[1.0.4]Scion - Incinerate Tank - Mind over Matter, EB, almost Max Block | Facetank a lot of stuff
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According to this:
http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Cloak_of_Defiance the cloak already gives you Mind Over Matter so the cloak alone gives you 40%. Taking the keystone with the cloak adds nothing. |
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" Well, damn. The one time I don't look something up! That would make Cloak of Defiance a strong option for running IR + Grace. You get MoM and free up some points that you can put towards IR or more mana reservation nodes (to help run Grace). I don't have time to do the math atm, but it might be worth calculating the damage taken from a 4k/4k Vaal hit using a theoretical Cloak of Defiance + IR + Grace setup vs. the Lightning Coil setup used in the guide. |
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I did some calculations to compare Lightning Coil + MoM vs. Cloak of Defiance + IR + Grace.
I redid the OPs LC math as the OP only uses Arctic Armor 19 and 75% Lightning Resist when it's possible to have AA 20 and 79% resist with Purity of Lightning 20. Also, I think the order of mitigation applied was incorrect with respect to MoM and LC. The wiki suggests Physical Hit -> Lightning Coil -> Resists and Armor -> Arctic Armor -> MoM just before health. (http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Hit_Damage_Calculation)
Cloak of Defiance Passive Skill Tree
Moving to CoD is a pretty big change, so I tweaked the passive tree by doing the following: * Dropped MoM. * Dropped a lot of cast speed based on the new research about the internal cooldown on the stage changes. * Picked up more increased aura passives to further boost Grace. * Picked up an increased Armor passive.
Modified CoD Tree
http://www.poebuilder.com/#character/AAAAAgAAAdwB5wUtCGcRlhZvFy8YPBmFGjIbyBzcHRQelB7fIcMkqijFKPoppS2oL2826DbpQKBDMUWdRnFKyEw1TipPVlFgVcZV1lfhWK9aUl4TYEthIWTnbqpwfXC7dO14DXqqeu9-WX_GgKSCHoLHgwmE749GkNaTJ5M6muCbXZ65n8uio6QZpwiomqluqZWsP6yvsZCzP7QMtfK2QbfWuJO9J76KvrzB88OGz2XQ0NE22RPa3dsL21ncV-Lq42rnkevu8Xbyl_O--WX56PrS Important Passives: +30% Armor +24% Evasion and Armor +46% Aura Effect +3% Buff Efefct
Math of Exile: Massive Hits
Damage value is based on Vaal smash doing 4k physical + 4k fire damage.
Lightning Coil
4000 Fire Resist: 4000 * 0.25 = 1000 AA: 1000 - (189 * 1.03) = 805 MoM: 805 * .7 = 564 Fire damage taken 4000 Physical LC: 4000 * .4 = 1600 Resist: 1600 * .21 = 336 MoM: 336 * .7 = 235 Lightning damage taken Physical Post-LC: 4000 - 1600 = 2400 Armor Reduction: = 1608 / ( 1608 + ( 12 * 2400 ) ) = .053 Armor: 2400 * .947 = 2280 AA: 2273 - (189 * 1.03) = 2078 MoM: 2078 * .7 = 1455 Physical damage taken ----------------- Total Damge: 564 + 235 + 1455 = 2254
Cloak of Defiance + IR + Grace 20
