[Guide] Efficient currency farming

Great collection of tips. I have my own way of doing things, but I'd probably use the tab management style you're using, and I like the filter, so good job on that too..

Mostly a matter of perspective, but this is one thing I disagree with you, nothing to do with the guide though..

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carkasjak wrote:

I straight up disagree with you on the spam whispering subject. People think I'm rude for the 5c tab thing? I think spam whispering everyone in the list without giving them 10 seconds to respond is FAR more rude than changing the price of an obviously underpriced item, as long as you are honest about it.

When we sell items on a shop tab or forum post or some other tools that allows the items to be listed in poetrade/poeapp/other indexers, we're essentially open up a shop for those items, wouldn't you agree? we put items in showcase so others can see and make an offer or buy it, same as in any other shops in RL. To me, ignoring people are about as rude as you can get when you're trying to sell stuff.

Imagine you walking to a store, and wanted to buy something, and the seller completely ignores you. I'm going to bet that in this situation, you will get mad, or at least very annoyed, so does almost everyone. Spamming in this situation is not rude at all, from my perspective. Because that's what we tend to do IRL, you call the seller/clerk/teller/owner or whatever over and over until you get their attention or you leave. If people can't even be bothered to reply to people actually trying to buy the stuff they're selling, they shouldn't have sold the item in the first place.

Your "tactics" of changing the price mid-transaction is rude. I know or at least believe that most of your trades are brodeals, and I respect that. But this is just common sense. However, I don't really care that much in regard to this topic of 5c tab, I view it as your way of doing things, and I don't do what I dislike.

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sarahschneider wrote:

Imagine you walking to a store, and wanted to buy something, and the seller completely ignores you.

Except that when you're playing PoE, you're not walking into a store. You're sending an SMS in response to an ad on the internet, and you need to give the seller a few seconds to respond before messaging the next guy. Some of us actually like playing the game, which is about killing monsters. It's not a shopkeeper simulator.

We are forced to trade because even though SSF is an option, it does not allow you to create a powerful character that requires a lot of specific unique items or rares with very specific rolls in order to work. At least not with a reasonable time investment.

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sarahschneider wrote:

Your "tactics" of changing the price mid-transaction is rude.

This is something I never do. A transaction doesn't really begin until you invite someone to your party to actually make the trade. I consider that to be the point of no return.

If you get a hit on a livesearch for an item that is obviously underpriced, your reaction should be "maybe I can get lucky and snipe this, but if I don't get it, no big deal". You should not expect to get it every time. People accidentally list things for the wrong price all the time and get swarmed with whispers from fortune seekers and flippers, so they realize their mistake, and edit the price. If there was actual infrastructure in place that obligated you to sell an item at the listed price once you got a whisper about it, then that would be a whole other story.

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carkasjak wrote:

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sarahschneider wrote:

Imagine you walking to a store, and wanted to buy something, and the seller completely ignores you.

Except that when you're playing PoE, you're not walking into a store. You're sending an SMS in response to an ad on the internet, and you need to give the seller a few seconds to respond before messaging the next guy. Some of us actually like playing the game, which is about killing monsters. It's not a shopkeeper simulator.

We are forced to trade because even though SSF is an option, it does not allow you to create a powerful character that requires a lot of specific unique items or rares with very specific rolls in order to work. At least not with a reasonable time investment.

Same thing, it doesn't matter what the medium of shop a trade is in, the burden of service falls to the seller. And I'm not talking about people who responds a bit late, that's normal, I'm talking about people who deliberately ignore their own trade deals just because they have something else 'more important' that they're doing at the time.

There are plenty of RL cases that matches your example, like contacting a customer service to buy something/a service (some hosting services does this kind of 'trades'). It does not matter how busy the guy on the other side of the phone is, because this is not about him, it's about the customer. If I put something on my public tab, it is my responsibility to respond to someone trying to buy that stuff regardless of whatever I'm doing at the time. Hence why I have trades helper installed.

Can't really put the blame on circumstances either, yes this is not a shopkeeper simulator, but how would you feel if the guy on the other side of the phone says "I'm not being paid that much anyway, so I respond to customer only whenever it pleases me". That excuse won't fly.

Still, this is just my personal perspective regarding this specific issue, I'm not here to tell or criticize how you should think or feel.

