I know more people that left because PoE is easy.

"

iamstryker wrote:

I understand your point about no more wipes but fixing a legacy is really no where near as extreme as a wipe. You still have the item and that item will still have a lot of value. The nerfed version of Kaom's heart has roughly the same value as the old version did before the legacy talk started and that goes for all legacies if you look at their new version compared to their old counterpart. Someone's always hurt after a change is made but if GGG refuses to fix their mistakes then everyone loses.

Their hurt would be a lot more tangible than yours. I guarantee you that anyone who lost such an item would absolutely feel that the action was almost as extreme as a wipe; it's kind of astonishing you don't recognize this.

"

The_x_ile wrote:

1. Legacy items: why people care so much if others have uniqs and what they have?
if its too easy when using them, dont use it, or leave league to harder one.

2. Simplified Skill Tree: this is the most ridiculous thing, ever, there ISNT any other game the have anything close to this game tree.... and when people find "best roads" to specific builds (do u even have idea how many different builds there are in this game?) its reasonable, cause people put alot of thoughts to find those out...

3. Map drops: before people complained that map drops were too low.. now this.. lol

4. Boss loot buffs: there is rarity penalty..

5. Eternal Orbs: what is wrong with perfect items after ALOT of investment?, also what do u care what other pepole have? (see no.1 answer)

6. Trade indexers:people can flip even without indexers... they just stay online.. buy cheap.. sell high.... that is ECONOMY .. deal with it or , DONT TRADE.

7. Base item craft buff: not sure what u said here.... lower lvl items are good? or bad... your point isnt clear..

8. 6 link buffs: even with 6l, nothing is "too easy", have u ever played end game? atziri? ubber atziri? piece of cake? plz...


9. Upcoming unique "buff": the "ultra rare" uniq drop rate will also increase.. so your point is invalid. or u want to reduce the not ultra rare uniqs? not sure...

plz reply to these

1. Most of us have/had legacy items. If it is available, people will use it. You shouldn't have to make your own challenges. The game should challenge you then you find the best way to overcome the challenge.
2. The tree was FAR more complex back in .95(?) days, it didn't hold your hand, or tell you a duelist shouldn't be a caster. It still is a great concept, but it was much better and full of choices before.
3. Yep they drop far too often, even some streamers say it's far easier to manage pools than before. People complaining about not being able to sustain 78 maps (because apparently that's what should happen?!), is why I brought this up. If you were supposed to chain this "bonus endgame content" why is it based on RNG and not guaranteed?
4. There is no penalty, you can smash Dominus at 80 and 99, he drops the same.
5. I don't care that other people use them, this was one that I agreed with, however the players playing in standard cared because now if you needed a dagger or chest, you can just save for a perfect copy due to eternal orbs speeding up the perfect item acquisition dramatically. I liked them for temp leagues to lock 5L's to shoot for 6L. This combined with the upcoming 6l progression change bugs me.
6. Indexers trivialize game content, you can buy progression for cheap quickly, before you had to put some form of effort into trading, and it was much easier to "barter" because prices weren't listed all together so you can under cut the next guy selling or buy the cheapest item. Trade had the consequence of possibly paying more/receiving less, now all of the digging and haggling is done for you. (A lot easier..)
7. Base items were brought closer together, at least weapons were. Essentially a nicely rolled rare would outperform a weapon far higher. Before, a white level 50 mace would outperform a rare level 30, giving a sense of progression instead of looking at your low level weapon asking where progression is. You were rolling on the go because the next base weapon a few levels higher would typically be better. Players find nice mid level gear and don't understand why they can't find better.
8. The game is easy, that's what the thread was about, a 6l dominates content that's already simplified. Yet people complain about how hard it is.. Domination I rolled 2 6l, Ambush I have had 6, 4 were corrupted. Guild mate is borrowing my 6l daresso.
9. The gap between rare and ultra rare will be even higher, the realistic nice finds in the rare tier will lose value, say 4ex for standard rare and 30ex ultra rare. Rare will drop 2-3ex while the already limited ultra stay around 30. My issue is there already aren't enough items between ultra and rare in the 5-15ex range to find and now the ones that were closest are going to go even lower.

"

ScrotieMcB wrote:

Their hurt would be a lot more tangible than yours. I guarantee you that anyone who lost such an item would absolutely feel that the action was almost as extreme as a wipe; it's kind of astonishing you don't recognize this.

That's a joke. You think I haven't lost many exalts due to GGG making changes to the game? Was that not tangible?

I find it strange that people have so much sympathy for the people who might get a nerfed unique but no apparent sympathy for the multitude of players that can no longer find uniques that turn legacy. Standard literally is a rat race for players to get their OP legacies nowadays.

Edit: Upon second thought your accusation is even more absurd considering I am actually inviting GGG to nerf MY UNIQUES. Right now I invite GGG to balance their game, even though it would hurt MY builds.

Instead of addressing individual points I'll try to cover the overall sentiment.

