Conduit for minions ?

"

magpye wrote:

Permanent curse and dual curse keystones DO give you something for nothing, as well as the current conduit.

Yeah, mark really had no idea what he was talking about. Even back in sept 2012 when that was posted, we still had dual curse, infinite curse, iron grip, and conduit which all have no downside.

I'm not saying whether they should or shouldn't, but what mark said was flat out wrong, and it's not some single outlier that causes it to be wrong either.

"

Mark_GGG wrote:

Those keystones give you a moderately small something for the moderately small cost of navigating to that area of the tree, which costs multiple passive points for most builds.

Keystone passives don't cost any more points to get to than they would if they were in the same place, but not a keystone passive. 'You need to spend passive points on them' is a 'down-side' that all passives have.

If you want to argue that the 'freestone' passives live up to their keystone status, then there are lots of arguments you could try that might convince someone. But the 'they do have a drawback, honest' argument isn't one of them.

"

Mark_GGG wrote:

"

Xendran wrote:

"

magpye wrote:

Permanent curse and dual curse keystones DO give you something for nothing, as well as the current conduit.

Yeah, mark really had no idea what he was talking about. Even back in sept 2012 when that was posted, we still had dual curse, infinite curse, iron grip, and conduit which all have no downside.

I'm not saying whether they should or shouldn't, but what mark said was flat out wrong, and it's not some single outlier that causes it to be wrong either.

Those keystones give you a moderately small something for the moderately small cost of navigating to that area of the tree, which costs multiple passive points for most builds.

Funnily enough, the only build i've had where iron grip is out of the way is my new CI bow witch that i'm making, but VP is right there as well and CI+ES is so OP that i can afford to just blow those points travelling there.

For a life build the point cost would be a downside. Not so much for ES.

Also, that downside applies to every passive on the tree. Keystones arent meant to be just another passive, right?

Arrow Dodging comes to mind as another "gigantic benefit with no downside" keystone.

"

KoTao wrote:

Arrow Dodging comes to mind as another "gigantic benefit with no downside" keystone.

You mean Ondar's Guile.

I still think that a party-only keystone is anathema to a game that's supposed to be solo-able (even if it's clearly more difficult to do so). I strongly believe Conduit should be changed to benefit minions; if that means adding a drawback, then that means adding a drawback.

sadly this 'good things come with drawbacks' does not apply to soul taker and shavrones and auxium and lioneyes..

also combination of CI and leeching energy shield also seems to not have any drawback at all. will you change that?

I dont see a problem with the game having a single party-only keystone (and a single party-only unique as well atm). If they started becoming the norm instead of very rare exceptions, then there would be a problem.

"

sidtherat wrote:

also combination of CI and leeching energy shield also seems to not have any drawback at all. will you change that?

There are drawbacks of CI - you cant use hp per hit/kill, cant use blood magic, cant use RF.

And i agree, most powerful uniques should have drawbacks.

"

Mark_GGG wrote:

"

magpye wrote:

Permanent curse and dual curse

moderately small something

Mark, do you even play the game?