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carkasjak wrote:

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sarahschneider wrote:

Your "tactics" of changing the price mid-transaction is rude.

This is something I never do. A transaction doesn't really begin until you invite someone to your party to actually make the trade. I consider that to be the point of no return.

If you get a hit on a livesearch for an item that is obviously underpriced, your reaction should be "maybe I can get lucky and snipe this, but if I don't get it, no big deal". You should not expect to get it every time. People accidentally list things for the wrong price all the time and get swarmed with whispers from fortune seekers and flippers, so they realize their mistake, and edit the price. If there was actual infrastructure in place that obligated you to sell an item at the listed price once you got a whisper about it, then that would be a whole other story.

As I said, I'm not making a big deal out of the 5c thing. With your methods, it's logically the most efficient way of doing things, and I'm not arguing that. :)

Exiles in PoE are not employed as shopkeepers or customer service employees, even if they list their items for sale. They are putting up an ad stating that they might be willing to sell an item in their spare time. Hell, you can barely even find that listing without using a third party website that isn't owned by GGG. It's not legally binding until the trade has actually been made and both parties have pressed the "accept" button. I guess this is where our disagreement lies. I don't think the current trade system obligates the seller to sell if it's inconvenient at the time. Personally I wish I could set up a market stall in my hideout that people could visit to buy my items without me having to drop everything.

That being said, I do my best to respond in a timely manner, but if I'm in the middle of a boss fight, a breach, or a timed Zana mission, it will probably take me more than 3 seconds.

Nice topic.

I have hard time to resist puting in my own 5 cents.

Some pages ago author said, that there is no "bad ratio" of currency in PoE.

I think there is, in form of some kind self-expanding black hole of bad inflation.

All this "over-roof-effective" guys farm like crazy (making low-tier currency/most of uniques progresivly cheaper), robbing not only themeselves (in perspective), but all more "normal" (so to say) players with limited game-time. And all system visualy degrading over time (im here since 2014).

Recently I played Warframe, game, indeed, far more primitive, like club to sword of PoE, even in another genre... But economy in WF far more democratic and fair for "casual peasants".

PoE reminds me nowdays some kind of slave plantation, with average wage of 0,001 exalt.

May be this is wrong vision.

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le_souriceau wrote:

Nice topic.

I have hard time to resist puting in my own 5 cents.

Some pages ago author said, that there is no "bad ratio" of currency in PoE.

I think there is, in form of some kind self-expanding black hole of bad inflation.

All this "over-roof-effective" guys farm like crazy (making low-tier currency/most of uniques progresivly cheaper), robbing not only themeselves (in perspective), but all more "normal" (so to say) players with limited game-time. And all system visualy degrading over time (im here since 2014).

Recently I played Warframe, game, indeed, far more primitive, like club to sword of PoE, even in another genre... But economy in WF far more democratic and fair for "casual peasants".

PoE reminds me nowdays some kind of slave plantation, with average wage of 0,001 exalt.

May be this is wrong vision.

I've been around since 2011, and I have not seen the development you're describing. Lower tier uniques have always been, and will always be cheap because their supply is far greater than their demand. Which uniques are considered lower tier depends on both the drop rate, and the shifting meta. I'd speculate that my personal impact on the price of these uniques is actually non-existent, since I don't even put them up for sale.

I've seen a lot of complaints about the exalt:chaos ratio this league, but I fail to see what the actual problem is. It has pros and cons for both casual players and dedicated players alike. If exalts are expensive, you get a bigger boon when an exalt drops, and if they're cheap, you can craft high end gear more cheaply, but it doesn't really affect the relative price of most items, since these will rise or fall based on (you guessed it) supply and demand.

In any case there are plenty of builds that don't even need a single exalt to get started, and some builds can even get you into endgame maps while playing purely SSF.

If you're a casual player with very limited playtime, it might be very beneficial for you to optimize that playtime to get the most out of it. You're the one in charge of whether you want to be a strong independent exile, a peasant, or even a slave working on a plantation. You can play the game in a multitude of ways, and some of them don't even include interacting with the "economy" at all. Those of use who want to optimize our efficiency aren't robbing anyone of anything. We're simply playing the game the way we want to play it.

i think efficient currency farming is even more important in ssf than regular game, due to the fact that you cant make currency by trading in ssf. So your currency farming efficiency directly influences your success in poe. Unlike in regular poe where you can survive by just solely sniping items at couple chaos price and reselling them for multiple exalts

I see a lot of folks kinna misunderstanding the 'no spamming' thing Carkas wrote as I skim through this page.

