ALL HAIL PRESIDENT TRUMP

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Raycheetah wrote:

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Sarno wrote:

Looks like Hanoi was a failure.

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Statement from the Press Secretary Regarding the Hanoi Summit:

“President Donald J. Trump of the United States and Chairman Kim Jong Un of the State Affairs Commission of the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea had very good and constructive meetings in Hanoi, Vietnam, on February 27-28, 2019. The two leaders discussed various ways to advance denuclearization and economic driven concepts. No agreement was reached at this time, but their respective teams look forward to meeting in the future.”

Some folks don't understand the diplomatic process. You expect sixty-six years of issues to be resolved in a couple of days? The fact that Kim is sitting down for talks instead of flinging rocket-propelled poo at Japan is a big advance over the old status quo. =9[.]9=

The fact that Kim is sitting down for talks is a huge propaganda win for Kim and the traurige Gestalt Trump. At first glance, that is, and only if you don't understand the diplomatic process.

In the past, the US presidents didn't sit down with the Kim Family because no president before wanted to elevate those murderous tyrants without immediate need or the chance to yield substantial gain. Lower level talks had not been successfull enough to allow for that. Lower level talks usually precede meetings between heads of states, because, well, diplomatic process. It's simply usefull to have those people talk issues that actually know stuff. On that basis, treaties can be negotiated.

The fact that Trump met Kim without having that groundwork laid before, was a huge win for Kim. Trump utilized the meeting, too, but it was obvious that Kim had promised nothing substantial to everyone but Trump fanatics.

This is the second meeting. The second win for Kim, in that he got elevated to a peer by Trump without having to concede _anything_ as of yet. My understanding of diplomacy is that the negotiation of a treaty is a complicated and longwinding process, in which many decisions have to be made that influence the process of giving away what you have to in order to achieve what you want. The self-proclaimed master dealmaker Trump is squandering his resources. I don't know what Sarno expected from these talks, but let me just answer this question: No, I didn't expect a satisfying treaty - or even a roadmap to denuclearization from this meeting. I didn't expect anyone to defend the results of this treaty with "the diplomatic process", either.

[edit: Yes, I do know that before this second meeting, there had been talks. In fact, one podcast I heard reported that one of Trumps cabinet members was unhappy with those talks because the negotiator might have given away too much.]

In fact, I don't expect denuclearization of NK from any future treaty, for that matter. Realistically, the future will bring a normalization of diplomatic affairs between both countries with the US accepting that NK has nuclear weapons and NK changing their pattern of speech. Maybe, they'll even test their rockets by shooting them towards open sea far from any islands [edit: yepp. this might pose a problem. will take a closer look a the globe before posting next time. is it possible / legally possible to transport missiles to the open pacific and test there? or to simply aim for deserted areas in NK? Although NK is rather small even if their aim is good, there's not much room for errors.]

Still. I had heard political podcasts in which the journalists / experts expressed optimism towards this meeting. Let's hope they are right and I am wrong.

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deathflower wrote:

Full of rhetorical. When did North Korea ever fire a missile at Japan? China test their missiles all the time, except they can't be bullied to surrender them.

Oh, how about August, 2017? Not the first time, either:

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Being Rudely Awoken by a North Korean Missile

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5VmCvChcGzU

And if you think this was just an "Oopsie!" moment on the Norks' part, you're being naive. They can't reach the US, so Japan was their proxy harassment target. ='[.]'=

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Raycheetah wrote:

And if you think this was just an "Oopsie!" moment on the Norks' part, you're being naive. They can't reach the US, so Japan was their proxy harassment target. ='[.]'=

North Korea is so incompetent to have missed Japan so many times or It is intentional to fly overhead. One of the fringe benefits of being North Korea's neighbor.

North Korea supposedly has missiles that can reach U.S. mainland. Can Trump ask Kim to shoot a missile to US so we can know for sure?

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deathflower wrote:

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Raycheetah wrote:

And if you think this was just an "Oopsie!" moment on the Norks' part, you're being naive. They can't reach the US, so Japan was their proxy harassment target. ='[.]'=

North Korea is so incompetent to have missed Japan so many times or It is intentional to fly overhead. One of the fringe benefits of being North Korea's neighbor.

North Korea supposedly has missiles that can reach U.S. mainland. Can Trump ask Kim to shoot a missile to US so we can know for sure?

Are you being deliberately obtuse?

The DPRK was testing more than their missile technology. The Norks were rattling their sabres and flexing their muscles by proving that they could launch warhead-armed (either nuclear or conventional) missiles at Japan. As for their capability to reach the US mainland, while it seems unlikely at this time, EVERY threat must be treated seriously, which is why President Trump offered Kim a carrot (talks to normalize relations gradually and by way of rewarding positive behavior on the part of Kim's regime, and a stick, which was a definite warning of US military intervention. We may never know exactly what military action President Trump intended (as he wasn't the sort to telegraph his plans to the enemy), but Kim took it seriously enough to come to the table. ='[.]'=

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Raycheetah wrote:

Are you being deliberately obtuse?

The normal diplomatic process is that lower level diplomats work on negotiations and only after some progress has been prepared do the heads of state meet to ratify the results. I think Trump has an unreasonable assessment of his powers of negotiation skills and the power of the strange "love" between him and Kim Jun Un. He also thought he could perhaps have another opportunity to declare a big win. My fear was that he would give away the store to get his fake declaration of a win. Since that didn't happen I have to say that the summit was more successful than I had anticipated. Good job Mr. President in snatching a draw from the jaws of defeat.

Are all you TDS Trump supporters getting tired of all the winning yet?

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Turtledove wrote:

My fear was that he would give away the store to get his fake declaration of a win. Since that didn't happen I have to say that the summit was more successful than I had anticipated. Good job Mr. President in snatching a draw from the jaws of defeat.

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鬼殺し wrote:

Nobel Pieceofshit Prize.

LOL, you're on a roll today!