Gear Armor: 500 (Anvil) + 96 (Gloves) = 596 CoD Perfect Evasion Roll: 510 * 1.2 (Quality) = 612 Grace 20 Evasion: 2016 * 1.49 = 3004 CoD + Grace Evasion: 3004 + 612 = 3616 Modified Armor: 596 * 1.54 = 918 Modified Evasion: 3616 * 1.54 = 5569 Total Armor: 5569 + 918 = 6487 ----------------- 4000 Fire Resist: 4000 * 0.25 = 1000 AA: 1000 - (189 * 1.03) = 805 MoM: 805 * .6 = 483 Fire damage taken 4000 Physical Armor Reduction: 6487 / ( 6487 + ( 12 * 4000 ) ) = .119 Armor: 4000 * .881 = 3524 AA: 3524 - (189 * 1.03) = 3329 MoM: 3329 * .6 = 1997 Physical damage taken ----------------- Total Damage: 483 + 1997 = 2480
Cloak of Defiance + Alpha's Howl + IR + Grace 22
Gear Armor: 500 (Anvil) + 96 (Gloves) = 596 CoD Perfect Evasion Roll: 510 * 1.2 (Quality) = 612 AH Perfect Evasion Roll: 642 * 1.2 (Quality) = 770 Grace 22 Evasion: 2166 * 1.49 = 3227 CoD + AH + Grace 22: 612 + 770 + 3227 = 4609 Modified Armor: 596 * 1.54 = 918 Modified Evasion: 4609 * 1.54 = 7098 Total Armor: 7098 + 918 = 8016 ----------------- 4000 Fire Resist: 4000 * 0.25 = 1000 AA: 1000 - (189 * 1.03) = 805 MoM: 805 * .6 = 483 Fire damage taken 4000 Physical Armor Reduction: 8016 / ( 8016 + ( 12 * 4000 ) ) = .143 Armor: 4000 * .857 = 3428 AA: 3428 - (189 * 1.03) = 3233 MoM: 3233 * .6 = 1940 Physical damage taken ----------------- Total Damage: 483 + 1940 = 2423 Massive Damage Taken Lightning Coil: 2254 Cloak of Defiance + IR + Grace 20: 2480 Cloak of Defiance + Alpha's Howl + IR + Grace 22: 2423
Math of Exile: Normal Hits
Damage value is based on a level 77 monster doing 756 damage on average. http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Monster_Damage
Lightning Coil
756 Physical LC: 756 * .4 = 302 Resist: 302 * .21 = 63 MoM: 63 * .7 = 44 Lightning damage taken Physical Post-LC: 756 - 302 = 454 Armor Reduction: = 1608 / ( 1608 + ( 12 * 454 ) ) = .228 Armor: 454 * .772 = 351 AA: 351 - (189 * 1.03) = 156 MoM: 156 * .7 = 109 Physical damage taken ----------------- Total Damage: 44 + 109 = 153
Cloak of Defiance + IR + Grace 20
Total Armor: 6487 756 Physical Armor Reduction: 6487 / ( 6487 + ( 12 * 756 ) ) = .417 Armor: 756 * .583 = 441 AA: 441 - (189 * 1.03) = 246 MoM: 246 * .6 = 148 Physical damage taken ----------------- Total Damage: 148
Cloak of Defiance + Alpha's Howl + IR + Grace 22
Total Armor: 8016 756 Physical Armor Reduction: 8016 / ( 8016 + ( 12 * 756 ) ) = .469 Armor: 756 * .531 = 401 AA: 401 - (189 * 1.03) = 206 MoM: 206 * .6 = 124 Physical damage taken ----------------- Total Damage: 124 Normal Damage Taken Lightning Coil: 153 Cloak of Defiance + IR + Grace 20: 148 Cloak of Defiance + Alpha's Howl + IR + Grace 22: 124 TL;DR Lightning Coil provides the most effective and cheapest means for mitigating massive single hits. It may be worth noting that CoD + Alpha's Howl + Grace 22 only propvide ~2% more mitigation against massive hits compared to just CoD + Grace 20. Cloak of Defiance + IR + Grace is slightly better (~3%) at mitigating normal damage. It takes an Alpha's Howl + Grace 22 to obtain noticeably more potent (~19%) mitigation against normal damage.
