Played my first armor-only character, and I'm disgusted by it.

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Shppy wrote:

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Zrevnur wrote:

Just tested vs Merciless Dried Lake TS archer in EHC. I cannot verify the claim. My results indicate that armour does work vs such attacks.

Interesting, after seeing this I just recreated my tests on my other eponymous berserker and indeed now it appears that armor is working against said hits. I'd like to test on the character I originally noticed the issue with (which should be no different defensively, aside from having even more armor), but in my disappointment I warped his passive tree in testing alternative setups before ultimately deciding to delete (and shortly reroll) him.


Still, tossed all his gear short of rings and amulets on my other berserker, used as many Grand Spectrums as I could (used Grace instead of Determination, cuz this guy's IR and doesn't have a Determination on him), and he's got the same ascendancies picked aside from having the stun immunity notable instead of the leech one, and found those Voll's archers to be dealing about as much damage as they *should*, much less than what my Abyssal_Shppy build experienced.


I'm not sure what to think now. Did something bug on a global scale for my character? Was there indeed an issue that's been silently resolved in last half a day since I posted a few threads about this issue?


*edit*: tested against mad gladiators too, the other enemy I specifically tested against last night/this morning, now working as expected. Well, whatever. In any case there doesn't seem to be an issue anymore, so I'm happy. Maybe I'll try out that level of armor again when I reroll the character, although I'm probably still gonna go a new direction after the bad taste it gave me the first time around.

It probably has something to do with the game messing up armor value calculations at random times, which would explain why at times Avian Retches tickle, and other times they absolutely murder you.

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allbusiness wrote:

It probably has something to do with the game messing up armor value calculations at random times, which would explain why at times Avian Retches tickle, and other times they absolutely murder you.

Could be, but it seemed far from 'random times'... i mean, i sat around in dried lake and grand arena for around an hour testing this stuff out with varying levels of armor, and the issue was consistent... they *never* hit me as though i had armor. And for several hours leading up to the actual testing I consistently noticed ranged attackers dealing substantially more damage than melees (which prompted me to get fed up and start testing).


And yeah, Avian Retches were one of the enemies I noticed seemed to ignore armor too, I came across a few of them in my test runs that didn't seem to care if i was naked or not.

i think that the only way to solve this case is to PM Mark_GGG and let him try it out at office


there were cases when i though my character (not all of them but single one) felt like getting WAY higher damage input but i wasnt able to reproduce it reliably enough to bother anyone.

Based on my subjective game play experience I do not believe there was a general problem of the sort "ranged mobs ignore armour". My game play impression prior to seeing this thread was (and still is) that armour helps a lot vs normal mobs including all the ranged mobs in dried lake. For example I remember testing recently if I could survive a disconnect in Dried Lake. Without armour that would have been certain death.

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Shppy wrote:

And yeah, Avian Retches were one of the enemies I noticed seemed to ignore armor too, I came across a few of them in my test runs that didn't seem to care if i was naked or not.

My experience with these is quite different. Barring special mobs (magic packs, aura rares) they just "tickle" with enough mitigation. OTOH they deal huge amounts of damage to unprotected chars. No proof that there was no "stealth fix" but it does not coinicde with my subjective experience.

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sidtherat wrote:

i think that the only way to solve this case is to PM Mark_GGG and let him try it out at office


there were cases when i though my character (not all of them but single one) felt like getting WAY higher damage input but i wasnt able to reproduce it reliably enough to bother anyone.

Yeah, seems like it. I kinda wish I hadn't deleted the character now, and I wish I would have tested out with my eponymous berserker last night when I knew it was still happening to my Abyssal berserker... it never occurred to me that it could be some kinda bug solely happening to one character (because again, my eponymous berserker can be made extremely comparable to the Abyssal guy I tested on). Not that that was necessarily necessarily the case, I have no idea without any word from GGG.

Idk. I'm planning to rerun the build, and ultimately my tree will actually be fairly similar to the tree I was using (I warped it around a bunch in testing how I'd rebuild the character without 40k armor, but I've settled back on using roughly the same tree but using Cospri's with some enhanced blasphemy curses... should get me decent armor and evasion, and both of which will get even more potent due to enfeeble's effects. And with temp chains for further defense and some extra poison duration). Anyway, with a similar tree, I could toss on my former gear setup on for a bit and see how things go for round 2 vs those ranged enemies, see if there's something funky going on.

