[Not a Bug] Cospri's Malice Failing to Leech

the reef boss seems to be very good to test.

i believe it's also a boss which cause the leech problem
!!! Sorry for my "bum english" !!!
"
stexnex wrote:
on Plaza Boss leech works fine - i've done it with leech gem in sword and assassins mark and without adds near me. also i can stand in the green circle and leech trough.

Argus in uber lab is no problem too BUT it feels sometime inconsistent.


I did Plaza boss once before no issues inside the green circle, my character is only stronger now and today I there was no way I could leech enough to stand inside it so idk
up
I've tested this extensively, using characters made specifically to check exact damage/leech values and using multiple characters from accounts posting in this thread to see if there is some odd combo that may cause a problem. So far, everything I have checked is working as expected. It may appear that you should be leeching more than you are, but if you consider as much relevant info as you can the numbers being shown and the expected outcome are very close.

First of all, tooltip damage in this situation is not a good indicator of how much damage you are dealing on average and cannot be used to calculate how much leech you should be getting. There are multiple factors that need to be considered, the main two being that most unique/map boss monsters have higher resists than other monsters, and when you are triggering discharge you are almost never triggering it with your max amount of charges. Looking at most characters in this thread the general setup is Voll's Protector + Voll's Devotion with the Assassin node to generate power charges on non-crit (which is almost not worth mentioning since the chance to crit is so high). This is not enough to sustain a max charge discharge on every trigger, especially against a single target. Looking at this post in particular:

"
Aim_Deep wrote:

Mark thanks for checking this issue. However the minimal leech you cite in the videos you guys watched is from the cold portion of the weapon damage. It's infinitesimal when 90%+ of the damage is from CoC spells which are not leeching in many cases.

Take this video with warlords mark running
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AglAdnDElc&feature=youtu.be

It's leeching in the 10s when it should be leeching in the 1000's with 95K full charge discharge damage. If you watch in slow mo I'm about 1/2 charges so 50K Damage x 2% should be near 1000 leeched back. It's no where near 1000 but 10s.

Please check again.


This is for a best case scenario, but using this character against a single unique monster with 0% ele res the average damage per hit is closer to 30k (with ~100 discharge hits). Against a boss with a moderate 30% all res, this brings it down to 21k.

You then need to factor in the curse effectiveness reduction on unique monsters. In most cases it is a 60% reduction (with some specific monsters having a higher value), which immediately reduces the life leech provided by Warlords Mark to 0.8%. Using that value with the 21k from earlier, you get a leech amount of 168 per discharge on average, if the monster had 30% ele res. This more closely matches what is shown in the video. In this situation the leech from the weapon can be effectively ignored, as it ends up being around 4es per hit.

I've watched every gif/video posted in here and checked each character of the players posting most frequently in this thread, and none of them show any obvious brokenness.

If you wish to show any additional videos, please make them longer and show the entire fight. Only showing short snippets like this isn't really useful as it doesn't accurately represent the overall situation.
Last edited by Jason_GGG#0000 on Sep 14, 2016, 8:39:10 PM
"
Jason_GGG wrote:
This is not the case for this video however, as you are applying elemental equilibrium to Atziri which is giving her an additional 25% cold and fire resists (due to your discharges always using endurance and power charges on trigger). This brings her resists to 55%, and takes the 30k down to 13.5k, which in turn takes the amount leeched down to 108. This more closely matches what is shown in the video. In this situation the leech from the weapon can be effectively ignored, as it ends up being around 4es per hit.


What? This is totally wrong. First of all power charges do lightning damage, so a discharge would give lightning and fire res, not cold and fire.

Secondly, you forget that in order for the next discharge to happen, a hit has to happen as well. With Cospri's doing cold damage, a discharge will happen with Atziri being weak to lightning and fire and resistant to cold.

Due to the nature of the build and the sequence of events, a discharge should NEVER increase the resistances for the next discharge. That's impossible and it would mean that something is indeed wrong. At least as long as someone has no fire or lightning damage on their rings, which I'm sure Aims_Deep has made sure of.
"
Apos91 wrote:
"
Jason_GGG wrote:
This is not the case for this video however, as you are applying elemental equilibrium to Atziri which is giving her an additional 25% cold and fire resists (due to your discharges always using endurance and power charges on trigger). This brings her resists to 55%, and takes the 30k down to 13.5k, which in turn takes the amount leeched down to 108. This more closely matches what is shown in the video. In this situation the leech from the weapon can be effectively ignored, as it ends up being around 4es per hit.


What? This is totally wrong. First of all power charges do lightning damage, so a discharge would give lightning and fire res, not cold and fire.

Secondly, you forget that in order for the next discharge to happen, a hit has to happen as well. With Cospri's doing cold damage, a discharge will happen with Atziri being weak to lightning and fire and resistant to cold.

Due to the nature of the build and the sequence of events, a discharge should NEVER increase the resistances for the next discharge. That's impossible and it would mean that something is indeed wrong. At least as long as someone has no fire or lightning damage on their rings, which I'm sure Aims_Deep has made sure of.


