shock, because higher shocks are unrealistic for high-end bosses.
effectively you get 12% increased damage taken on enemies (60% uptime on 20% shock), for 4 ascendancy points.
inquisitor gets 16 for 2.
did i mention, that you first have to apply the shock, before you can benefit from it? no such thing for the inquisitor.
the elementalist sucks, her design is ass. she is the utter and complete noob trap, ggg said they wanted to avoid.
and congratulations, you fell for it.
Yes one rolls 90% ailment avoidance all the time...
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Posted bySykaron Feb 28, 2018, 11:40:24 AM
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Does the penetration granted by the heralds work for golems? Will flame golems get 25% penetration?
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Posted byGhoulz666on Feb 28, 2018, 12:05:12 PM
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Yes one rolls 90% ailment avoidance all the time...
No, but unless you take paragon of calamity (another mediocre node) you have two mods, that will make you reroll.
And if you have paragon of calamity, you lose the 25% penetration and herald effect. Do you begin to understand, why elementalist is a trainwreck?
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Does the penetration granted by the heralds work for golems? Will flame golems get 25% penetration?
No.
Last edited by schlachtergeselle on Feb 28, 2018, 12:36:40 PM
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Posted byschlachtergeselleon Feb 28, 2018, 12:36:22 PM
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Yes one rolls 90% ailment avoidance all the time...
No, but unless you take paragon of calamity (another mediocre node) you have two mods, that will make you reroll.
And if you have paragon of calamity, you lose the 25% penetration and herald effect. Do you begin to understand, why elementalist is a trainwreck?
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Does the penetration granted by the heralds work for golems? Will flame golems get 25% penetration?
No.
Why would I lose 25% penetration if I use Paragon?
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Posted bySykaron Feb 28, 2018, 12:57:05 PM
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Why would I lose 25% penetration if I use Paragon?
if you use paragon of calamity and beacon of ruin, you spent 6 points already. mastermind of discord is another 4 pointer.
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Posted byschlachtergeselleon Feb 28, 2018, 1:02:45 PM
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Why would I lose 25% penetration if I use Paragon?
if you use paragon of calamity and beacon of ruin, you spent 6 points already. mastermind of discord is another 4 pointer.
Beacon of Ruin is not a must have so your argument is completely nonsensical. Yes you cannot get Mastermind, Paragon and Beacon at the same time.
So what?
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Posted bySykaron Feb 28, 2018, 1:04:44 PM
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Why would I lose 25% penetration if I use Paragon?
if you use paragon of calamity and beacon of ruin, you spent 6 points already. mastermind of discord is another 4 pointer.
Beacon of Ruin is not a must have so your argument is completely nonsensical. Yes you cannot get Mastermind, Paragon and Beacon at the same time.
So what?
I didn't read trough the whole discussion you were having, but Shaper of Desolation on it's own is just bad, as the ailments doesn't do much without proper investment and a specific build (High hits, no spell echo stuff).
A normal build that has lets say 5 casts a second will get the following from a fight that last 10 seconds without any investment (You deal 2% of their health per hit).
Shock conflux -> 10% shock effect
Ignite conflux -> I don't know honestly. I don't know if Ignite will scale from lets say lightning damage when ignite conflux is up, as it's based on it's own hit. Even if it does you are looking at a max of 6% damage increase from the ignite.
Chill -> some slow (who cares about slows).
Now if you take in account that this is in just a 10 second fight (Shock value drops the longer the fight) with I would say is a lowish cast speed example, and you won't have Shock/Ignite effect up 100% of the time, you barely get anything out of this node on it's own.
And if you invest in Ignite or Shock value (investing in both is extremely inefficient), you won't need conflux to apply them anyway, and as most of your damage (if not all) is from your main element as well, Conflux has even less value.
Besides Beacon of ruin completely makes Shaper of desolation irrelevant. You can get the 20% shock value from dealing 1 lightning damage with a crit.
Honestly they should have reworked this one, as it just doesn't work anymore after Ailments got changed.
Last edited by Tortunga on Feb 28, 2018, 2:14:57 PM
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Posted byTortungaon Feb 28, 2018, 1:47:08 PM
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Beacon of Ruin is not a must have so your argument is completely nonsensical. Yes you cannot get Mastermind, Paragon and Beacon at the same time.
So what?
you were moaning about map mods, that can be rerolled. and this whole argument we have is
all about relative power. and in this regard the direct competition to elementalist is the inquisitor. and this is where she fails spectacularly.
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Posted byschlachtergeselleon Feb 28, 2018, 2:03:12 PM
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Well, this is just sad... Now that PoB is updated, I've tried my CI fire caster build on two characters of the same level with the same gear and almost identical trees (except the starting nodes): Elementalist and Ascendant (Ele+Inq). The Scion does 11% MORE damage and has 1k more ES.
So what's the reason to play Elementalist again? A class strictly for golemancers?
Last edited by Kelvynn on Feb 28, 2018, 9:11:31 PM
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Posted byKelvynnon Feb 28, 2018, 9:08:45 PM
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Beacon of Ruin is not a must have so your argument is completely nonsensical. Yes you cannot get Mastermind, Paragon and Beacon at the same time.
So what?
you were moaning about map mods, that can be rerolled. and this whole argument we have is
all about relative power. and in this regard the direct competition to elementalist is the inquisitor. and this is where she fails spectacularly.
I never moaned about re-rolling maps. In fact going by your constant insistence of "90% ailment avoidance" it seems like you are the one being moaning about it. As to inquisitor vs elementalist, I could not care less. I have leveled 3 witches through the entire game, I have no desire to level another character through the entire game atm. You can still make an elementalist build which can handle endgame so whatever. A pity that the changes were so weak compared to occultist, which I play as ED but that is life. You don't always get what you want.
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Posted bySykaron Feb 28, 2018, 10:22:36 PM
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