It's another misrepresentation to act as if Trump said that most Federal workers support a shutdown. Obviously a shutdown puts them temporarily out of work, so the vast majority of them — including pretty much 100% of Federal workers living paycheck to paycheck — would be against it. Instead, Trump was remarking how he was getting some support for the shutdown from Federal workers regardless — although I'll admit he said so in the kind of obviously crafted way which might mislead one to think Trump meant federal workers in general.
That said, it's proper for the press to respond to Trump saying "these federal workers support the shutdown" by saying "perhaps they do, but these federal workers do not." Especially as most obviously won't.
So, I looked for what was said, by whom. This from Time
"
When asked whether he had a message for federal workers either furloughed or working without pay, he replied that “many of those workers have said to me and communicated, ‘Stay out until you get the funding for the wall.'”
“These federal workers want the wall,” he added. “The only one that doesn’t want the wall are the Democrats.”
But Randy Erwin, national president of the National Federation of Federal Employees (NFFE), staunchly disagrees with that assertion.
“I have personally spoken to dozens of [impacted federal employees], and leaders relaying information from many more, and I have not had one single person say we should have a shutdown until they build a wall,” Erwin tells TIME.
“I do find the president’s comments in that regard a little bit ridiculous,” adds Erwin, whose organization represents more than 110,000 federal workers across the United States, in departments ranging from the Social Security Administration to the U.S. Bureau of Land Management to the U.S. Department of Defense. “I think he’s grasping at straws trying to sway public opinion on this shutdown.”
He adds that the shutdown has a dire impact on many NFFE employees living paycheck-to-paycheck.
“We represent many workers making salaries in the high 20s to low 40s. It creates a real crisis for them to even have their pay shut off for short period of time,” he says. “It absolutely ruined the holidays for hundreds of thousands of federal employees.”
Tony Reardon, president of the National Treasury Employees Union (NTEU), also said in a Christmas Eve statement about the shutdown that “the anxiety level among federal employees is extremely high and on top of that, there is real anger that they are paying the personal price for someone else’s dysfunction.”
A new Treasury Employees Union survey also showed that nearly 80% of its members are “very concerned” about paying for their basic living expenses this month, and even more are tightening their belts as they worry about delayed or lost pay, the union said.
Erwin admits that while the employees they represent might have a range of opinions about Trump’s proposed border wall, there appears to be unanimity that the government should not be shut down because of it.
“Even if you agree with the wall do you want the government shut down over the wall? I’m not hearing anybody say that,” he says.
Erwin also says Trump’s words were particularly stinging since they were issued on Christmas Day.
“It makes people feel really disrespected. How detached can you be? These are real people with real families and financial obligations,” he says. “It just shows how willing he is to be cruel to people. Give these people a break … let them have Christmas dinner with their families.”
That seems reasonable.
"
ghstbr wrote:
Oh, and for the record I have been all over the country on countless bases from every branch of the military, talked to countless brothers and sisters serving and I can tell you that easily... EASILY 7/10 soldiers support Trump and you should too if you care anything about the blessing America has given you.
It's another misrepresentation to act as if Trump said that most Federal workers support a shutdown. Obviously a shutdown puts them temporarily out of work, so the vast majority of them — including pretty much 100% of Federal workers living paycheck to paycheck — would be against it. Instead, Trump was remarking how he was getting some support for the shutdown from Federal workers regardless — although I'll admit he said so in the kind of obviously crafted way which might mislead one to think Trump meant federal workers in general.
That said, it's proper for the press to respond to Trump saying "these federal workers support the shutdown" by saying "perhaps they do, but these federal workers do not." Especially as most obviously won't.
So, I looked for what was said, by whom. This from Time
"
When asked whether he had a message for federal workers either furloughed or working without pay, [Trump] replied that “many of those workers have said to me and communicated, ‘Stay out until you get the funding for the wall.'”
“These federal workers want the wall,” he added. “The only one that doesn’t want the wall are the Democrats.”
Spoiler
But Randy Erwin, national president of the National Federation of Federal Employees (NFFE), staunchly disagrees with that assertion.
“I have personally spoken to dozens of [impacted federal employees], and leaders relaying information from many more, and I have not had one single person say we should have a shutdown until they build a wall,” Erwin tells TIME.
“I do find the president’s comments in that regard a little bit ridiculous,” adds Erwin, whose organization represents more than 110,000 federal workers across the United States, in departments ranging from the Social Security Administration to the U.S. Bureau of Land Management to the U.S. Department of Defense. “I think he’s grasping at straws trying to sway public opinion on this shutdown.”
He adds that the shutdown has a dire impact on many NFFE employees living paycheck-to-paycheck.
“We represent many workers making salaries in the high 20s to low 40s. It creates a real crisis for them to even have their pay shut off for short period of time,” he says. “It absolutely ruined the holidays for hundreds of thousands of federal employees.”
Tony Reardon, president of the National Treasury Employees Union (NTEU), also said in a Christmas Eve statement about the shutdown that “the anxiety level among federal employees is extremely high and on top of that, there is real anger that they are paying the personal price for someone else’s dysfunction.”
A new Treasury Employees Union survey also showed that nearly 80% of its members are “very concerned” about paying for their basic living expenses this month, and even more are tightening their belts as they worry about delayed or lost pay, the union said.
Erwin admits that while the employees they represent might have a range of opinions about Trump’s proposed border wall, there appears to be unanimity that the government should not be shut down because of it.