Edits
* Added math for normal monster damage. * Pulled the modified CoD skill tree up to a higher level. * Fixed a calculation error in CoD + Grace 20 massive hits. Last edited by xythian#6511 on Nov 27, 2013, 11:38:32 AM
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" Every 6 casts of Incinerate, it ramps up 1 damage stage. It's right there in the wiki: http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Incinerate |
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" The issue isn't the 6 casts per stage, it's the fact that there appears to be a minimum time required before you can transition to the next stage. Just a few posts back there was some research presented that showed no apparent amount of increased cast speed beyond ~30% results in a faster time to stage 3. This would suggest some sort of cooldown on the stage transitions that is independent from the 6 casts. |
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I decided to repeat alt0172's experiments on cast speed vs. Incinerate ramp-up time.
I recorded Incinerate with and without my Faster Casting (34%) and then counted the frames from the start of the Incinerate animation, to the appearence of the stage 1 buff, stage 2 buff, and stage 3 buff. To help measure the results, we can calculate the expected frames per second per stage based on cast speed. Note: I recorded at 60 frames per second.
.16 cast time
1 / .16 = 6.25 casts per sec 6 / 6.25 = .96 sec per stage 60 frames * .96 sec = 58 frames per stage I didn't record this condition, I just did the calculation for the baseline of 58 frames per stage.
.12 cast time
This is my cast time with passives + gear, but not with the Faster Casting support gem. 1 / .12 = 8.33 casts per sec 6 / 8.33 = .72 sec per stage 60 frames * .72 sec = 43 frames per stage Frames 15: Start Incinerate 60: Stage 1 buff 106: Stage 2 buff 154: Stage 3 buff 139 frames or ~46 frames per stage
.09 cast time
This is my cast time with the same passives + gear, but now includes my Faster Casting support gem. 1 / .09 = 11.11 casts per sec 6 / 11.11 = .54 sec per stage 60 frames * .54 sec = 32 frames per stage Frames 18: Start Incinerate 64: Stage 1 buff 111: Stage 2 buff 158: Stage 3 buff 140 frames or ~47 frames per stage Results .12 Cast Time: 46 frames recorded, 43 expected .09 Cast Time: 47 frames recorded, 32 expected This is more evidence to support the theory that there is some weirdness going on with respect to cast time and Incinerate stage increases. But, this weirdness could be a number of things: * An internal cooldown on Incinerate stage changes. * A delay in UI updates that only postpones the stage buff icon, but not Incinerate's damage. * .09 cast time is less than my typical latency. Perhaps there's some client-server protection that delays the stages as the server has to monitor actions that are occuring faster than your latency. * An error in the testing method. 60fps may not be enough to detect the razor thin timing of Incinerate. Last edited by xythian#6511 on Nov 27, 2013, 3:27:40 PM
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I was looking through the Incinerate feedback post and found a direct message from Mark_GGG
http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/233640/page/56#p5039045 " This would lead me to believe that the delay we're seeing is a UI issue and not a damage issue, but I'm going to try and seek clarification. Edit: I posted our results to the Incinerate feedback forum. http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/233640/page/57/#p5700303 Edit 2: I also posted to /r/pathofexile and got some more results. http://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/1rlc19/incinerate_spammers_help_us_test_cast_speed_as_it/ It looks like Incinerate is working as expected, it's just difficult to verify due to how quickly the stage changes can happen when combined with latency, fps, UI updates, etc. Cast Speed vs. Stage 3 Time  Last edited by xythian#6511 on Nov 27, 2013, 3:26:52 PM
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" Anything official on this? Haven't found any comments or anything. |
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My build and gear level 85, able to solo turbo shrine piety with +4 projectiles:
4.5k HP // 1K unreserved mana (~2k reserved). 252mana/152HP regen/sec allows max level AA. Gear
Spoiler
Still trying to replace one of my rings - 'Foe Gyre' with something better. Passives Hot swap saffels in when doing a boss like aforementioned piety or shock and horror etc. "there is no spoone" - The Matricks Last edited by Zeekin#4930 on Nov 28, 2013, 12:34:59 AM
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Id love a HC setup for this. 2.5K hp at nemesis is a nono =P
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