It's not "it's rude to spam the same guy a bunch of times trying to buy his item." Admittedly, clogging a guy's chat window with thirty WTB messages in the space of a minute is rude, but that's a different thing.

It's "Don't be that guy who wants an item, and then sends a WTB to thirty different players one after another in the space of fifteen seconds without giving ANY of them time to answer, and then just taking the first invite you get."

The latter case is being douchy to the sellers - you express interest in their item, and let's say ten of the thirty guys you send a message to disengage from their map and go to their hideout to complete the sale you told them you wanted to make. Except that nine of those guys get "already got one" instead of 5c, despite having responded in what any reasonable player would've considered to be an appropriately timely manner.

You've wasted the seller's time, potentially burned one of their portals for nothing if they're a more hoard-y style of player who needs them, and thrown them off their groove. That's a jerkish thing to do.

If you send a WTB message to someone, give that someone ten or fifteen seconds to say something. if they don't, then move on. People who're interested in selling stuff will respond, even if the response is "wait one? Mapping/Lab/Shaper/whatever" ...okay, maybe not Shaper, because I'm not responding to a whisper mid-endgame boss fight, but those instances will be very rare. For the most part, all Carkas is asking for is for players to give a seller a good-faith period of time in which to get through with whatever specific thing they're doing right then, right-click your name, and get an answer to you.

Don't chain-spam everyone on the results list of a poe.trade search and give nobody time to actually respond to your offer. That's not cool. Don't change the price on an item once the guy is standing in your hideout with his payment ready. Also not cool. I would argue that displaying an item for incorrect prices that aren't obvious ("Whoops, sorry! I clicked the wrong thing listing my Skyforth, I was looking for 40ex not 40c. Thanks for pointing that out!") is also somewhat not cool, but the previous two are worse offenses.

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1453R wrote:

I see a lot of folks kinna misunderstanding the 'no spamming' thing Carkas wrote as I skim through this page.

It's not "it's rude to spam the same guy a bunch of times trying to buy his item." Admittedly, clogging a guy's chat window with thirty WTB messages in the space of a minute is rude, but that's a different thing.

It's "Don't be that guy who wants an item, and then sends a WTB to thirty different players one after another in the space of fifteen seconds without giving ANY of them time to answer, and then just taking the first invite you get."

The latter case is being douchy to the sellers - you express interest in their item, and let's say ten of the thirty guys you send a message to disengage from their map and go to their hideout to complete the sale you told them you wanted to make. Except that nine of those guys get "already got one" instead of 5c, despite having responded in what any reasonable player would've considered to be an appropriately timely manner.

You've wasted the seller's time, potentially burned one of their portals for nothing if they're a more hoard-y style of player who needs them, and thrown them off their groove. That's a jerkish thing to do.

If you send a WTB message to someone, give that someone ten or fifteen seconds to say something. if they don't, then move on. People who're interested in selling stuff will respond, even if the response is "wait one? Mapping/Lab/Shaper/whatever" ...okay, maybe not Shaper, because I'm not responding to a whisper mid-endgame boss fight, but those instances will be very rare. For the most part, all Carkas is asking for is for players to give a seller a good-faith period of time in which to get through with whatever specific thing they're doing right then, right-click your name, and get an answer to you.

Don't chain-spam everyone on the results list of a poe.trade search and give nobody time to actually respond to your offer. That's not cool. Don't change the price on an item once the guy is standing in your hideout with his payment ready. Also not cool. I would argue that displaying an item for incorrect prices that aren't obvious ("Whoops, sorry! I clicked the wrong thing listing my Skyforth, I was looking for 40ex not 40c. Thanks for pointing that out!") is also somewhat not cool, but the previous two are worse offenses.

I'm personally not one to disagree with how the OP does things. Infact, I think he's quite reasonable if not a 'good' trader to begin with. I don't even have a problem with his 5c methods, if I see something that's worth a lot more than 5c and listed for that price in poetrade, I'd expect the seller to mispriced the item in the beginning, if I'm lucky then I'll get something for cheaps, if not, then it's nbd.