You are correct! I've updated the post to remove that section.
Last edited by Jason_GGG#0000 on Sep 14, 2016, 8:44:43 PM
@Jason_GGG

Most of us are using Life leech gem, so 2%. curse effectiveness shouldn't effect this.

I'll try recording some stuff tonight, I still believe I should be leeching more than what we currently are.
Well.. i don't have this issue with other weapons and characters, just this build.. which is in fact for sure without hesitation.. a real issue and definitely with cospri's itself. i have tested all cold spell setups dual wield and shield.. multispells with and without discharge.. and it just sometimes and quite frankly and obviously..FAILS TO LEECH. It's totally random. Kill one boss with leech fine.. the next time same boss i cant leech in the middle of a battle while he's being blasted with 3 spells and discharged.. I have vaal pact with Berserker ascendancy.. It is brilliant when it works.. instafull! and therefore.. it's painfully obvious when it doesn't. Please fix and warm regards to all.

Another point. with the ascendancy i also have 100 percent leech from damage if i take a savage hit. Food for thought mathematicians. While im dying from not leeching a boss.. hit hits me hard for around 4k.. a "savage hit". now.. the very next hit i deal via spells or attacks or whatever is.. 100 percent leech... right? wrong cause get what.. IT'S NOT LEECHING like it should.
Last edited by Tomorrowtech#4871 on Sep 15, 2016, 12:25:07 AM
"
Jason_GGG wrote:
I've tested this extensively, using characters made specifically to check exact damage/leech values and using multiple characters from accounts posting in this thread to see if there is some odd combo that may cause a problem. So far, everything I have checked is working as expected. It may appear that you should be leeching more than you are, but if you consider as much relevant info as you can the numbers being shown and the expected outcome are very close.

First of all, tooltip damage in this situation is not a good indicator of how much damage you are dealing on average and cannot be used to calculate how much leech you should be getting. There are multiple factors that need to be considered, the main two being that most unique/map boss monsters have higher resists than other monsters, and when you are triggering discharge you are almost never triggering it with your max amount of charges. Looking at most characters in this thread the general setup is Voll's Protector + Voll's Devotion with the Assassin node to generate power charges on non-crit (which is almost not worth mentioning since the chance to crit is so high). This is not enough to sustain a max charge discharge on every trigger, especially against a single target. Looking at this post in particular:

"
Aim_Deep wrote:

Mark thanks for checking this issue. However the minimal leech you cite in the videos you guys watched is from the cold portion of the weapon damage. It's infinitesimal when 90%+ of the damage is from CoC spells which are not leeching in many cases.

Take this video with warlords mark running
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AglAdnDElc&feature=youtu.be

It's leeching in the 10s when it should be leeching in the 1000's with 95K full charge discharge damage. If you watch in slow mo I'm about 1/2 charges so 50K Damage x 2% should be near 1000 leeched back. It's no where near 1000 but 10s.

Please check again.


This is for a best case scenario, but using this character against a single unique monster with 0% ele res the average damage per hit is closer to 30k (with ~100 discharge hits). Against a boss with a moderate 30% all res, this brings it down to 21k.

You then need to factor in the curse effectiveness reduction on unique monsters. In most cases it is a 60% reduction (with some specific monsters having a higher value), which immediately reduces the life leech provided by Warlords Mark to 0.8%. Using that value with the 21k from earlier, you get a leech amount of 168 per discharge on average, if the monster had 30% ele res. This more closely matches what is shown in the video. In this situation the leech from the weapon can be effectively ignored, as it ends up being around 4es per hit.

I've watched every gif/video posted in here and checked each character of the players posting most frequently in this thread, and none of them show any obvious brokenness.

If you wish to show any additional videos, please make them longer and show the entire fight. Only showing short snippets like this isn't really useful as it doesn't accurately represent the overall situation.




okay - in this video it looks like thats true what you said about the charges:

https://youtu.be/yTJmcVZlE8I

between 0:34 and 0:38 i got less charges and less leech.


between 0:48 and 0:50 i got almost max charges an got huge leech.

but this fact brings me to my next question. why i the charges generation to much inconsisten compared to the old CoC discharge with a vagan dagger. is it the the 8% less chance to hit ?
!!! Sorry for my "bum english" !!!
@Jason_GGG thanks for input, however I don't know how come are you guys still refering to warlord's mark curse, for god sake. We're using LL gem, curse debuff has nothing to do, even though this shouldn't be a problem as well because of EE. Have you seen videos with LL gem? Is your statement also that there's nothing wrong with that? How are we supposed to fight against bosses, then? Show me the light, I'm eager to know. Can you reply to all cases people have reported here, not just one thing that didn't even consider EE, beside the fact that any other spell gem also has this issue, so argument of not having enough number of charges is also meh. And for god sake do a comparison and play any other non CoC (melee, selfcast - BV) build with LL gem and show me the same results, I dare you, show me the exact same results as we experiencing here, that LL mechanism should be more or less transparent, regardless of build/items.
Last edited by ojejku#1220 on Sep 15, 2016, 2:37:50 AM

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