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Zrevnur wrote:

Based on my subjective game play experience I do not believe there was a general problem of the sort "ranged mobs ignore armour". My game play impression prior to seeing this thread was (and still is) that armour helps a lot vs normal mobs including all the ranged mobs in dried lake. For example I remember testing recently if I could survive a disconnect in Dried Lake. Without armour that would have been certain death.

I mean, in the past I've done reasonable armor builds and not noticed quite so severe of damage from these mobs (except the beyond Tshot guys, those seem to hit like a truck regardless), but like I said at the start, most of those builds also involved evasion or block or endurance charges (all of which would properly mitigate regardless of whether or not armor was present), so I connected those extra layers with the reason I never noticed something this bad in the past, but maybe that was a false correlation. Maybe something had come up recently that bugged things out in general, or maybe something on my character bugged, or... idk. Whatever the case, it seems to be fine now. Good enough I guess, though it'd be nice to know what actually was going on.

I pray for GGG. I pray they did not stealth fix a bug then bury your thread into feedback.

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SuicideAll wrote:

I pray for GGG. I pray they did not stealth fix a bug then bury your thread into feedback.

Tbh, I really don't care... I mean, it's kinda unethical if that's what went down, but it seems to be dealt with now so I personally am content.

Still, it put me off of wanting to use armor, and I wouldn't doubt if it's tainted the views of others that may have been affected by it without realizing what was happening, so it'd be nice if they'd acknowledge the issue so that people don't move forward with the belief that armor is garbage due to a bug or oversight.

So I'm pretty sure this thread has now turned into a Bug Report thread, but I gotta say now that it's been bumped to the top of the forum, I don't feel bad about posting my slightly off-topic post.

When I saw the thread title, I agreed with it. I Played my first armor-only character, and I'm disgusted by it. Disgusted by how incredibly strong it was. I didn't even have to get the double-armour Jugg passive and I was already facetanking infamous one-shots with more than half health remaining (28k Armour 8 EC SoS no problem vs Izaro full charges but no other buff, 31k Armour 8 EC Chaos Golem SoS no problem vs Izaro all Conduits no other buff). Voll slams are, of course, easily facetankable. With all the negative hype on the forum about Armour vs large Hits, I was expecting to need boosted Fortify, at least 7k Life (I had about 6k each time), 10 ECs, 100k Armour, and still get nearly one-shot by the likes of buffed Uber Izaro. Nah, just grab a few Armour passives, toss on Determination, and you're good to go. I didn't think it was possible for an Abyssus character to be massively more tanky against Physical Hits than ALL of my non-Abyssus characters.

Armour is damn strong right now, but please spread rumours about its weakness, that will make sure GGG never hits it with the nerf hammer :> (Not directing this at Shppy since this seems to have turned to a Bug Report thread, but just joking around in general :P)

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adghar wrote:

Armour is damn strong right now, but please spread rumours about its weakness, that will make sure GGG never hits it with the nerf hammer :> (Not directing this at Shppy since this seems to have turned to a Bug Report thread, but just joking around in general :P)

Oh no, like I said, that amount of armor felt good... when it was working. I mean, I made a sizable investment in it, so I should hope it felt good, but the issue was just that it very clearly was not working against some enemies.


I mean, when a T8 beyond Tshot magic mob with no damaging map affixes wipes out 70% of my 4k health with one shot vs 40k armor without crit damage (cuz Brass Dome)... it's kinda a red flag (that's how I took my first death on the character). Pretty sure he wasn't just dealing the 10000 pre-mitigation damage per attack that it woulda taken if my armor actually doing its job, so... yeah. Something was up.


But yeah, when it works? Armor is in pretty good shape right now.


(also, the build in question was pure armor, no ECs. I've done decent armor+ECs before, my eponymous character's got that going on. While at times it felt like i was taking too much damage, perhaps due to this same issue, ECs do a lot of the work, so I wasn't sure how pure armor would fare instead. Turns out aside from this bug, it was pretty pleasant.)

Damn...I was about to go IR because I am tired of evasion being so random. Now i got nothing.