As for the no-reply thingy for trades, this might be something that I differ slightly from the OP. But it's a matter of principle for me and completely subjective. I don't have any issue if someone is busy and need to take 10 or 15 or even more to reply, that's fine. But I absolutely hated it, when

1. People list cheap items (those that goes for 1c, 1alc, etc.) and when people try to buy them, they ignore it because they're doing something else and 1c is not worth replying. This is something that I have a problem with. If you can't be bothered to reply to offers for your own trades, why did you list the item in the first place? to piss off others when you're busy? or just to fill up the poetrade pages for no reason? (not directed towards you btw, just talking in general)

2. People who sold out and cba to reply that the item was sold. This is mostly just a minor annoyance. But ffs, ctrl+enter+sold, it'll take you 5secs tops or install tradeshelper.

I do agree that the 'rude' part comes when people spam nonsense for multiple lines in seconds just to get the seller's attention. I don't mind waiting for a reply when I buy stuff for a few seconds. But honestly though, as a buyer, I really don't care if you're fighting a Guardian, Atziri, Shaper, heck I don't even care if you're fighting Chris for his sandwich, why should I? ignoring a buyer is a non-reply no matter what you're doing at the time. And like I mentioned in my previous reply, that excuse will never fly in RL, because it's common sense. It works the same way here because frankly, imho, common sense is common sense. That's where we differ in opinion, and it's fine. So I get that part, what I don't get is this one..

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1453R wrote:

People who're interested in selling stuff will respond

No offense, but to me, this statement made no sense. If you put something in a public stash tab, and put a price tag on that item. By all definition you are interested in selling that stuff, if not, why would you list them in pub tab in the first place? to troll others?

Spam I can live with. When you see a whole page of people in poetrade ignoring you becoming a common practice like this, I can understand why some people spam (even towards me) as long as it's reasonable, so I personally don't mind when they chain whisper from the list of results in poetrade. That's, for me, is not rude. It's a social response to the way things are.

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sarahschneider wrote:

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I do agree that the 'rude' part comes when people spam nonsense for multiple lines in seconds just to get the seller's attention. I don't mind waiting for a reply when I buy stuff for a few seconds. But honestly though, as a buyer, I really don't care if you're fighting a Guardian, Atziri, Shaper, heck I don't even care if you're fighting Chris for his sandwich, why should I? ignoring a buyer is a non-reply no matter what you're doing at the time. And like I mentioned in my previous reply, that excuse will never fly in RL, because it's common sense. It works the same way here because frankly, imho, common sense is common sense. That's where we differ in opinion, and it's fine.

If I'm fighting a Guardian, or the Shaper, or something else, I'm not about to take time away from that fight, take my hands off the controls, leave my character sitting there under fire, and say "Sorry, fighting Shaper, call back in five" :P It's a regrettable situation, but still. Unless you're buying something from me priced in exalts, not chaos, I'm not sucking that death for you. And even then, if you're working on making a major purchase like that, I feel like you can wait a few extra moments if you happened to call at a bad time. I'll respond as I can, I try to make a point of doing so whenever someone pings me, but there are limits :P

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sarahschneider wrote:

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1453R wrote:

People who're interested in selling stuff will respond

No offense, but to me, this statement made no sense. If you put something in a public stash tab, and put a price tag on that item. By all definition you are interested in selling that stuff, if not, why would you list them in pub tab in the first place? to troll others?

Spam I can live with. When you see a whole page of people in poetrade ignoring you becoming a common practice like this, I can understand why some people spam (even towards me) as long as it's reasonable, so I personally don't mind when they chain whisper from the list of results in poetrade. That's, for me, is not rude. It's a social response to the way things are.

Whole pages of people in poe.trade ignoring you sucks. That's no reason to be a dick back to the ones who don't ignore you by offering to buy ten different people's [X], but only actually buying one guy's [X]. If you ping me and I get back to you in ~30s, I expect to be making a sale unless something weird happens. If you "sorry, found another one" at me inside that timeframe, then hey, good for you - but you as Generic Buyer Guy will be getting a rather tart reply from me on the subject and an exercise in living with the knowledge that you're kind of a dick.

I've chosen not to sell anything for less than 2c this league, in part because of this very thread and in part because of some rotten experiences in trying to work with the pocketchange market. The pocketchange market needs to class up a little bit, or the people serving it will stop doing so because it's just not worth the hassle.