“Even if you agree with the wall do you want the government shut down over the wall? I’m not hearing anybody say that,” he says.
Erwin also says Trump’s words were particularly stinging since they were issued on Christmas Day.
“It makes people feel really disrespected. How detached can you be? These are real people with real families and financial obligations,” he says. “It just shows how willing he is to be cruel to people. Give these people a break … let them have Christmas dinner with their families.”
Well, Democrats do make the bulk of the demographic in this case, kind of like saying "these nurses are on board, only the female nurses are against it" actually implies that a minority of nurses agree.
It must be awkward being a small-government conservative and a Federal worker simultaneously. I guess the internal thought process is something like "if I was in charge my job wouldn't exist, but as long as y'all are gonna fuck around I might as well collect this paycheck." An opportunist's morality, at best. I think Trump is painting many politically apathetic people with a Democrat brush, and Republican federal workers are simply not representative of federal workers, even if a few of them send messages to the President.
When Stephen Colbert was killed by HYDRA's Project Insight in 2014, the comedy world lost a hero. Since his life model decoy isn't up to the task, please do not mistake my performance as political discussion. I'm just doing what Steve would have wanted.
Last edited by ScrotieMcB#2697 on Dec 27, 2018, 11:58:07 PM
To be totally honest, it's awkward being a small-government conservative and a Federal worker simultaneously. I guess the internal thought process is something like "if I was in charge my job wouldn't exist, but as long as y'all are gonna fuck around I might as well collect this paycheck." An opportunist's morality.
Maybe you could provide me with some insight here.
My understanding is that Fed employees make anywhere from 20% to 200% salary over what they would make for the same job in the private sector, plus benefits.
So how are they living "paycheck to paycheck"?
(It's somewhat rhetorical. I doubt you can give me an answer that would surprise me, only because at this point one shouldn't exist.)
[quote="Lovecraftuk"]I think the new meta is everyone bitching about the new league. [/quote]
Michelle Obama's book, Becoming, was the best selling book of 2018. She and her husband were ranked most admired man and most admired women in the USA for the year. Usually the most admired man in the past has been our President. Trump has been beaten out of this title by Barrack Obama both in 2017 and 2018. Trump gets beaten again by Barrack.
According to the BBC, Michelle's book says,
"
The 54-year-old also criticises US President Donald Trump, writing that she can "never forgive" him for "putting my family's safety at risk" over his championing of the "birther" theory that her husband was not born in the US and thus was not a legitimate president of the US.
Over 430 threads discussing labyrinth problems with over 1040 posters in support (thread # 1702621) Thank you all! GGG will implement a different method for ascension in PoE2. Retired!
Serious question for the Trump fans. According to the Washington Post our President has made over 7500 false and misleading statements since taking office. That is close to TEN publicly made lies or misleading statements per day! Approximately what percent of these false and misleading statements have you believed or do you believe are true?
Over 430 threads discussing labyrinth problems with over 1040 posters in support (thread # 1702621) Thank you all! GGG will implement a different method for ascension in PoE2. Retired!
Last edited by Turtledove#4014 on Dec 28, 2018, 11:00:09 AM
Serious question for the Trump fans. According to the Washington Post our President has made over 7500 false and misleading statements since taking office. That is close to TEN publicly made lies or misleading statements per day! Approximately what percent of these false and misleading statements have you believed or do you believe are true?
Didnt Dali Lama already debunk that "list of lies"? He literally went through it and demonstrated how it was nonsense.
If you missed that post, just search dali lamas posts and im sure you'll find it.
Serious question: if you did read dali lamas debunking of that nonsense "lie list", why are you still bringing it up? Hoping to catch someone new to the forums who hasnt been following the thread?
Last edited by Khoranth#3239 on Dec 28, 2018, 11:47:39 AM
Serious question for the Trump fans. According to the Washington Post our President has made over 7500 false and misleading statements since taking office. That is close to TEN publicly made lies or misleading statements per day! Approximately what percent of these false and misleading statements have you believed or do you believe are true?
Didnt Dali Lama already debunk that "list of lies"? He literally went through it and demonstrated how it was nonsense.
If you missed that post, just search dali lamas posts and im sure you'll find it.
Serious question: if you did read dali lamas debunking of that nonsense "lie list", why are you still bringing it up? Hoping to catch someone new to the forums who hasnt been following the thread?
So I'll interpret that to mean that Khoranth believes 100% of Trump's false and misleading statements. Any others?
Over 430 threads discussing labyrinth problems with over 1040 posters in support (thread # 1702621) Thank you all! GGG will implement a different method for ascension in PoE2. Retired!
Approximately what percent of these false and misleading statements have you believed or do you believe are true?
First off, a lot of items on that list are fully defensible. Certainly not all, but maybe most?
As for those that aren't, the typical Trump "lie" is of the sort I was just discussing: "The only [federal workers] that doesn’t want the wall are the Democrats." That's obviously not true in a literal sense, as you'd only need one non-Democrat federal worker who doesn't want the Wall to disprove this. However, it's more of an exaggeration in my view than a complete disconnect with reality.
When Stephen Colbert was killed by HYDRA's Project Insight in 2014, the comedy world lost a hero. Since his life model decoy isn't up to the task, please do not mistake my performance as political discussion. I'm just doing what Steve would have wanted.
Last edited by ScrotieMcB#2697 on Dec 28, 2018, 3:14:00 PM