I agree you can fully trivialize the game by utilizing many provided tools, but that only goes if you want to. If you don't, it can be pretty challenging, you just need to follow this:
- don't trade unless you need some specific item to try something interesting
- don't group
- don't do MF farming
- avoid broken skill/passive combos
- avoid broken items
- don't overdo it with auras
- forget that blood magic gem even exists
- don't use utility flasks
- play in softcore so you can allow yourself more leeway with passives and gear
- skimp on defense whenever you can, it's fun

So, yeah, again, I agree the game can be piss-easy, but I don't agree many people left because it's easy, if you want challenge it's right there. If there's any reason related to lack of difficulty that made people leave it's this: 'when you make PoE easy, it becomes boring', the game wasn't made to be easy, it has no elements that benefit from lack of difficulty.

"

CharanJaydemyr wrote:

"

Worldbreaker wrote:

"

CharanJaydemyr wrote:

"8. 6 link buffs: Even before they occurred we had a good discussion going in closed beta that 6 linking was far too easy. A 6l was a God tier item, it didn't matter the base, the extra support was such a boost base stats didn't matter. I remember davros having the single 6L sunplate on the server"

...Did you even re-read this after writing it?

Yes, this was right after a wipe. 2 different places in the timeline.

I figured as much, but you still didn't contextualise it very well. It was a clear contradiction.

And while I love playing in Standard, most of the problems you cited are solved by letting go of your godly toys and playing new leagues.

I try, and get godly toys there too.



I'm not lucky, my odds have been right around the community determined averages.

"

raics wrote:

Instead of addressing individual points I'll try to cover the overall sentiment.

I agree you can fully trivialize the game by utilizing many provided tools, but that only goes if you want to. If you don't, it can be pretty challenging, you just need to follow this:
- don't trade unless you need some specific item to try something interesting
- don't group
- don't do MF farming
- avoid broken skill/passive combos
- avoid broken items
- don't overdo it with auras
- forget that blood magic gem even exists
- don't use utility flasks
- play in softcore so you can allow yourself more leeway with passives and gear
- skimp on defense whenever you can, it's fun

So, yeah, again, I agree the game can be piss-easy, but I don't agree many people left because it's easy, if you want challenge it's right there. If there's any reason related to lack of difficulty that made people leave it's this: 'when you make PoE easy, it becomes boring', the game wasn't made to be easy, it has no elements that benefit from lack of difficulty.

I have done a lot of what you suggest to challenge myself. I shouldn't have to create my own challenges, this isn't RPG maker. I still refuse to exploit trade, I do use it on occasion when I have no logical choice. Exchanging currency down/up and buying uniques I need for a build.

The only remaining challenge, to test your skill, your build, awareness and knowledge, that keeps you awake and on your toes, and hard to recognise is also PoE's biggest flaw....

Desync.

Yes if you can buy 1000 fusings all at once in trade chat making 6L is very easy. If you disable trading then all of a sudden a lot of the things you listed become harder.

"

iamstryker wrote:

I find it strange that people have so much sympathy for the people who might get a nerfed unique but no apparent sympathy for the multitude of players that can no longer find uniques that turn legacy.

The 1.1 changeover introduced several new legacies to the game, creating a new class of such players. Do you honestly believe such a thing will never occur again? The truth is, the potential to find items that turn legacy is a very real thing, right now.

"

ScrotieMcB wrote:

"

iamstryker wrote:

I find it strange that people have so much sympathy for the people who might get a nerfed unique but no apparent sympathy for the multitude of players that can no longer find uniques that turn legacy.

The 1.1 changeover introduced several new legacies to the game, creating a new class of such players. Do you honestly believe such a thing will never occur again? The truth is, the potential to find items that turn legacy is a very real thing, right now.

And that's exactly the reason they should have never allowed it, no matter the cost. Even plugging holes in the boat fast won't keep it from going down if new ones keep opening up, you also need to sacrifice some fishing time and bail the water, and if you bail out your favorite hat along with it you cry a little and get a new one, a boat is more important than a hat.

Shit, dunno why I bother, we broke our keyboards over this and it was in vain in the end, the boat left long ago.

"

If you find a single $100 bill, it is a much better feeling than finding a $50 now and $50 later.

No.

If you find a $100 bill you go: "Hey, I found a $100 bill! Now I'm $100 richer. Smiley!"

But if you find $50 now and $50 later you go: "Awesome! What are the odds ... !!?"

Finding $100 is just that. Some poor sucker lost it, you found it. End of story.
But two $50 in a row? That's a day to remember.

"

ScrotieMcB wrote:

"

iamstryker wrote:

I find it strange that people have so much sympathy for the people who might get a nerfed unique but no apparent sympathy for the multitude of players that can no longer find uniques that turn legacy.

The 1.1 changeover introduced several new legacies to the game, creating a new class of such players. Do you honestly believe such a thing will never occur again? The truth is, the potential to find items that turn legacy is a very real thing, right now.

I never said it wasn't, but once they turn legacy what I said is absolutely true. THOSE uniques will never be found again.....players are still allowed to use the thousands that are in the game currently....but no one else can ever find them again. How is that fair exactly?